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January 2013
Posts: 12
Location: Netherlands | Hello everybody,
I just got myself a "1973-1975" Viper. I saw it on our local Ebay in Holland and fell in love with it. Sadly the bridge pickup was swapped for a Bill Lawrence HB (which actually sounds great on the guitar) by a former owner. The good thing about it is that he's in good condition for his age. Fretwear etc is minimal. It was set up terrible with a bowed neck and buzzing frets. After some trussrod and bridge adjustments it played fantastic. BUT, there are two things that I can't seem to solve:
1. The G and D string are to low compared to the other strings, which results in a very high action (E 3,4 mm and e 2,7 mm on 12th fret) if you don't want the strings buzzing on the frets. Is this normal? And is there a way to adjust this?
2. The note on the higher frets have a lack of sustain. I tried lowering the pickups and raising the action, but nothing seems to work. The tone is perfect, but after sustaining for about 3 seconds it dies within a second. Very strange. Especially the e and B-string suffer from this. The other strings seem to be good. I don't see anything strange on the neck. Maybe something to do with the bridge? I'm not familiair with these guitars what so ever, but I noticed that the plastic cap around the bridge has contact with the pickguard...
I hope you Ovationguys have some suggestions because I would really love to get this guitar in good shape as I love the sound, the looks and the playable fast neck of it.
Greetings, Michel. |
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January 2013
Posts: 12
Location: Netherlands | And here some pictures of it:
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December 2006
Posts: 6994
Location: Jet City | Welcome Roerdomp. I always wished there was an Ovation with a humbucker in the bridge and a single at the neck. I know one of the owners of this site did the same sort of thing to his main viper.
Feel free to talk in the other sections of the forum, you have full access now. |
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Posts: 13986
Location: Upper Left USA | Welcome!
How about those pictures?
We like pictures  |
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January 2013
Posts: 12
Location: Netherlands | Here it is: 
Yesterday I played it for the first time with the band and it sounded great! |
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December 2003
Posts: 13986
Location: Upper Left USA | Besides a string change you mght want to back the pickups off away from the strings to allow a little more sustain.
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Posts: 7221
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | MWoody - 2013-01-15 6:35 AM
Besides a string change you mght want to back the pickups off away from the strings to allow a little more sustain.
+1 Big mistake/habit I made early on was thinking closer to the strings was better. Closer does make things more sensitive to point...but you loose nuance and really suffer in the sustain department where the magnetic properties of the pickup trump the vibrations of the strings. The key is finding the sweet spot. |
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January 2013
Posts: 12
Location: Netherlands | I tried lowering the pickups and raising the action, but nothing seems to work.
Yeah, I know about the pickups. Maybe I should put them even lower. Does somebody with a Viper can give me a clearance between strings and pickups? (I think I make a post about it in the 'solidbody'-section, so everybody can react). But to be honest, I really suspect the bridge. As I said, I'm not familiair with this guitars, but I think it would make sense if there was a (small) distance between bridge and pickguard. On the low E side, there is... I'll try to make a close-up photo one of these days.
I also need to clear out the problem of the relative low D- and G-string. I think a former owner did some DIY-adjustment... Let's see if I can fix it.
Anyway, the sound of it is great! |
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Posts: 7221
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Now that you mentioned it... I looked closer and your sustain issue is that you don't have enough angle on the backside of the saddle. In other words the back of the bridge should be lower than the saddles. I lot of people let them up (screw on back of body) to make string changes easier, but that removed the tension against the saddles which can affect sustain.
Loosen the strings a little (couple of turns each) and screw in the adjustment on the back to increase the string angle (lower the back of the bridge). Then retune.... If you already have fairly new strings... you should notice the difference instantly. On most of my Vipers I had the action so low that I had to be really careful when I changed strings as the guide holes were about even with the face of the guitar if not a little lower. |
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January 2013
Posts: 12
Location: Netherlands | He, thanks for the reply. So you think lowering the back of the bridge would make a difference? I tried it a couple a days ago with 3 times clockwise. Didn't seem to help a lot, The only big difference I noticed was more tension when bending strings. So I brought it back on the height how I purchased it. Maybe I need to do a little more? I took a picture this evening of it:
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Posts: 7221
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | That looks pretty decent but most of mine are a little lower, at least to where you look at it from the side it's level. As far as the strings getting harder to bend... try different strings. I would go with 10's or less... usually 9's.. 8's if I bend a lot. |
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January 2013
Posts: 12
Location: Netherlands | Well OK, I'll bring the back of the bridge a little bit more down, but I as I said, it didn't solve the sustainissue on the >13-frets on the B and e-string. Maybe I should try lowering the pickups again a bit more. As the guitar is playable right now and sounds good, it's not a very big issue at the moment, but this nice guitar deserves to be perfect. Because I mainly do the rhythmpart in our band, I ended up with .010. Very nice full tone on this guitar. At home I also play some sologuitar, that's why I mentioned the bending. Thanks for your suggestions. |
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January 2013
Posts: 12
Location: Netherlands | I lowered the back of the bridge and sustain improved significantly ! Bending is also no problem. I think I forgot to get the tension off the strings last time I tried. One problem to go ! Thanks a lot. |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Refresh me.. the other problem has to do with the G and D ?? |
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January 2013
Posts: 12
Location: Netherlands | Yep. I need to keep the action quite high to my opinion to prevent the 3th and 4th string from buzzing. And I play like a carpenter so I already need some high action ...
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Posts: 7221
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Have you checked the neck adjustment, possible high frets or just frets that aren't worn as much as others and possible wear on those saddles. How is the intonation?
The Viper (and all Ovation solid bodies actually) are very well designed in the neck/bridge/string alignment area. The radius of the bridge matches the radius of the neck in a way that all things being correct... if the bridge height was off, you could get buzz all, 5-6, or 1-2. Getting buzz in the middle is indicative of something amiss because as you have likely noticed... the height of the individual saddles is not adjustable.
The first place I would look is neck relief, possible warped neck, or some high frets. Lots of tutorials online for checking neck relief. |
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January 2013
Posts: 12
Location: Netherlands | Neck is OK. Intonation is OK. Maybe the frets higher on the neck are a little higher than the lower frets, but I didn't measured them yet. At the moment, with the back of the bridge down, I have an action of 2,7 mm on the low E (12th fret) and 2,4 on the high e, which is a huge improvement compared to the situation before. Lowering it result in buzzing or lack of sustain on high notes. There is room for some more improvement, but than D and G-string have to get higher, and they are not individually adjustable... It's useable for my playingstyle right now, so I stick with it for the moment and I consider a check by a luthier. Maybe a fillplate under the D and G can solve the problem. |
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New Here: Me and my Viper
