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Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 5750
Location: Scotland | So, at Summer NAMM Fishman unveiled a 250 watt "Line Array" acoustic/vocal system, the concept of which which is obviously and undoubtedly "borrowed" from the Bose L1. After using a pair of L1's for a couple of years now I know how good an alternative it is to a regular PA. In fact for most venues up to 2 or 3 hundred capacity a regular PA is no alternative for the Bose. Now, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery (unless you happen to be Hank J, in which case it means a lawsuit) and while this is clearly "heavily inspired" by the L1 I'll bet it's a damn fine piece of kit in it's own right that will out-perform any acoustic amp of similar power rating. If you already have an L1 the Fishman would be totally redundant, but anyone needing an acoustic amp without going to the expense of a Bose system should check it out.
New Fishman Line-array amp |
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Joined:
November 2005
Posts: 1126
Location: Omaha, NE | I've had my eye on that one for a few weeks. Looks like a great system.
And to be fair, its not like Bose invented the line array. They've been around forever.
The Fishman version has a much more sensible price ($1k street) and a more luggable configuration. I wonder how it will sound without a separate subwoofer module.
For me, these systems are useful for lower volume, acoustic type environments. I am trying to get some wine bar solo gigs, and this is a perfect solution for that.
But for a band gig at serious volume levels, I'm no fan of the Bose system. I sat in with a friend's band using that system a while back. I just didn't think the sound had any punch. Line arrays are great, but if you want real heavy-duty sound you need big drivers moving big air. |
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Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 5750
Location: Scotland | Yes, line array concept has been around or years, but Bose were the first to bring the concept to regular working musicians at shit-gig level.
Just be careful of that price/performance/weight ratio. Less than 1/3rd of the power and not significantly smaller/lighter for a little less than half the street price. The Bose has a "less sensible" price because it is significantly more powerful. I know, because I use them nearly every single gig I play, and my Bose replaced 2 Mackie SWA subs and 2 SRM450's. If you don't need the power of the Bose fine, for what you're doing I guess the Fishman will be perfect.
And as for punch and coverage with the L1, ask Cliff, he's played through my systems. My sound-engineering skills are pretty damn honed, I've been doing it for almost 30 years and teaching it for 20. Bad sound via quality equipment is always the workmen rather than the tools.
If I wanted serious volume levels with a band I wouldn't use Bose L1's, and anyone who does in that situation is kinda missing the point of them. |
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Joined:
November 2005
Posts: 1126
Location: Omaha, NE | I don't think we disagree. My only beef with the Bose system is a marketing push that wants me to think the system is all things for all situations.
Its not. My experience is that for my applications the Bose is either too much (overkill for small room acoustic environments) or too little (not enough balls for a high volume club environment).
When we play clubs, we need that "knock you in the chest" thump that people want. Our indoor setup includes two 18" JBL subs in ported cabinets and two Yamaha S215 stacks. Our drummer runs triggers and we mic the bass player's amp. It all goes through the PA. It sounds totally killer, and we have all the volume we need for any venue in town (at least the ones we play at).
But for wine bar gigs, all I really need is minimal power with lots of dispersion. My Marshall AS50 would be enough, except for the dispersion part. Oh, and it sounds like crap.
I'm glad that Fishman has come out with this new system. I had been leaning toward the Bose, but for the reasons I've stated I think the Fishman may be a better fit for my needs. |
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Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 5750
Location: Scotland | Listen, I got my stuff from them at a massive discount because I use it trade shows etc, and if you re-read my first post it was not really a Bose-wank, I was suggesting the Fishbreath thing was worth checking out. I use Bose stuff because it works, not cause I get it cheap. Hell, Ovation's UK distributor gave me an endorsement 30 frigging years after I'd been playing'em and buying 'em full-price
The "Knock you in the chest" thing is something that Bose have actively said they don't do. The whole point of the thing was "let's bring the level back to where the audience don't get hearing damage" I read about the L1 and my sound-engineer's head said "this is bullshit" Then I saw the Bose band demoing at Frankfurt MusikMesse a couple of years ago, and there was a 7-piece band mixing themselves onstage, without an FOH or monitor engineer. The sound was perfect, and you didn't have to scream at the guy next to you to have a conversation. We've done a couple of bigger venues over the last few weeks with house systems and cloth-eared engineers and the monitor mix was always a problem and you never know whats going on in the house, blah blah blah. The money's nice but it's good to get back to the sound you can trust. |
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Joined:
February 2008
Posts: 247
Location: Delaware | I have no experience with the new Fishman system, but I do have a Bose L1 B1 PAS. I really like mine. Get it dialed in just right and there is no need to be over poweringly loud. You can hear yourself just fine with no monitors, cause the system is behind you. With the right mic and eq'ing, you can turn up the fire power and still not hurt people's ears ! ( OH, of course unless you play and sing like me ). Consider your options, do some reasearch, sometimes you get what you pay for !! |
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Joined:
September 2004
Posts: 777
Location: East Wenatchee, WA | I don't know....I am not sure they are even close to the same type of system. My L1 uses something like 4 inch drivers, where as the Fishman uses 4 FOOT and 1 FOOT drivers in their array. They must be neo's or something to be light enough
***clipped from the web-site*****
Drivers
- Six 4' mid-woofers, patented dual gap, high excursion design, neodymium magnets (200W)
- One 1' neodymium soft dome tweeter with level control (20W)
*****clip******
Okay...just kidding really :D
I bought a used L1 B1 last year and after some initial issues with my small basement feedback into my condensor mics (it was fine with dynamic), I really like it. I have yet to drag it into public to open it up, but was looking for something to act as my basement PA, yet still have some horsepower for my wife and I (keys, guitar, vocalx2) in small/med venue's...mostly churches without the constant problem of house monitors.
Hey...it works. I sold my Mackie power amps and EV 15" 3 ways (speakers were 80 lbs each) and reclaimed a large portion of my practice room.
I am getting more sold on smaller/simpler for most people (especially us over 50 something crowd) and even have a small keyboard amp/PA that I use in really small situations. 5 channels, 175 bi-amped watts and only about 35 lbs on that one.
I hope Fishman does well with it. |
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Joined:
November 2004
Posts: 4413
| The six 4' and one 1' tweeter are only fitted to the Spinal Tap signature stack. |
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Fishman rip off Bose
