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APHEX aural exciter

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dobro
Posted 2007-12-15 8:14 PM (#70363 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter



Joined:
January 2006
Posts: 2120

Location: Chicago
Thanks, Vic.

I think you misunderstand. Here's how I read:

dobro: I think I need an APHEX

Paul T: [you just bought an Adamas etc. and an Bose L1] You do not need to buy anything else.

dobro: I guess you are right [judging from the sound of the Adamas--click on "adamas" in my signature]

In other words, I do not intend to perform with my AKG C 3000 G, just talking about the "raw" sound. Could it use some help, perhaps in a live situation?

So Vic, what do you think? Live of course we use the Bose and a little reverb.....
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FlicKreno aka Solid Top
Posted 2007-12-16 6:32 PM (#70364 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
April 2006
Posts: 2491

Location: Copenhagen Denmark
Well, Gregg, I had to talk to a friend o` mine who`s got the L1, and he swears by using the T1, a little mixer, build for the L1, and indeed, it makes a BIG difference, using it in conjunction with the L1, it can do Anything ( short of making coffee ) , it can increase " direct sound " opposed to " diffused sound " ( what the set-up was designed for ) , and enables ya to blend " direct " with " diffused " sound, has a host of other (usefull) features, ..hollowness ?..as much as you want..reverb ? .., knock yerself out, and, upgrades are downloadable, most of all, it works well..!!.., funny thing tho`, he`s got two B1`s ( woofers ), it gives more " body " to his acoustic, but if you have all that, than you know all this allready, and if you do n`t, then ya` know what to ask Santa for :) ,...at any rate, ..Goodbye APHEX....but perhaps ya` could say hello to an AKG C535EB.. ;)

Vic

..personally I deem any woofer less than 15" a waiste of money...
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Paul Templeman
Posted 2007-12-17 7:11 AM (#70365 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 5750

Location: Scotland
Originally posted by Solid Top aka Enfant Terrible:
Well, Gregg, I had to talk to a friend o` mine who`s got the L1, and he swears by using the T1, a little mixer, build for the L1, and indeed, it makes a BIG difference, using it in conjunction with the L1, it can do Anything ( short of making coffee ) , it can increase " direct sound " opposed to " diffused sound
The Bose T1 tonematch was designed specifically for the L1 model 2 but is compatible with the model 1. I saw one demonstrated on the Bose booth at Frankfurt and ordered one immediately. It's a very powerful digital mixer/effects processor which expands the number of available channels, allows aditional EQ possibilites (including numerous new Bose presets) and provision to use extra effects including reverbs, compressors etc.

However what it does not do, in any way whatsoever is affect the sound dispersal characteristics of the L1.


Bose T1
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NostrAdamas
Posted 2007-12-17 1:23 PM (#70366 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
October 2004
Posts: 256

Location: chicago
Well I think we should put the T1 to the test,45 days money back if not satisfied we cant go wrong!Does it have a direct line out for recording right from the L-1 to mixer for live situations?
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NostrAdamas
Posted 2007-12-17 1:28 PM (#70367 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
October 2004
Posts: 256

Location: chicago
Hey Greg.....with my new screen name the quatrains prediction is a 1518-5 in my future!!! Burns
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lanaki
Posted 2007-12-17 1:52 PM (#70368 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
October 2006
Posts: 5575

Location: big island
the real nostradamus would have gotten the model # right! :D
great screen name jeff!
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NostrAdamas
Posted 2007-12-17 2:02 PM (#70369 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
October 2004
Posts: 256

Location: chicago
Or would he? didnt he call Hitler, Hister?So close! Jeff
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Paul Templeman
Posted 2007-12-17 2:32 PM (#70370 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 5750

Location: Scotland
Originally posted by jeff burns:
Does it have a direct line out for recording right from the L-1 to mixer for live situations?
There is a digital out which links directly to the model 2 power stand, plus 2 identical mono analog outs. One could go to the L1, the other to recording gear.
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FlicKreno aka Solid Top
Posted 2007-12-17 4:16 PM (#70371 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
April 2006
Posts: 2491

Location: Copenhagen Denmark
P T : However what it does not do, in any way whatsoever is affect the sound dispersal characteristics of the L1.

Actually, it works like this,...the speakers of the L1 are to the sides , slightly slanted forward, by loading the speakers with equal volume without phase-shift , the sound will come as it were, from in between speakers, causing a " direct" sound, my mate says he can adjust that on his T1, no clue as to what settings to use , in order to achieve that, guess ya just have to fiddle about with it.

Vic

..18" loaded bass bins on either side with an Opera 415 on top is more to my liking..
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Paul Templeman
Posted 2007-12-17 6:48 PM (#70372 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 5750

Location: Scotland
How do you vary the phase between speakers in a monaural system?

I don't "fiddle about" with sophisticated equipment, I read the manual cover to cover until I understand how to use it. There is no mention of this "Speaker phase-shift" function anywhere in my T1 owners manual. Nor can I find any parameters in any menu on the T1 that could possibly create the effect you describe. Maybe your friend has a "special" version and could enlighten us.
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moody, p.i.
Posted 2007-12-17 6:53 PM (#70373 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
March 2002
Posts: 15651

Location: SoCal
I read the manual cover to cover until I understand how to use it.



And you call yourself a man????
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lanaki
Posted 2007-12-17 7:01 PM (#70374 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
October 2006
Posts: 5575

Location: big island
i think he was given that name at birth, moody.
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moody, p.i.
Posted 2007-12-17 7:09 PM (#70375 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
March 2002
Posts: 15651

Location: SoCal
I guess there's a reason we just call him "Temp"...
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dobro
Posted 2007-12-17 7:13 PM (#70376 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter



Joined:
January 2006
Posts: 2120

Location: Chicago
Great new handle, there, Burnsey. Good news about your plan to buy an Adamas! You should also check out the 2008 collector's model (see the short thread above): it's like the 1581-5 only with a few extra bells and whistles!
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FlicKreno aka Solid Top
Posted 2007-12-17 8:05 PM (#70377 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
April 2006
Posts: 2491

Location: Copenhagen Denmark
P T : How do you vary the phase between speakers in a monaural system?

Ah okay, basically, all them guitar-FX are based on phase-shifts and distortion, having two ( or more ) speakers pointing at different directions will sound as one speaker, albeit spread the treble more, it will not induce however, any of the sound one experiences as with stereo reproduction, that would need applying phase-shift of different magnitude, depending on freq., which seem to be incorporated in the L1-T1, it might be that BOSE has applied two or more power-amps., (likely), in todays world, power chips up to a moderate power are reasonably cheap, however, since I have n`t taken apart an L1, I can n`t answer your question properly, and might even fall outside the range of this board, but there are sites that deal with audio, but mind you, the explanation can be a lengthy one, but basically put, all audio equipment is based on phase-coherence AND phase-deterence...( and video-signal too ) :)

Vic

..could we agree that it would be a Good idea for Gregg to get the T1 if he has n`t one allready.. :)
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Paul Templeman
Posted 2007-12-18 4:59 AM (#70378 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 5750

Location: Scotland
The T1 is a wonderful digital mixer which addresses the (very few) shortcomings of the L1 model 1. Unless I have missed something blatently obvious, I can assure you as someone who not only owns this equipment and uses it constantly, but also fully understands the principles of phase-coherance in audio systems, that the T1 does not perform the functions claimed by your friend.

FYI, the L1 contains 3 mono power amplifiers. 1 for the bass module and 1 each for the upper and lower halves of the cylindrical array.
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schroeder
Posted 2007-12-18 3:13 PM (#70379 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
November 2004
Posts: 4413

Temp - what would be the equivalent power/volume in terms of a pair of say Mackies compared to the Bose? Reading the Bose website they seem to suggest that because their sound projection method is so diffferent that comparisons shouldn't be made on pure horsepower. Is this right? I guess what I'm saying is are they worth the UK price? (And I remember you got a deal.)
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dobro
Posted 2007-12-18 3:26 PM (#70380 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter



Joined:
January 2006
Posts: 2120

Location: Chicago
Chiming in here: Jeff an I got an L1 on the bay for 1300 US. I don't have PT's grasp of anything, but as an impression: the L1 is like a sonic smoke bomb. It fills the room evenly. You do not sense that the sound is being piped from one or two sources. It is so powerful that we never come close to max. The closest we got to challenging it was at a fundraiser in a very large hall packed with people... Still it sounded great. I can especially recommend the clarity and "zing" it imparts to the acoustic guitar (well, specifically an Ovation/Adamas). You get sort of an idea from our "Tamboura" clip on the Tube. That was filmed in an intimate jazz joint in a nearby suburb. We were on the Bose.
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Paul Templeman
Posted 2007-12-18 3:28 PM (#70381 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 5750

Location: Scotland
I got rid of my Mackie rig (2xSRM450 plus an SWA sub) as soon as I got the L1. It's rated at something approaching a kilowatt RMS, but it's operation is so radically different to conventional speakers that watt-for-watt comparisons are meaningless. I got mine direct from Bose Europe on a ridiculous deal, but if I'd had to pay full price I would have. I hate having to use a regular PA after a couple of years with the Bose. They are worth every penny.

But, for rock band applications you really nead 1 for each member of the band and that starts to get expensive. My current band has 2 L1's with 4 subs. Line-up is 3 vocals, 2 or 3 acoustic instruments plus cajon and perc. We can get away with half that set-up in most places.

"Sonic Smoke-bomb" Yeah, that nails it.
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an4340
Posted 2007-12-18 4:04 PM (#70382 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
May 2003
Posts: 4389

Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands
And if you play out of tune, no matter what you play thru, it's still a sonic stink bomb.
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Mr. Ovation
Posted 2007-12-18 4:11 PM (#70383 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
December 2001
Posts: 7209

Location: The Great Pacific Northwest
I reviewed the L1 under possibly the worst conditions possible... at the NAMM show. I was blown away. And it wasn't from sales guy selling the L1, but from our very own Paul Templeman who didn't even know I was listening most likely.

He was doing a demo of the G-Band capo and using the L1. In a sea of noise, and bad acoustics, it sounded great and cut through with a very NATURAL tone. From anywhere but right in front of him, it just sounded like he was playing a fairly loud acoustic guitar. Of course once you got close to where you were hearing just the playing you could detect the pleasant reverb and such, but after that experience I did some checking and other listenings.. The comment as people approached of "that's a really loud guitar for an acoustic" was heard more than once before they realized it was plugged in. It sounded THAT good.

I think the Bose L1 is one of the best matchups to an Ovation I have heard and I think it's ability to "fill" an area causes it to surpass the Trace Elliott as "the amp" for an Ovation.

JMHO
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cliff
Posted 2007-12-18 4:18 PM (#70384 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
March 2002
Posts: 14842

Location: NJ
I'm still "on the fence" with these . . .

I have YET to hear one in use that's "sold" me.

That being said, I do have a local colleague who's offered to loan me hers for one of my upcoming solo gigs which may allow me to at least "sniff" the Kool-Aid . . .
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Paul Templeman
Posted 2007-12-18 5:41 PM (#70385 - in reply to #70338)
Subject: Re: APHEX aural exciter


Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 5750

Location: Scotland
Originally posted by Mr. Ovation:
I reviewed the L1 under possibly the worst conditions possible... at the NAMM show. I was blown away. And it wasn't from sales guy selling the L1, but from our very own Paul Templeman who didn't even know I was listening most likely.

He was doing a demo of the G-Band capo and using the L1. In a sea of noise, and bad acoustics, it sounded great and cut through with a very NATURAL tone.
That's how I ended up getting the deal from Bose. The L1 was hidden behind a G-band banner, so it couldn't be seen from the show floor. A guy came up to me and said, "your guitar sounds amazing what are you playing through?" (I was playing Michael Wong's "Book" Viper, via his L1 and Boss AD5)Turns out the guy was a head-honcho from Bose, who put me in touch with the guys at Bose Europe. Classic case of "right-place, right-time"
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