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Joined:
September 2004
Posts: 777
Location: East Wenatchee, WA | Well, we just heard back that our claim on the W597 was denied by the USPS due to "packaging not meeting USPS requirements". I have a call in to the agent to ask what those requirements are, but help me out here.
Hardshell case. Not factory, but designed for this guitar. No rattle factor at all. Factory guitar box with bubble wrap cushioning the bottom before the case was put in, then all gaps filled with foam peanuts. The last few inches at the top stuffed with newspaper to make sure it was a tight fit inside the shipping box.
Is there a requirement not to back it too tight.
The damage was apparantly a very potent drop to that crushed the bottom of the box. I didn't inspect it (it is still with the USPS in Il) but the only thing I can figure is that the strap button hit had enough g-forces exerted that it pushed the bowl in and popped the top off at the back of the guitar.
I also voiced my concerns that ths USPS office in Il would not allow a claim for repair which the Insurance claim office said certainly was an allowable claim.
Anyway...very frustrating. I know I could just tell the buyer tough luck, but I can't do that. So will work through the process with him and if we can't come to a solution, will buy the guitar back from him and repair it myself. |
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Joined:
December 2001
Posts: 10581
Location: NJ | you have to insist that the guitar was packed in an original carton with original packing. they will bulk but then give in. the first one is always denied then they send you to the insurance people in crawford TX. then you can get it resolved |
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Joined:
June 2006
Posts: 7307
Location: South of most, North of few | I'm begining to think the only way to safely get a guitar from point A to point B is to carry it yourself. Best of luck with the claim Jeff. |
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Joined:
September 2004
Posts: 777
Location: East Wenatchee, WA | Thanks for the advice Al. Just finished a letter exactly detailing how it was packed down to the last piece of newpaper and peanut. We shall see what happens. |
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Joined:
March 2006
Posts: 1634
Location: Chehalis, Washington | Definitely pursue it - in my experience, unfortunately, the standard operating procedure of all insurance companies is to say NO, NO, NO, and then finally "maybe." Keep at it, and get opinions of dealers or OFC members on paper if you need to that how you packed it was adequate. Just about everyone here has packed a guitar to ship at some point, which counts for a lot of collective experience.
Just remember, it took six months of phone calls and letters (not all of them nice) and a $400 attorney bill to get Farmers to cough up our claim, so don't give up!
Good luck! |
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Joined:
October 2006
Posts: 3
Location: Woodbridge,Va. | This is my first time on this site.The main reason I joined was to see if anyone had any info on shipping my 92 Adamas 1688-7 from the Washington D.C.area to the factory in New Hartford.After what I've read I think I'll drive it there
Nails
92 Adamas 1688-7
Ovation 1615-4 |
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Joined:
March 2005
Posts: 12750
Location: Boise, Idaho | I'm waiting on my 30th to arrive from New York via UPS. It's insured and I'm sure it's packed well, but it's scary when we read something like this. |
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Joined:
October 2006
Posts: 3
Location: Woodbridge,Va. | It's one thing to have something damaged you have little attachment to.When you have 12,000 + hours playing time on it you do get attached some what. |
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Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10777
Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | FYI... When Patrick, who sold me my 4861, sent my guitar UPS he packed it with 10 lbs. of freebie newspapers! First the hard-case, then a whole freebie-newspaper rack worth of paper, then a Martin factory box. Got here just fine, but the packing material weighed about as much as the guitar & case. Just thinking out loud... |
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August 2003
Posts: 4619
Location: SoCal | Haven't had a problem with OHSC in an Ovation case with base and collar cardboard...course, if I have a trash bag of peanuts, I throw them in also (to get rid of them). Al uses pizza boxes or Coke 12-pack cardboard.
Never had a problem with USPS Priority, to include shipping to eastern Oregon during an ice storm.
Actually had to remove the guitar/case from one box for inspection by counter clerk...course, that's the one to Stephen that had damage to the case (not guitar)..."go figure" |
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Joined:
April 2004
Posts: 13303
Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | Right.....and USPS did not give me any hassles with the claim...paid very quickly. All I had to do was provide an invoice for a new case which Al was kind enough to send me.
I got my money and Al sent me a new case.
USPS did keep the original case however. |
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Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 1817
Location: Minden, Nebraska | Luck of the draw, maybe. I will not ship UPS anymore because of an intransigent jerk in the company that handles insurance/damage control for them. This incident involved my sending a guitar that arrived with a cracked top. It became apparent that my packing more than met UPS requirements AND UPS accepted the package at their shipping center. His conclusion, in spite of hundreds of claim free shipments via UPS, was that I must have shipped a damaged guitar OR the receiver damaged it because a properly packed guitar could not possibly have been damaged in the hands of UPS.
I fought this for a month with no success, and have been a happy FedEx customer since. Others have FedEx horror stories.
The great majority of guitars shipped arrive without problem if they are packed reasonably well. It is the exceptions in handling and customer service that cause the biggest aggravations. Hopefully if you encounter one, you don't encounter both. |
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Joined:
September 2004
Posts: 777
Location: East Wenatchee, WA | Paul,
We are more than a month into this with their stall tactics. (First claimed the I had to sign the claim as the "holder of the receipt" when in fact the receipt was sent to the receiver on the USPS advice to speed the claim). Everything has to be by mail, nothing fax and nothing by phone.
Now they say denied due to being improperly packaged (they tried to used the damaged when sent tactic, but fortunately I had dated digital pictures), so now I have filed an appeal, with photo's of the case, and description of the packaging (all in their possession).
We are approaching two months now....totally ridiculous. We offered to accept a repair, but the first guy said, "nope, full claim or nothing" which has now been refuted by two other employees, so I resubmitted for the repair with an email of costs from John B. Now they will probably say, it must be a signed certified copy of a letter for the repairs.
Two things I see...1) They are going to stall the claim as long as possible just because and 2) Being the USPS, they cannot seem to get on board with email and faxes (nasty competitors).
Totally ridiculous. I would sue them just for the fun of it, except they probably wouldn't accept certified mail service of the court papers. |
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Joined:
March 2003
Posts: 555
Location: Wooster, Ohio | This is scary, I just shipped one and will be shipping another guitar Monday. One thing I did was to pay to have it professionally packaged for me. That way they can't blame me for the packaging and I think I would have a better claim. I ate that cost but it felt better than me trying to do it.
Steve |
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Joined:
March 2006
Posts: 1634
Location: Chehalis, Washington | 45flint, use FedEx if you can. I have never had any trouble, and I've shipped (with work as well) hundreds of boxes with them. My brother did have one issue, where they didn't have his apartment number and rerouted a box to Illinois, but he did end up getting it, undamaged, and as expected. They just took a little longer.
Of anyone, I always use FedEx anymore - this stuff is just way to valuable to trust to UPS (United Parcel Slayers) or USPS (U Suck Pretty Seriously)... :D |
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Joined:
November 2004
Posts: 286
Location: Idaho | Now I'm feeling bad for not buying this from Jeffery last summer and avoiding the whole shipping thing. I'll remember this the next time I'm GAS'n for something in my hands. It just might be my duty to save the next guitar from destruction. |
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Joined:
September 2004
Posts: 777
Location: East Wenatchee, WA | Epilogue,
After nearly two months of persistence and dealing with genuinely "un-nice" people in St. Louis, a check was delivered to the buyer of my W597. The buyer was fantastic throughout the ordeal, but got fed up with the USPS (as did I, but I continued to play firm but nice).
In the end, the check was for the repair estimate plus a little bit for shipping which was an unexpected plus.
Buyer is keeping the guitar (I offered to buy it back and sent them a check which they held) so we are all relieved it is over.
I am amazed at the quality of people they employ at the USPS in these departments. Other than a few pleasant reception type people, the claims folks were downright mean spirited. Treated me like garbage and a liar throughout.
I understand that you get a lot of folks trying to stick you, (goodness, that's my daily job) and I will admit that I think the worst at times, but I never let that show to the customer.
Anyway....not necessarily a happy ending, but better than I expected. |
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Joined:
December 2003
Posts: 13984
Location: Upper Left USA | Good to see you are through it! |
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Joined:
February 2005
Posts: 11840
Location: closely held secret | Originally posted by JeffreyD:
I understand that you get a lot of folks trying to stick you, (goodness, that's my daily job) Nice job you got there - what size stick do you use? And how sharp is it? |
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Joined:
September 2004
Posts: 777
Location: East Wenatchee, WA | Originally posted by The Wabbit Formerly Known As Waskel:
Originally posted by JeffreyD:
I understand that you get a lot of folks trying to stick you, (goodness, that's my daily job) Nice job you got there - what size stick do you use? And how sharp is it?
I am a bank credit administrator. Unfortunately I frequently get to deal with folks who didn't understand the "Promissory Note" has something in it called a Promise to Pay. "What...you mean I have to pay it back...." At least I am not in "Special Credits" anymore. Always wondered why they called them Special. I kind of thought they something significantly less than that. :D |
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Joined:
March 2006
Posts: 1634
Location: Chehalis, Washington | Great news Jeff, or at least positive. Persistence is really the only way to get through things like that, and, trust me, it's not just USPS...unfortunately, "claims" is an ugly field anymore. |
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USPS Packing Requirements
