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1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...

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DanSavage
Posted 2017-06-09 8:05 AM (#535461 - in reply to #531533)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 1609

Location: Lake Forest, CA
Thanks, Ken.

It's got a few minor flaws, but all in all I'm very pleased with how it turned out.

Yep. Ebony fretboard, not rosewood.
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Love O Fair
Posted 2017-06-09 2:28 PM (#535462 - in reply to #531533)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
February 2016
Posts: 478

Location: Spin axis of a California map
So very beautiful! The silking under that finish is like Mother Nature's virgin snow at sunrise. To whom is this one going?
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moody, p.i.
Posted 2017-06-09 2:49 PM (#535464 - in reply to #531533)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...


Joined:
March 2002
Posts: 15096

Location: SoCal
Beautiful guitar!
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BanjoJ
Posted 2017-06-09 6:32 PM (#535465 - in reply to #531533)
Subject: RE: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
September 2012
Posts: 772

Location: Canberra, Australia
Stunning! Well done Dan.
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DanSavage
Posted 2017-06-09 6:46 PM (#535466 - in reply to #535462)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 1609

Location: Lake Forest, CA
Love O Fair - 2017-06-09 12:28 PM

So very beautiful! The silking under that finish is like Mother Nature's virgin snow at sunrise. To whom is this one going?


Thanks, Paul. Yes, to coin a phrase, 'the silking is strong in this one...'.

This one is going to arumako.
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DanSavage
Posted 2017-06-09 6:47 PM (#535467 - in reply to #531533)
Subject: RE: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 1609

Location: Lake Forest, CA

Thanks, Paul2.

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arumako
Posted 2017-06-10 2:04 AM (#535468 - in reply to #535462)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
October 2012
Posts: 652

Location: Yokohama, Japan
Love O Fair - 2017-06-09 4:28 AM

So very beautiful! The silking under that finish is like Mother Nature's virgin snow at sunrise. To whom is this one going?

Wow...how fortunate and blessed I feel to have a crack at this 1612. She really is a beauty and Dan's meticulous work is the stuff of legend. I did ask Dan to use the same "Rebuild" label that he used for jays 485 (of course, it doesn't appear in any of the pics that he uploaded, Lol); but folks are going to be asking questions when they see this beauty and I definitely want to have a good explanation!

The timing was perfect too; as a nice drop-off and hand-carry has been arranged - which means delivery in about two-weeks - just can't wait to give her a spin!

She'll be called the "Ovation DSR1612-T4 Custom Balladeer", and I just know I'm going to love this guitar. It would be extremely appropriate to quote something that moody, p.i. said on Dan's 1978 1117-4 Rebuild thread and I quote,

"If you are thinking of asking Dan to work on a guitar, know that his work is worth a lot more than he charged me. Pay what he asks. It's worth it."

I'll check back into this thread when I take delivery! Thanks Dan!
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Love O Fair
Posted 2017-06-10 1:33 PM (#535473 - in reply to #531533)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
February 2016
Posts: 478

Location: Spin axis of a California map
Lucky you, Ken. You are fortunate to have this one in your collection! Looking forward to reading your review upon receiving it.
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DanSavage
Posted 2017-06-10 8:54 PM (#535485 - in reply to #535468)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 1609

Location: Lake Forest, CA
arumako - 2017-06-10 12:04 AM

She'll be called the "Ovation DSR1612-T4 Custom Balladeer"
...
I'll check back into this thread when I take delivery! Thanks Dan!


That's quite a mouthful, Ken. Doesn't exactly trip lightly off the tongue. LOL!

Kidding aside, you're very welcome. I'm looking forward to hearing your impressions once you get it in your hands.
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DetlefMichel
Posted 2017-06-16 11:31 AM (#535542 - in reply to #531533)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
May 2011
Posts: 403

Location: Muenster/Germany
It´s time for a 12 string
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arumako
Posted 2017-06-17 10:03 AM (#535558 - in reply to #535542)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
October 2012
Posts: 652

Location: Yokohama, Japan
DetlefMichel - 2017-06-16 1:31 AM

It´s time for a 12 string

Was just casually looking at the post when, Whoa...DetlefMichel you've got Dan's 1619 Rebuild? How cool is that?
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arumako
Posted 2017-07-06 9:56 AM (#535708 - in reply to #535485)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
October 2012
Posts: 652

Location: Yokohama, Japan

DanSavage - 2017-06-10 10:54 AM

Kidding aside, you're very welcome. I'm looking forward to hearing your impressions once you get it in your hands.

Well, I've been wanting to post a follow-up on this thread but have been delayed a bit. My son finished his freshman year in college and returned safely from the States with Dan's rebuilt 1612. Unfortunately, the airlines dropped the guitar from a pretty significant height scratching the case; but more importantly damaging the guitar. The tongue of the fingerboard popped off of the sound board along with a part of the rosette (first time I've had a problem with this particular airline). Fortunately, Dan bubble wrapped the neck and headstock very well, and the adhesive Dan used to secure the fret board to the top was providential (Hysol 0151) and let go. Had it not, the fret board or the sound board would have cracked. Had to get my insurance company involved. Of course, the airlines are saying they don't guarantee fragile baggage like guitars and there's no guarantee I'll get anything out of the claim, but it doesn't hurt to try...

After taking all the pictures needed for the claim, the insurance company gave me a go ahead to begin repairs on the 1612. Fortunately, the repairs were minor, but having a go at fixing the 1612 gave me a deeper appreciation for Dan's art. Of course, you all already know this, but the reconstruction of the 1612 is simply immaculate. To keep costs manageable (and pass the savings on to me), I think Dan used existing parts to the best of his ability. Here's a shot of the 1612-4 with my 1117-4.

1612 & 1117

Although I knew it in my head, I was surprised by the resemblance these two instruments have to each other. Sitka spruce top, ebony fret board (right down to the inlays), walnut bridge, rosette...but then, there are significant differences;

Bowl: 1117 - hand laid, 1612 molded
Neck: 1117 - 5 piece w/ binding & truss rod adjustment @ headstock, 1612 2 piece w/o binding & truss rod adjustment @ sound hole.
Saddle: 1117 - one piece, 1612 6 piece
Bracing: 1117 - VT-11, 1612 K-5
Pre-amp: 1117 - N/A, 1612 volume only (1st generation pre-amp)

A comparison of these two guitars are of great interest to me because my 1117-4 is a '73 vintage with the original sound board while the 1612 is '82, but with a new torrefied top. Check out the silking on both!

silking

I finished my repairs a couple of days ago and re-strung both guitars with brand new Adamas 1818Es; and in just 3 days the 1612 has really opened up. To my great surprise, while maintaining the unmistakable O sound these guitars have completely different voices. Was planning a video comparison, but that's gonna have to wait until the weekend.

Suffice it to say, I am totally blown away by Dan's 1612. It's one of the easiest playing guitars that I have giving just the right resistance. The perfect neck angle allows the action at the 12th fret to be 2.2mm on the 6th string and a whopping 1.6mm on the 1st (I have it set a bit higher)...really tempted to try the 1919Es! The torrefied top really gives this guitar a great voice and the K-5 bracing (as you anticipated Dan) gives it the same kind of dynamic balance as the A-brace. Ovations always sound great through a PA, but I took my torrefied 1612 to a rehearsal, and the moment I strummed one chord...wow, the depth and clarity of this guitar's voice through a PA was something to behold...no exaggeration, everybody stopped what they were doing and jaws were dropping all around the room...

Hope to add a video here eventually; but for now, I'm in torrefication paradise. Thanks for the beautiful quality work Dan! I could not be more pleased! Arigato Gozaimasu!



Edited by arumako 2017-07-06 10:19 AM
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DanSavage
Posted 2017-07-06 10:37 PM (#535715 - in reply to #531533)
Subject: RE: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 1609

Location: Lake Forest, CA

Wow! What an epic story, Ken.

I'm so very glad to see that the guitar made it despite the mishandling by the airline. (United Breaks Guitars)

I'm also very glad that you were able to repair to a playable state again.

It should provide you with many years of enjoyment.

Dan

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DetlefMichel
Posted 2017-07-10 12:52 PM (#535735 - in reply to #535558)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
May 2011
Posts: 403

Location: Muenster/Germany
arumako - 2017-06-17 5:03 PM

DetlefMichel - 2017-06-16 1:31 AM

It´s time for a 12 string

Was just casually looking at the post when, Whoa...DetlefMichel you've got Dan's 1619 Rebuild? How cool is that?


Oh that´s a very cool Ovation, but what I got was a re-build of the re-build. The new glossy surface was somewhat imperfect (I could not see it on the pictures here)and was replaced by a kind of matt oil ? finish. Looks nice to me and the haptics is very good. Thus the top is even thinner than before, because all the coatings were grinded off. And as far as I understood the frets were replaced by smaller ones, more like the old from the 70´s, and the typical fretboard extension was straightened so that we have a complete straight neck until the last fret. (That was not a good idea, because the strings have not the same place to move, especially the E and A string.I would have kept a slight angle). And someone tried to apply a matt finish to the rosette (I guess nitro laquer), being not aware the the laquer would destroy the plastic. Good idea? The matt look of the guitar was nice, but the tarnished and eroded rosette looked a little sad to me, I removed the laquer, plained and polished the rosette, looks better now. And I removed the incredibly ugly looking monkey-****-brown laquer coating of the carved bridge. It´s a beautiful piece of wood again now. And I made a new brass nut for more sustain.
Besides all these little problems the guitar now is phantastic, the bearclaw of the spruce top is stunning. The thin top allows to play with my favourite low-tension Thomastik strings without any loss of power, the guitar has the old 70´s neck profile which I like most and sounds very impressive, not so much Bass like an A-braced one, but lots of dynamics! If you start soft and continue to play louder it feels like a turbo-charger, it´s a "fast", "agressive" guitar, the most "rocky" Ovation I have.
I can make some pics, if the sun may occur again in this bad wheather.

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arumako
Posted 2017-07-10 5:42 PM (#535737 - in reply to #535735)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
October 2012
Posts: 652

Location: Yokohama, Japan
DetlefMichel - 2017-07-10 2:52 AM

I can make some pics, if the sun may occur again in this bad wheather.

Thanks for responding! That is a really cool guitar. I guess you could say, it has a lot of unique history! How does it compare to your 1619-1? And, Yes! Pics please!

...and @Dan that video is hilarious, but so professionally done that the humor gives me a reality check...I've never had a hand carried guitar damaged before; and "in Japan" the mail couriers are so courteous, and (almost) never break anything...when they do, they immediately will follow through with any claim that might arise...kinda gives me an appreciation of why imported guitars are so expensive in Japan! Customs and Insurance!

And alas, Photobucket has changed their free "linking" policy. One needs to subscribe to "Unlimited linking and 3rd Party Hosting" to be able to share pics on other websites. The links to my pics are dead in all of my previous threads...afraid I'm gonna have to leave it at that...oh well. Need to find an alternative! Any suggestions?

Edited by arumako 2017-07-10 5:44 PM
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Old Man Arthur
Posted 2017-07-10 8:14 PM (#535739 - in reply to #535737)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 9989

Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR
arumako - 2017-07-10 3:42 PM

And alas, Photobucket has changed their free "linking" policy. One needs to subscribe to "Unlimited linking and 3rd Party Hosting" to be able to share pics on other websites. The links to my pics are dead in all of my previous threads...afraid I'm gonna have to leave it at that...oh well. Need to find an alternative! Any suggestions?

Yeah... Photobucket is just going to be Greedy, cuz I ain't paying.
Photobucket says that I can still download my photos back to my computer, or keep them stored at PB.
A solution is to edit the size on PB and then download the image back onto your computer.
The use the "[] Attach a file after posting". You just need to shrink the photo down to about 600 wide so that it doesn't come out LIFESIZE on the OFC page.
You can also put photos onto FarceBook and them link them using the "copy image location" right click thingy

I just did that here... I hope this helps.
Always PREVIEW before you post to find out if your photo is going to be HUUUGE.

Sorry if I hijacked your post, Dan.
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DanSavage
Posted 2017-07-10 10:33 PM (#535741 - in reply to #535735)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 1609

Location: Lake Forest, CA
DetlefMichel - 2017-07-10 10:52 AM

Oh that´s a very cool Ovation, but what I got was a re-build of the re-build. The new glossy surface was somewhat imperfect (I could not see it on the pictures here)and was replaced by a kind of matt oil ? finish. Looks nice to me and the haptics is very good. Thus the top is even thinner than before, because all the coatings were grinded off. And as far as I understood the frets were replaced by smaller ones, more like the old from the 70´s, and the typical fretboard extension was straightened so that we have a complete straight neck until the last fret. (That was not a good idea, because the strings have not the same place to move, especially the E and A string.I would have kept a slight angle). And someone tried to apply a matt finish to the rosette (I guess nitro laquer), being not aware the the laquer would destroy the plastic. Good idea? The matt look of the guitar was nice, but the tarnished and eroded rosette looked a little sad to me, I removed the laquer, plained and polished the rosette, looks better now. And I removed the incredibly ugly looking monkey-****-brown laquer coating of the carved bridge. It´s a beautiful piece of wood again now. And I made a new brass nut for more sustain.


Yes, the 1619 has an interesting history.

It was originally an engineering model sent to Rickard. The braces were hand-made. Because of the fairly crude nature of their construction, I'm led to believe this was one of the original A-brace Ovations. I've still got the original top.

The production A-brace reinforcements were originally molded fiberglass, (1619) then became perforated aluminum. On this guitar the reinforcements were simple lap-joint strips of spruce. The fan-braces were cut out of spruce, similarly to what I do now. The difference is that on this guitar they were simple butt joints. On all later A-brace guitars the main cross-brace was notched. If you go back and look at the rebuild thread you can see what I mean.

IMO, trying to make the fretboard extension straight so it lined up with the neck was a waste of time. That wasn't me, but was done for the guy who bought the guitar from me.

Yes, the plastic on the rosette is extremely sensitive to any type of solvent, probably because it's made from styrene instead of more durable types of polymers. The dulling of the gloss finish probably happened when the new owner's luthier stripped off the Randolph dope finish I applied. The finish I applied to this guitar was an experiment. If you go back to my 1619 thread, you can read the details of what I was attempting to accomplish. After this guitar I swore off lacquer decided to stick with polyurethanes.

Sorry about the monkey **** brown lacquer on the bridge. (actually Randolph aviation dope finish tinted with dry artist pigment) That was me. (doh!) That was my attempt to deepen the color of the walnut. Had I known to use Old English Oil, as I do now, it would have looked better than it did.

In any event, I'm glad that after all this that the guitar is still a great sounding instrument and is in the hands of someone who appreciates it. :D
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DetlefMichel
Posted 2017-07-11 3:53 AM (#535742 - in reply to #535741)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
May 2011
Posts: 403

Location: Muenster/Germany
Hi Dan, don´t get me wrong, I HIGHLY appreciate this guitar. And I´m PROUD to own a DS Ovation.(Hello Arumako!) I followed the making of it like a serialized novel and I NEVER would have thought about being her owner one day.
Recently I treated her with new gold schallers, with slightly shorter axles for better string pressure on the nut and a finer 1:18 ratio. And a luthier-made custom armrest. It IS a one-off guitar.
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arumako
Posted 2017-07-11 7:33 AM (#535744 - in reply to #535741)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
October 2012
Posts: 652

Location: Yokohama, Japan
@OMA - Thanks for always being so helpful. Might need to work from FB...I wonder if Google photo is worth a try? Maybe I'd better start a different thread for this...

DetlefMichel - 2017-07-10 5:53 PM
I HIGHLY appreciate this guitar. And I´m PROUD to own a DS Ovation. (Hello Arumako!) I followed the making of it like a serialized novel and I NEVER would have thought about being her owner one day.
Recently I treated her with new gold schallers, with slightly shorter axles for better string pressure on the nut and a finer 1:18 ratio. And a luthier-made custom armrest. It IS a one-off guitar.

I know what you mean DelefMichel. I follow all of Dan's threads and learn so much from him; and I too, am a very proud owner of a DS Rebuilt O. They really are special. The torrefied top and bracing on my 1612 really give her a clarity of voice and depth that's nothing short of stunning! Yours is the only DSRO in Europe! Mine...the only one in Asia (at least for now!). You live in Muenster too! That's also very cool cuz one of my students lives there now! WASW!

DanSavage - 2017-07-10 12:33 PM
Had I known to use Old English Oil, as I do now, it would have looked better than it did.

Hi Dan...so does that mean this 1612's bridge was also treated with Old English?

Edited by arumako 2017-07-11 7:41 AM
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arumako
Posted 2017-07-11 7:56 AM (#535745 - in reply to #531533)
Subject: RE: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
October 2012
Posts: 652

Location: Yokohama, Japan

Okay, well this is not totally unrelated...so here's a shot using Google photo (same photos shared previously)...
The DSR1612-T4 and 1117-4...

1612 & 1117

and check out the silking on these.

Silking

Well, Google Photo seems to work...sheesh, Google is gonna own the world pretty soon!



Edited by arumako 2017-07-11 7:58 AM
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DanSavage
Posted 2017-07-11 8:25 AM (#535746 - in reply to #535737)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 1609

Location: Lake Forest, CA
arumako - 2017-07-10 3:42 PM

...and @Dan that video is hilarious, but so professionally done that the humor gives me a reality check...I've never had a hand carried guitar damaged before; and "in Japan" the mail couriers are so courteous, and (almost) never break anything...when they do, they immediately will follow through with any claim that might arise...kinda gives me an appreciation of why imported guitars are so expensive in Japan! Customs and Insurance!

And alas, Photobucket has changed their free "linking" policy. One needs to subscribe to "Unlimited linking and 3rd Party Hosting" to be able to share pics on other websites. The links to my pics are dead in all of my previous threads...afraid I'm gonna have to leave it at that...oh well. Need to find an alternative! Any suggestions?


Yes, in retrospect I am sorry I didn't just ship it. My worry was the rosewood insert I put into the slot of the bridge. The last thing I wanted to have happen was to have the guitar confiscated under CITES rules.

I have my own online storage (GoDaddy) that I use to serve up images.
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DanSavage
Posted 2017-07-11 8:28 AM (#535747 - in reply to #535744)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 1609

Location: Lake Forest, CA
arumako - 2017-07-11 5:33 AM
Hi Dan...so does that mean this 1612's bridge was also treated with Old English?


Yes. And the fretboard, too. I wipe it on, let it sit for a few minutes so the wood can soak up the oil, then wipe off the excess.
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DanSavage
Posted 2017-07-11 8:30 AM (#535748 - in reply to #535742)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 1609

Location: Lake Forest, CA
DetlefMichel - 2017-07-11 1:53 AM

Hi Dan, don´t get me wrong, I HIGHLY appreciate this guitar. And I´m PROUD to own a DS Ovation.(Hello Arumako!) I followed the making of it like a serialized novel and I NEVER would have thought about being her owner one day.
Recently I treated her with new gold schallers, with slightly shorter axles for better string pressure on the nut and a finer 1:18 ratio. And a luthier-made custom armrest. It IS a one-off guitar.


I know how much you are enjoying the guitar and will for many years to come.
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arumako
Posted 2017-07-11 9:16 AM (#535749 - in reply to #535746)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
October 2012
Posts: 652

Location: Yokohama, Japan
DanSavage - 2017-07-10 10:25 PM
Yes, in retrospect I am sorry I didn't just ship it. My worry was the rosewood insert I put into the slot of the bridge. The last thing I wanted to have happen was to have the guitar confiscated under CITES rules.

I have my own online storage (GoDaddy) that I use to serve up images.

Thanks for the GoDaddy tip, Dan. I was just contemplating a web hosting site for my workplace. GoDaddy looks really affordable and user friendly! Cool.

With regard to the CITES thing... I really think in the final analysis, a hand carry was better than shipping. I've heard that customs over here is having a field day with CITES category imports. Guitar shipments are especially under heavy scrutiny. A confiscation could have been a very real threat. Even with the hand-carry, it would not have taken that much for customs to get suspicious, and hold the guitar over night for inspection. Just glad the 1612 is in good shape again. She really is killer...can't wait to share a video...

When re-installing and adhering the neck, I got a good look at the rosewood insert that you put in the bridge slot. Just a very clean job with a perfect finish. Got a kick out of your explanation to DetlefMichel about the history of the bearclaw 1619. Never would have figured that my Master's judgement could ever be in error! LOL!

Edited by arumako 2017-07-11 9:17 AM
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DanSavage
Posted 2017-07-11 2:29 PM (#535750 - in reply to #535749)
Subject: Re: 1982 1612-4 Custom Balladeer...



Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 1609

Location: Lake Forest, CA
I've always had good luck shipping stuff to Japan. I've probably shipped 5-10 model airplane kits to Japan and every one arrived in good condition.

But, if you ship a guitar that has CITES banned wood without an export number (hard to get) the receiving country's customs will usually confiscate the guitar and destroy it. :0

Until recently, the only rosewood on the CITES list was Brazilian. This changed and now all species of rosewood are under CITES control.

There's a loophole in the CITES export rules that says if you buy a guitar in the USA and carry it out, it's assumed that you're not an exporter, so you're allowed to take CITES banned wood out of the country.

That's why I told your son that if anyone (customs) asks, his dad (you) bought it for him as a gift and he was just taking it home to Japan.

Thanks for the kind words.
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