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January 2008
Posts: 12
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Hello One and All!! And a truly Happy New Year!!!
My new year is going to start with doing some old guitar projects that have been waiting in the wings. The one I want to start is an early ('68-'69 B series serial #) Balladeer. She has a sunken top that I believe needs to be removed ass well as re-gluing the braces.
Problem is I've never removed the top from an Ovation before. Can someone give me some advice? I'm an amateur luthier but I have no fear of the big projects.
Thanks in advance!! |
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November 2003
Posts: 11039
Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | I have an article from a Luthier magazine describing the process. If you are interested I can send you a copy- or I can scan it and email it to you.... |
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January 2008
Posts: 12
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | I'd love to see it!!! Thanks! |
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March 2007
Posts: 665
Location: Tychy, Poland | Hi.
My luthier removed the top in my Legend, and he cut it off under that "white" line.
Top in this legend, after first stage of "leveling" looked like this:
Old bracing was holding, it didn't unglue but it was really resistant, so it was not possible to straighten the top without adding additional brace, so he did:
After repair, guitar needed about a week to open up a bit, and now, after 6 months it sounds really good.
It's not that boomy and bass isn't that huge as it was on the beginning, but it's now well-balanced and plays very well. |
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Posts: 12
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Ow!!! That seems a bit invasive. Is this the recommended method? |
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March 2007
Posts: 665
Location: Tychy, Poland | in this case, i don't think any other method would work.
guitar is from '79.
when i got it, it had top sunken over 1cm in the middle.
top was broken on the treble side in few places
neck was broken on headstock joint (but not detached) , there was a big bump on 15th and 16th fret etc.
Additional braces were added because my luthier didn't had other choice. each time after straightening, top was sunking and in 2 days it was back to it's original (sunken) position.
As i've said before. it sounds good. it plays good. he did his job and i'm happy. |
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November 2007
Posts: 152
Location: Maple Shade, NJ. | Hi LBJ.
Could you give us an idea of what something like that costs? |
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March 2007
Posts: 665
Location: Tychy, Poland | I've paid about $250 for it (in Poland), but most guys here who live in US just send their guitars to factory for top replacement.
Since shipping guitar to and from US would cost from Poland about $250-$300 and guitar wasn't worth much more on american market, it was worth a try.
i'll try to borrow some good microphone and record a few mp3's of my O, because plugged in it just sounds about the same to any other Legend i've heard. |
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November 2003
Posts: 11039
Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | Article is on the way, John. |
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July 2003
Posts: 3111
Location: Nashville TN. | Something that old I'd send it back to New Hartford.
They might be able to repair it without removing the top. |
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November 2002
Posts: 3603
Location: Pacific Northwest Inland Empire | If you can, John H., post a couple of photos. There are a few of us here, nominally the BottomFeeders Luthiery Guild/ League of Gentlemen, that may offer some advice or recommendations. The MotherShip will probably relace the top & bowl, as a unit, leaving only the neck as original to the instrument. I have raised some tops back to original configuration. Kinda tricky, but it is possible. Bowl-bends & neck re-sets. Saving an alphabet-numbered Balladeer's top would be a righteous outcome! |
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January 2008
Posts: 12
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Hi seesquare! I'm unsure of how to post pics in this forum. Or even if I can. I'm a newbie at this so some instruction is required.
Cheers
I'd be honoured to have some input from the "League" |
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March 2007
Posts: 665
Location: Tychy, Poland | you have to upload them somewhere, or if you don't know how to do it, You can send it to me and i'll host them.
dorian[ at ] rochowski.org |
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Joined:
January 2008
Posts: 12
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Thanks for the offer. I don't have a domain so if you wouldn't mind.... I'll go take some pics and send them to you. Is there a size restriction? |
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March 2007
Posts: 665
Location: Tychy, Poland | no, i have unlimited account. |
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January 2008
Posts: 12
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Photo's are on their way. Thanks again! |
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January 2008
Posts: 12
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Thought I'd also add that the bracing is different than anything I've seen except the German patent application from 1968 (found on Jerome's Ovation Tribute page). I have pics of the bracing if anyone is interested. |
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March 2007
Posts: 665
Location: Tychy, Poland | Here are John's pics:
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Joined:
March 2007
Posts: 665
Location: Tychy, Poland | and one more:
From what i see, it's not that bad. top on my legend sunken so badly, that top of the bridge was at about the same level as bowl edges. |
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November 2005
Posts: 1126
Location: Omaha, NE | FWIW: You can host pictures at PhotoBucket for free.
These discussions of top and bowl replacement make me wonder...why? I've raised this point before, but here goes again: On an Ovation, what is the guitar?
Seems to me that if you remove the top and the bowl and just preserve the neck, all you've done is graft a used neck onto a new guitar. What exactly is the point of that?
And (sacrilege warning) I don't see how there is anything special about one bowl vs another*: A bowl is a bowl.
In my view, its all about the top. If you really like the way a particular Ovation sounds, what that means is that you really like that particular top. You can't "replace" the top on an Ovation: The top is the Ovation. If you replace it, you've created a new guitar.
Ok, and Happy New Year and all that. Sorry to be such a grouch in my first post of the year.
* Allowing that the different types and styles have different sounds...I mean that its not like we are going to tap-tone bowls withing a given style to hand match one to the top. |
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Joined:
January 2008
Posts: 12
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Hi Jeff
My intention is to restore this guitar to as "original" as possible condition. That includes keeping all the parts that are there. If I have to separate this top from the bowl, you can rest assured it will be going back on the same bowl. I agree that once you start scabbing parts together you no longer have what you started with. A new guitar isn't what I'm after. If it was, I'd have bought a new one. I love vintage! I live for vintage! |
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May 2002
Posts: 1445
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | "honoured"
Hi John;
Welcome to the site...it's nice to have someone who can actually spell around here! ;)
What part of NS are you from? I too, am a bit of a vintage nut. |
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January 2008
Posts: 12
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Hi Wayne
Glad you noticed :)
I live in the HRM (Halifax Regional Municipality). Are you in Nova Scotia as well? |
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August 2007
Posts: 1008
Location: Tuscany, Italy | Hi, fortunately I never had such a problem, by now. Is there any particular reason/s for that to happen ?
Few days ago I was in a shop in Bologna (central Italy) that have on stock a buch of Os. I tried some but my attention was for a '79 legend 1617 (I like vintage as well). The guitar looks pretty nice but the sound was really dull (terrible). At a preliminary visual control it looked like the John H. Balladeer.
It was listed 800 euro (about 1160$)... CRAZY !
Riccardo |
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Joined:
March 2007
Posts: 665
Location: Tychy, Poland | i've noticed that "sinking top" is domain of A-braced Ovations. I think that this bracing was great sound-wise, but it didn't hold top strong enough so it started sinking. I don't know if it's related to humidity or no, but recently i've seen a 1717 Balladeer from '81 which had simillary sunken top as John's (about the same level) and owner was trying to get rid of this guitar at low price because it was progressing rapidly. |
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Ovation Top Removal
