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| The Ovation Fan Club | ||
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| Random quote: "Believe me when I say that some of the most amazing music in history was made on equipment that's not as good as what you own right now." - Jol Dantzig |
 Celebrity endorsement
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| Forums Archive -> The Vault: 2002-2003 | Message format | |
alpep |
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Joined: December 2001 Posts: 10581 Location: NJ | Do you think it is necessary to have celebrity endorsement to sell a guitar? Have you ever bought a guitar because of celebrity endorsement? What are your feelings about models named after celebrities? My story, when I was a kid I had a paper route and I was saving up the money for a guitar. I really loved Hendrix but for some reason I never really liked the strats, although I would salivate all over the 68 Fender catalog that was kept dog eared under my bed. When I got into 8th grade and high school I bought The allman brothers live at the Fillmore east and it changed my life. I was enamoured with Duane Allman. Duane played a cherry sunburst Les Paul and that is what I wanted. I kept saving my money. In 71 or 72 I asked my dad to take me to the music store in the next town since the local one did not carry Gibsons. I just wanted to look at guitars and shop. They had a cherry sunburst Les Paul deluxe there that I was in love with. I did not know or care that Duane played a 58 all I saw was the color. I had about half the money. played my favorite Alvin Lee lick from "I'm going Home" from the wood stock album, handed the guitar back to the salesman and walked out of the store disgusted, My dad did not follow me he stayed inside and after about 5 minutes of sitting in his old 64 impala, I found out that he made a deal with the salesman and we were to pick up the guitar in a couple of days. He put up the other half of the money which was very difficult for him to do at the time. (details that I don't want to get into) Anyway I played the hell out of the guitar. I had it it cost $319 with tax strings picks case strap polishing cloth and cord. I played it so much that I wore the frets out from fret 1 to 10 that it was unplayable and needed a fret job. The guitar layed in the case with no strings for a bout 20 years until I got it refretted last year. Although I have been playing Hamers for the past few years, That LP still has a special place in my heart. So the point of all this is that the celebrity played the guitar, there was not a formal company affiliation yet I still bought a "similar" guitar because that is what Duane played. Now tell me what you think. | ||
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| Tim in Yucaipa |
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Joined: August 2003 Posts: 2246 Location: Yucaipa, California | I also bought a new '73 Les Paul Custom Cherry Sunburst in 1973... yep, after wearing out the Allman Bro's Fillmore East Album.... I also bought my Gibson Hummingbird because of the Gibson name/quality. However, I bought my Balladeer 12 because of the Ovation reputation and unbelievable sound/electronics. I then bought my Balladeer 6 because of the joy I have playing the 12-string. My Hummingbird sits in its case (with humidifier) unplayed. So, even though Duane never really "endorsed" the Les Paul.... his playing did (as did Dicky Betts)... and even though Glenn Campbell did/does endorse the Ovations, I ignored that and bought quality/sound.... Not sure what all that means except that we are all influenced to some degree by celebreties whether we like it or not, but I won't buy something just because someone "Famous" tells me to! tim | ||
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| Mr. Ovation |
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Joined: December 2001 Posts: 7211 Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | This post took awhile to write as Al, you really made me think..... damn you :) I believe Celeb endorsements mean a lot to some people, I'm just not really one of them. I make decisions on guitars (and many other things) based on the recommendations of people whom I respect and usually know. They aren't necessarily celebs and I don't necessarily purchase based on those recommendations, because when it comes down do it, I need to like whatever it is, on its own merit. My first decent electric was my Viper. The store owner picked it out for me based on my taste in music and budget at the time. A few years later I saw the BC Rich Bich in a magazine and loved the look and the name. After seeing a few artists that I liked playing them, I decided someday I would own one, so now I do, but the final decision was when I played one several years back. Alpep got me looking at Hamer guitars, and eventhough Rick Nielson is an endorsed player whom I respect also, I put Hamer at the top of my list of great guitars as people like Rick and Alpep too, can play whatever they want at this point, and they play Hamer. However, in this case, Hamer just doesn't do it for me, although I will have a Doutone at some point soon based on what I have seen and heard HamerFan Laura play. Same for Steinberger. I never gave them much thought, but Donald "Buck Dharma" Roeser has played just about everything with strings over the past 30+ years and I guess in the late 80's early 90's started playing Steinbergers. He actually had a few copies made after they went out of Buisiness and won't play anything else. Again, not my style of axe, but they are on my list of guitars to keep an eye out for if I find one cheap. Funny, that my first Concert was an Allman Bros concert too. It is only in recent years that I have payed any attention to what gear an artist uses, and then I just wonder if it's truly what they like, or just something they are endorsing. I think more people are influenced by what their favorite artist plays than an actual endorsement. Just look at the Josh Homme thing with the UltraGP. The guitar isn't even made anymore but the desire to have what Josh is playing is enormous. I also think that most people think that if an artist is playing the same instrument more than once, it probably IS an endorsement, even if it isn't. I think the actual endorsement may be a secondary influence in a purchase. Like someone may see Mellissa Ethridge playing an Ovation and decide that's what they want. Then they look through the list and see many other of their favorite artists or at least artists they have heard of play Ovations also and it seals the deal. So, although I don't think you "need" a celebrity endorsement to get someone's attention, I think it's a big help to make the final sale. | ||
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| Stevechapman |
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Joined: April 2003 Posts: 2503 Location: Fayetteville, NC | I bought my first ovation guitar around 1978. It was a Glen Cambell Model 12 String. The only thing I really knew about Ovation Guitars is that i had noticed other musicians playing them. Kenny Loggins, David Gates, Cat Stevens, Glen Campbell, and Paul McCartney. I had grown up watching The glen Campbell Goodtime Hour-I listened to Glens Music and became a real fan. All that said- I Bought that 12 String because I knew Glen Campbell Played Ovations and It had his name on it. Once I got it home though- it really would'nt have mattered if it had glens name on it or not. The Sound Was Absolutely Fantastic-and got better the years that i had it. As I recall- My Dad helped me get that guitar-by adding some money to mine and finaning it for 6 months. Thanks Dad! Endorsements are great-but sometimes the guitars being endoresed are not that great. That's not the case with The Ovation Guitars I think The products are top notch and I'm sure everyone on this board agrees. Buying a guitar simply because it's endorsed by a Famous Musician is not the best thing to do. Always play the guitar First-that way if your not entirely happy with the instrument-you've lost nothing. If you love it- it adds to the joy of buying a new guitar that just happens to be endorsed by someone you admire. | ||
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| Jeff |
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Joined: June 2002 Posts: 863 Location: Central Florida | This is an interesting question you pose. I don't know how "neccessary" celebrity endorsements are, but I agree they can be VERY influential. My love affair with Ovation guitars began thirty four years ago as the direct result of Glen Campbell's association with them. While Glen's wasn't the first music I remember hearing as a kid (I was weaned on The Beatles and the whole British Invasion thing), he was the first guitarist that ever really moved me to want to learn to play. Since then, I've played / owned evrything from Guilds, Gibsons, Martins, Taylors... you name it. But the flame still burns strong for Ovations, and while I've had opportunity to compare and contrast other guitars with Ovations, when it comes to acoustics (unpugged or plugged in), nothing beats my beloved O's. So my point is, while I may have gravitated toward Ovations innitially because of a celebrity endorsement, the reason I still play them today is because they've earned my love and respect as fine, well made, dependable instruments. Jeff | ||
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| Slipkid |
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Joined: September 2003 Posts: 9301 Location: south east Michigan | I have always been attracted to what is different. I bought a Chrysler Mini-van the first year they were out. I bought a Balladeer because of the science behind it. When I wanted and electric it came down to a Richenbacker or a Breadwinner. The BW played and sounded better. The different look was just a bonus. Al....I had simular shopping experiences with my father. If I showed real interest in something, he always supported me. Somehow he could tell my serious desires from my "fad of the moment" whimes. My favorite player is Pete Townshend. Was he ever connected with Ovation? | ||
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| an4340 |
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Joined: May 2003 Posts: 4389 Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands | First, let me say Al, that your Dad sounds like a great guy. If we all had Dad's like that, or we could act like he does, the world would be a better place. As to celebrity endorsements, they actually do get me to look at some instruments and while not to pass over others, the ones endorsed by artists I don't respect, are not the first instruments I try. I'm not going to call out any names that repulse me because I don't want to start a flaming. However, for those artists that I respect then I'll try his guitar, such as Bruce Springsteen and his relationship with Fender and Takamine. I've tried both of those instruments and I liked them both, though not enough to buy them. As for ovations, while I don't aspire to be a guitar god, I think it's a coup for ovation to have Al Dimeola as an endorser. I first saw him live when he toured with Paco Delucia and JM. It really was a spiritual experience to hear them play. Gee, I'm rambling here, but I guess a celebrity endorsement adds to the comfort factor when buying a guitar if someone you respect also plays it. Especially when you don't have much money to buy a guitar. I think most people buy a guitar because of the way it sounds, such as the tele or the adamas, and if a respected artist also plays it then you feel more comfortable buying it. Anyway, them's my 2 cents. | ||
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| Paul Templeman |
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Joined: February 2002 Posts: 5750 Location: Scotland | From a manufacturers perspective endorsements are vital. There is no doubt that hero worship/artist association is an extremely effective sales tool. From a pesonal standpoint I have never bought an instrument becauase of artist association, though I did get rid of one. Part of the reason why I sold my PRS was that they became synonymous with Nu-Metal acts, so maybe it works the other way too. | ||
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| Beal |
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Joined: January 2002 Posts: 14127 Location: 6 String Ranch | They are essential. To Paul T's point they can backfire too. I've bought many guitars because "somebody" had one. Then again I've bought alot because I liked it and no other reason. I'm much less positively influenced now but will shy away from something if it's associated with something I don't like. Lots of the good old boys in Florida refuse to use Nike golf balls. I tend not to like the Yuppie-mobile cars. Endorsements are important to much of our daily life. | ||
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| DPM |
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Joined: November 2002 Posts: 27 Location: North Carolina | The simple fact is that the celebrity endorsement may not get you to but it, but may get you to look at it. The main reason I bought my Ovation was that I listened to my Brother-in Law play one. The round back drew my interest so when I decided to upgrade I gave Ovation a chance. After trying several models I selected my Balladeer. | ||
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| Legend-LX-Fan |
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Joined: November 2002 Posts: 1196 Location: Lafayette, Louisiana | Television played a big part in me finding Ovation guitars. I can remember seeing them on TV, and I thought it was cool that they were plugged in. Ovations use to be all over the TV, and I really looked to see who was playing them. So off I went to play only Ovation acoustic guitars after that. | ||
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| Englishplayer |
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Joined: August 2003 Posts: 396 | I've always thought the Ovation vibe had a high level of cool. It started for me when I saw a Heart concert perhaps 1980 when they had a short set with ovations and mandolins and it had almost a Gypsy flair to it. When it came to buying a guitar to add to my old takamine and a Martin d15 (the Woodie Guthrie/Bob Dylan vibe), I wanted an acoustic-electric that had that Ovation vibe. I tried the Korean made ones (several models) and found that I couldn't stand the unplugged acoustic sound (Just my opinion). So I was about to give up on Ovation when I tried a balladeer. It cost a few hundred more, but boy was it worth it. So watching Nancy Wilson rock with one did get it started, but the sound and playability of the instrument had to back it up. My cherryburst balladeer gives the vibe, the feel, and the sound. Also, to compliment the factory guys... I find the build quality of my 1861 balladeer to be outstanding. | ||
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| Bluebird |
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Joined: May 2002 Posts: 1445 Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | In my case, I have owned quite a few guitars over the last 35 years or so including a nice old 1954 Strat. Probably most of us have been influenced at one time or another by seeing someone playing a particular guitar. Like Jeff, I had been listing to the Beatles and a number of other groups of the day and had been cutting my musical skills (such as they were) on a number of cheapo Sears type guitars for about three years. Then I saw Glen Campbell wailing away on these really odd-but-cool looking guitars on the Goodtime Hour Show. I cut one of those send-for-a-free-catalogue tickets out of a GC/Ovation ad and sent it in for my first set of literature, which I still have. Little did I know that I would someday own the guitar that Glen was playing in the ad! The first Ovation I had ever seen in person was a Balladeer owned by my then girlfriend's uncle. At some point he, got hard up for some cash and I became the proud new owner. I was fifteen at the time and though I have done a lot of guitar swapping over the years, I have owned at least one Ovation ever since that time. When I completed school, the very second thing I bought (the first thing was an old car, I had priorities!) was a Glen Campbell Artist, purchased on layaway from our local music store. I ordered it in, so basically, bought it sight unseen because of the endorsement. However, because of how much I liked my Balladeer, and only being seventeen, it didn’t even occur to me that I might not like the new guitar after it arrived, but it was indeed a great instrument. So to get to the point, while I was influenced at that time to buy an indorsed instrument, it is the fact that they just seem to work for me, and the great customer service, that has kept me with the brand for all these years. My subsequent collecting of GC prototypes has only been in the last three years or so and started more by chance than anything else. I think that whether endorsed or not, without high-exposure artists playing various brands, most instruments would never be seen by the buying public. As for models being named for celebrities, at one time it meant something…like that the cleb in question was at least a great guitarist, such as Les Paul, Al Dimeola, GC, Josh White, etc. but now it is not necessarily so, judging by the long list of celebrity models being offered now by some makers such as Martin. Anyway, enough of my ramble for now! Wayne | ||
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| alpep |
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Joined: December 2001 Posts: 10581 Location: NJ | Celebrity Endorsements do have an effect. I know that I would not have bought a Les Paul if I was not into Duane Allman and seeing those Dan Armstrong ads with Keith Richards in the sixties with the lucite guitar made me lust over them also. (I owned one and a bass once sold them both before they were worth any money) IMHO when you are young or starting out as a player you are easily influenced by what your idols play if it is an official endorsement or not. Not that I deserve to be in the same sentence as Rick Nielsen as a player, but Miles hit the nail on the head, at this time in my life and my playing ability, I choose what works for me to play and not what an influence will tell me. As many become more experienced players and our ears get more sophisticated, we are attracted to what feels right in our hands and what sounds right to our ears. The name on the headstock becomes secondary. Unfortunately, to attract people to your brand, especially if you are an internationally known company you need to have your guitars in the hands of people that are out there playing and visible. This is what sells guitars to the masses. The experienced player went through all that and now go by instinct. Anyone remember the Diary of the blues album? the John Mayall band? John played a strat that was cut into a teardrop shape. I thought that was so damn cool that as a teenager I bought a Kapa (remember them?) guitar that was teardrop shaped. Actually it did not play or sound awful but it was that influence that made me think it was so cool. Now I don't care if anyone plays the guitar I do. It has to work for me because it is a tool and not a fashion statement. Case in point, I went to a blues jam at a bar in Philly one night. there were a million strats, one lp, one rickenbacker and me with my hamer. Everyone looked at me cross eyed when I took the stage with my hamer until I started playing it. After I sat in for my set, many people came over asking questions about the guitar when before I played they stuck their nose up at it. Funny how snob appeal is also a factor in instrument selection. any thoughts? | ||
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| Bailey |
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Joined: May 2002 Posts: 3005 Location: Las Cruces, NM | I have a terrible addiction to the written word, so all my desires to own an instrument were influenced by magazine articles etc. describing what made a good guitar or mandolin. So I would choose what seemed to have those qualities at the best price. Because I never developed any brand name desire, I found myself playing what sounded good and didn't cost more than I could afford, My best working mandolin was given to me by my son because he found it in a store and liked its volume and presence (great price), and is mostly plywood, but it sounds great on stage and I would not be devastated if it were ruined or stolen. My favorite mandolin for a nice wooden sound, has curly maple back, beautiful carved spruce top and was made in Japan. My favorite electric, of course, is the one I bought from my friend, Bill, Korean Marine veteran (now deceased), a guitar built by a company that at the time (1970's) was kicking ass on quality construction and decent price. Being white and country, I passed up a breadwinner he had and bought the Viper as he was closing up an Escondido, CA Ovation dealership that he had been a partner in. My Yamaki also came from that liquidation, as did my son's, thank god, as Yamaki was ended at the time for being too good a copy of some other well known guitars. The only other guitars that I passed up buying at that time were at John Dopyro's store in Escondido, he had a lap steel Dobro with a resonator installed, made of Koa wood that had the Dobro sound and had an electric pickup, and he begged me to buy it for $250 as I still had some steel skills when I tried it out. I had four kids and Johnny Cash's "Busted" bills to pay so I had to pass it up, and have regretted it ever since. How often does one have a chance to buy a guitar built by an original Dopyro Brother. My heroes were the builders, not the players. Bailey | ||
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| Mr. Ovation |
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Joined: December 2001 Posts: 7211 Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | I think what is coming out is that there are two categories. The celeb PLAYER and the celeb ENRORSEMENT. I think the player probably sells more guitars in the long run because that is the person that set the ball in motion and got the young (or old) wide-eyed future musician into the store in the first place. For those that ended up in the store by other means, the Celebrity ENDORSEMENT may "close the deal." If someone is looking at a guitar, they got the sales pitch, they are trying to figure out where the cash is gonna come from.... knowing that a respected CURRENT artist that they like is playing the same guitar can be the final deal maker. I think Ovation has the first group covered with their present and past artists. Most of the folks on the list, if someone was in a position to be influenced by someones playing or just their sound, those players would cause that would-be artist to check out Ovation. On the otherhand, if someone decides they want to play guitar and they hit the local music store... When it comes decision time of which instrument is played by someone they recognize and can relate too, I'm not sure Ovation's "artists" (in general terms) are much of an attraction. As I look through Ovation's artist list, there are only a few artists that are actually getting any airplay in the past few YEARS!!!! compared to Martin where you have a list of "owners" that's impressive enough with several currently charting artists on the list in several music genre's but then there is the admittedly lugi-crisp list of "Signature" models. While I think the whole thing is proposturous, it sells them a LOT of guitars. And lets not even go down the Taylor route. I think you get to be a Taylor endorsed artists or player just having seen a picture of one in a magazine... but again... IT SELLS LOTS OF GUITARS. What I did find striking is that I see artists that are endorsed by all three companies. In the case of companies like Taylor and Martin that have HUGE lists, this isn't much of a statement, but I could also see where seeing an artist on those lists, and seeing them on the Ovation list, either negates the validity because they have no real preference, or a shrewd saleman could say "well yeah, they play Ovations too, but look at the company they keep with Martin or Taylor players." Of course a BETTER salesperson would lead the customer down the road of "well, although they endorse all those other brands like everyone else does, they are a member of the small more elite group of folks that play quality Ovation instruments" Bottom line is via endorsement or just playing, the instruments need to be seen. This was proven with Josh Homme's TV appearance last year on a guitar that as stated before isn't even available. I would bet that this coming week there will be a DISTINCT increase in sales of Ovation guitars, possibly even Adamas guitars specifically due to Kaki King on Conan. That show will appear at least three times in the next few days to millions of people. There were plenty of closeups, and there is no doubt to what guitar she was playing, and she sounded great. While on the subject... sortof... I applaud Conan for his presentation of her. No ignorant speech about "new artist" or "rising talent." He presented her just as Kaki King, leaving the average viewer in the position of not wanting to be the one idiot to ask "who's that?".. They are thinking she's on Conan, she's obviously "somebody" and I better get up to speed. That's the way it should be done, and Kaki better be prepared for the big rush that's going to happen. My guess would be Letterman next because she's from NY and she appeared on the "other" network. But back to the topic... I would like to find out how many Adamas guitars are sold in the next week or two compared to other weeks. | ||
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| grrroovedude |
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Joined: February 2003 Posts: 299 Location: Netherlands | In '88, when I had just been playing for two years or so, I saw someone in a Dutch magazine who played an Ovation Adamas as it was called in the article. I don't remember who it was, but I knew it was a great player and I thought the epaulets looked cool. As I was 17 or 18 at the time, I did not have the money to buy an Ovation myself (esp. since buying ovations in Holland is a PITA with only three dealers that all three charge the full SRP of the distributor in Germany). Last february I saw Toto live in Amsterdam and Steve Lukather had his '15 secs' with a solo on... an Adamas SMT. I was stunned by the sound of it. It happened to be that I needed strings two weeks later and the store had a second hand Ultra 1528B for a reasonable price, which I had to have. I really liked the feel of the thing, but remembering the article from '88 and seeing Lukather play made me want an Adamas. In the meantime I had joined this board, the dollar price dropped (or did the Euro rise?) and pieces fell together. I ordered a used SMT from Al and sold the Ultra to cover half the expenses. No regrets whatsoever. So, am I influenced by endorsements? I guess so. If I had never read the article back in '88 I would never have considered or even known the name Adamas. If I had not heard the SMT live when Lukather played it, I would not have wanted one. But then again, If the Ovation Ultra would have played like a POS i would never upgraded to an Adamas. Mixed feelings. How do I feel about models named after celebrities? I partly like the SMT because it's an SMT and not an Ovation 'LUKE', like his Music Man. It's just another guitar. I would never buy a guitar because it's named after someone alone. Only possible exception would be a Lucille, which I can't afford, so no problem there. Martin | ||
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| Tim in Yucaipa |
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Joined: August 2003 Posts: 2246 Location: Yucaipa, California | "Funny how snob appeal is also a factor in instrument selection." I too was a "Gibson Snob" for years. I belittled ANYTHING that wasn't a Gibson.... then I very reluctantly played an Ovation.... now it seems I'm in danger of becoming an "Ovation Snob"... hmmm..must do something about this flaw in my otherwise Sterling Character! tim | ||
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| Old Applause Owner |
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Joined: July 2003 Posts: 1922 Location: Canton (Detroit), MI | I wouldn't say that an "endorsement" per se gets me to buy an instrument, more that I like the sound that an artist gets out of the instrument. My fascination with Ovations dates back to 1972...I had seen Glen Campbell play Ovations on his show and was aware of them. I went to a local concert by the group The Ides Of March in March 1972; Jim Peterik was using an Ovation (probably a Balladeer) for their softer songs, "L.A. Goodbye" and "Freedom Suite". I loved the sound it had....a nice bright, ringing sound. I resolved that when I could finally buy myself a good guitar when I got out of college, I would get an Ovation. Well, I was still broke for a good while when I got out of college, so I ended up buying an Applause AA14-4(not knowing, but suspecting the connection with Ovation). I still have it. Plus a Celebrity CC01. And saving my money for a Balladeer 12-string. The unfortunate end of the Ides' concert story....Jim Peterik had his Ovation stolen after that concert....and I don't know if he ever got it back..... | ||
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| rx7dr |
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Joined: June 2003 Posts: 16 Location: Long Island, NY | My first introduction to Ovation came in '77. The band had broken up, and the Angelica 12 just wasn't cutting it. There was very little in my price range but I played what I could and the Balladeer 12 came home that day. Getting back to the subject of celeb endorsements, I was aware of GC at the time and liked his "stuff", but not enough to buy a guitar on his say so. However through the years, and many O's I have always felt my love of Ovations has been reinforced and justified by seeing all the pros that have chosen them over other brands. Dave | ||
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