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Need advice on buffing neck paint

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2wheeldrummer
Posted 2019-02-16 5:27 PM (#547045)
Subject: Need advice on buffing neck paint



Joined:
February 2014
Posts: 470

Location: moline,illinois
Hey guys I hoping to get some advice on buffing paint/eliminating orange peel on a ovation neck.
I have a custom legend 1619 I took to a local shop to have some cosmetic work done on the neck/filling some dings on the neck and chips on the edge of the headstock.The owner of the store and friend? of mine had the guitar for a long time but he closed his store at the end of last year and when I was helping him haul van loads of stuff out on the last night he returned my guitar to me unfinished along with another guitar he did not complete the work on.
The dings chips have all been filled and its painted but theres a lot of orange peel on the finish and the hardware is off so I'm looking for advice on some kind of buffing wheel I could get for a power drill/driver and what kinds of compounds are best for returning the gloss without burning through the finish,I tried polishing it with Meguiars but need something with more bite to it I think.
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DanSavage
Posted 2019-02-17 2:23 PM (#547052 - in reply to #547045)
Subject: Re: Need advice on buffing neck paint



Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 1940

Location: Lake Forest, CA
Orange peel is a sign of a finish that was too light. I would start with 800-grit, then work up to 1500-grit. To polish I use a Ryobi polishing wheel in my electric drill. I use macguire's #9 to get a mirror finish.

You should find out what finish was used and when it was sprayed and how many coats he put on. Evaporative finishes like lacquer or polyurethane produce thinner coats than 2k finishes like Eastwood. Generally, you want the finish to be at least 4-5 mils before you start the sanding/polishing process. I spray pretty heavy coats, so 4-5 mils for me equals about 5-6 wet coats.

If it has enough paint and sprayed less than a month ago, you'll want to let it dry/shrink completely.

In any event, if the finish is too thin, you want to sand lightly then add more.
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2wheeldrummer
Posted 2019-02-17 5:35 PM (#547056 - in reply to #547045)
Subject: Re: Need advice on buffing neck paint



Joined:
February 2014
Posts: 470

Location: moline,illinois
Dan thanks for the reply.He was using spray can black paint not sure the brand and he added more paint in december,he said he burned through the first paint buffing it to hard,I don't know how many coats and hes not available anymore moved to arizona in jan.
I was thinking of getting this kit https://www.amazon.com/Meguiars-G55107-Action-Power-System/dp/B00A4A... looks like everything I'd need in one.
I was going to do a little wet sanding before buffing because i saw a small run by the neck heel but i don't want to get to aggressive i don't have any place to paint.
I have some pics but the file sizes are to large to upload but i can resize if your interested in seeing the neck.




Edited by 2wheeldrummer 2019-02-17 5:38 PM
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Love O Fair
Posted 2019-02-17 8:43 PM (#547057 - in reply to #547045)
Subject: Re: Need advice on buffing neck paint



Joined:
February 2016
Posts: 1077

Location: What week?
@2WD - >>>i can resize if your interested in seeing the neck.<<<

In lieu of starting out with sanding, perhaps a very lightly abrasive rubbing/polishing 'compound' would work to begin with. Either by hand, or lightly with the Meguiar's wheel you linked to above. But that's just me speaking. I don't have anything even close to the experience and expertise of Dan and others on this forum when it comes to finishes on wood, but I do like to follow along and learn. Seeing the photos would be great if you can eventually post them.
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DanSavage
Posted 2019-02-17 11:18 PM (#547058 - in reply to #547056)
Subject: Re: Need advice on buffing neck paint



Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 1940

Location: Lake Forest, CA

2wheeldrummer - 2019-02-17 3:35 PM

Dan thanks for the reply.He was using spray can black paint not sure the brand and he added more paint in december,he said he burned through the first paint buffing it to hard,I don't know how many coats and hes not available anymore moved to arizona in jan.
I was thinking of getting this kit (Amazon link) looks like everything I'd need in one.
I was going to do a little wet sanding before buffing because i saw a small run by the neck heel but i don't want to get to aggressive i don't have any place to paint.
I have some pics but the file sizes are to large to upload but i can resize if your interested in seeing the neck.



If he burned through the finish buffing, then it's pretty thin and may need more finish. Let's assume it doesn't need more paint on it.

That kit would probably work, but it's a little pricey, IMO.

Here's what I use: RYOBI Metal Buffing Kit (7-Piece) It's $10 from Home Depot.

I use Meguiar's Swirl Remover (No.9) to polish. It's $17 from Pep Boys.

Sanding out the run would be a good idea,, but if you think you're going to burn through the finish, I would dry sand it so the wood stays dry. The only real benefit you have wet-sanding over dry-sanding is less sanding dust and the sandpaper doesn't clog as fast.

I would start with 800-grit to minimize any chance of burning through the finish. Then move up to 1200-grit and finish with 1500- to 2000-grit. At that point you should be ready to start polishing.

You can do away with using the rouge (included with the Ryobi kit) and just use the Meguiar's No.9.

 



Edited by DanSavage 2019-02-17 11:19 PM
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DanSavage
Posted 2019-02-17 11:22 PM (#547059 - in reply to #547057)
Subject: Re: Need advice on buffing neck paint



Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 1940

Location: Lake Forest, CA
Love O Fair - 2019-02-17 6:43 PM

@2WD - >>>i can resize if your interested in seeing the neck.<<<

In lieu of starting out with sanding, perhaps a very lightly abrasive rubbing/polishing 'compound' would work to begin with. Either by hand, or lightly with the Meguiar's wheel you linked to above. But that's just me speaking. I don't have anything even close to the experience and expertise of Dan and others on this forum when it comes to finishes on wood, but I do like to follow along and learn. Seeing the photos would be great if you can eventually post them.


Removing the orange peel by polishing, even with slightly abrasive compound will take quite a while.

It's better to start with a finer grade of sandpaper to knock off the high spots so the surface is level. Once it's level, then the polishing compound will have an effect.
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Love O Fair
Posted 2019-02-18 10:43 AM (#547064 - in reply to #547045)
Subject: Re: Need advice on buffing neck paint



Joined:
February 2016
Posts: 1077

Location: What week?
Somewhat off topic (automotive finish).. do you guys remember 3M's pink Fill 'n Glaze? Thin liquid, applied to a hand cloth (as it would stain the finish on contact if squirted directly on it), then rubbed lightly in small areas by hand until it disappears, then a final dust-off wipe and a 20 minute cure time, and you would swear the finish was wet. Zero swirl. It has been off the market for about 20 years, and I still miss it. I'm thinking that Meguiar's #7 is the closest thing to replace it, but wondering if y'all might have an opinion on that comparison if you ever used the 3M stuff back in the day.

Oh, and yes, Dan, in the end I agree on the sanding vs. compound thing. I was hoping to see a photo, thinking the orange peel peaking might not be very high, but it likely is.

Edited by Love O Fair 2019-02-18 10:54 AM
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2wheeldrummer
Posted 2019-02-18 7:47 PM (#547070 - in reply to #547058)
Subject: Re: Need advice on buffing neck paint



Joined:
February 2014
Posts: 470

Location: moline,illinois
DanSavage - 2019-02-17 11:18 PM

2wheeldrummer - 2019-02-17 3:35 PM

Dan thanks for the reply.He was using spray can black paint not sure the brand and he added more paint in december,he said he burned through the first paint buffing it to hard,I don't know how many coats and hes not available anymore moved to arizona in jan.
I was thinking of getting this kit (Amazon link) looks like everything I'd need in one.
I was going to do a little wet sanding before buffing because i saw a small run by the neck heel but i don't want to get to aggressive i don't have any place to paint.
I have some pics but the file sizes are to large to upload but i can resize if your interested in seeing the neck.



If he burned through the finish buffing, then it's pretty thin and may need more finish. Let's assume it doesn't need more paint on it.

That kit would probably work, but it's a little pricey, IMO.

Here's what I use: RYOBI Metal Buffing Kit (7-Piece) It's $10 from Home Depot.

I use Meguiar's Swirl Remover (No.9) to polish. It's $17 from Pep Boys.

Sanding out the run would be a good idea,, but if you think you're going to burn through the finish, I would dry sand it so the wood stays dry. The only real benefit you have wet-sanding over dry-sanding is less sanding dust and the sandpaper doesn't clog as fast.

I would start with 800-grit to minimize any chance of burning through the finish. Then move up to 1200-grit and finish with 1500- to 2000-grit. At that point you should be ready to start polishing.

You can do away with using the rouge (included with the Ryobi kit) and just use the Meguiar's No.9.

 



Dan I like price on the Ryobi kit,the Meguairs one looked cool but I agree on the pricey part,
He didn't sand down to bare wood on the entire I think so I think I just need to careful around the headstock right below it but I think he sprayed most of the neck to get an even coating and color to work with so a little light sanding with fine paper then on to buffing/polishing is my plan
Thanks for the advice
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2wheeldrummer
Posted 2019-02-18 7:50 PM (#547071 - in reply to #547057)
Subject: Re: Need advice on buffing neck paint



Joined:
February 2014
Posts: 470

Location: moline,illinois
Love O Fair - 2019-02-17 8:43 PM

@2WD - >>>i can resize if your interested in seeing the neck.<<<

In lieu of starting out with sanding, perhaps a very lightly abrasive rubbing/polishing 'compound' would work to begin with. Either by hand, or lightly with the Meguiar's wheel you linked to above. But that's just me speaking. I don't have anything even close to the experience and expertise of Dan and others on this forum when it comes to finishes on wood, but I do like to follow along and learn. Seeing the photos would be great if you can eventually post them.


Hers some pics,I tried hand rubbing to start with but I need more bite I think,its not heavy on the orange peel but I want it smooth before I polish I think for best results



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Attachments IMG_1666.JPG (40KB - 0 downloads)
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Love O Fair
Posted 2019-02-18 8:15 PM (#547072 - in reply to #547045)
Subject: Re: Need advice on buffing neck paint



Joined:
February 2016
Posts: 1077

Location: What week?
Yep.. as usual, Dan knows. I agree to an 800 to 1500 progression on grit, then the polishing wheel. How is the wood and grain condition below? Are the dings and fills too ugly to go back to natural wood?
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2wheeldrummer
Posted 2019-02-18 10:05 PM (#547075 - in reply to #547072)
Subject: Re: Need advice on buffing neck paint



Joined:
February 2014
Posts: 470

Location: moline,illinois
Love O Fair - 2019-02-18 8:15 PM

Yep.. as usual, Dan knows. I agree to an 800 to 1500 progression on grit, then the polishing wheel. How is the wood and grain condition below? Are the dings and fills too ugly to go back to natural wood?


Strip the whole neck...No Way to much work and the original neck color was black


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DanSavage
Posted 2019-02-20 7:21 PM (#547099 - in reply to #547075)
Subject: Re: Need advice on buffing neck paint



Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 1940

Location: Lake Forest, CA
2wheeldrummer - 2019-02-18 8:05 PM

Strip the whole neck...No Way to much work and the original neck color was black


Having done that on a couple of guitars, I wholeheartedly agree!
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