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June 2002
Posts: 6194
Location: Phoenix AZ | Today I took delivery of my new Mandolin. I moved "upscale" and sold my Applause mando and bought a nice new Celebrity MCS148. I don't play mando actually at all, and certianly could not justify going for the Ovation model. The Celeb would be fine. I was/am willing to accept the old "you get what you pay for" thing.
This mando came stright from the factory / distributer (via the dealer) still in the original factory sealed box. I'm not complaining, but here is what I had to do within the first 30 minutes of openng the box:
1. Adjust k-bar by 1/2 turn to straighten out the neck.
2. Tighten two loose screws on the tuners.
3. Still could not play above the 4th fret due to a pretty good hump in the fretboard where it joins the body.
4. Removed the strings and saddle and added another shim under the pickup.
5. When I removed the strings the nut fell off because it was not glued in place. I re-glued it and restrung the mando.
Everything is fine now. Don't get me wrong, I'm not disappointed or pissed off that this thing needed so much work. I got it for a great price ($285.) and it's now in tip top shape and actually sounds very nice. But I just wanted to point out what you really get in the old "get what you pay for" saying. I expected Celebrity level quality and that's what I got. BUT - WHAT IF I THOUGHT I WAS GETTING A REAL "OVATION" ???? Wouldn't I be disappointed? And wouldn't I always in the future associate the name Ovation with this level of quality?
Come on, Kaman. PLEASE get your act together on these product lines. You can't be doing yourselves (and us customers) any favors.
Dave |
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August 2003
Posts: 888
Location: Louisville, OH 44641 | Nicely summarized Dave. Does anyone for Kaman read this board? Can we bring this issue up at the factory tour in March? |
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August 2003
Posts: 18
Location: blkyn usa | Reminds me of stories friends told me about working in the mahwah ford plant, with cars rolling off the assembly line with doors not fully bolted on and windshield wipers hanging off. There's a reason why that plant closed and ford lost market share. |
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Posts: 6194
Location: Phoenix AZ | Please don't misunderstand what I was trying to say. I'm not critical of the quality of the Celebrity Mando that I got. I knew what to expect and was not disappointed. My point was that in many ways (cosmetic) and to the "average" Guitar Center type customer, this was passed off as an "Ovation". Makes it all too easy for someone to draw misleading conclusions about the USA made instruments we all love. Dave |
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May 2002
Posts: 3005
Location: Las Cruces, NM | Dave
A great post and you made an important point, the Celebs should be shipped in a playable condition. My nephew has a Celeb mandolin and I had a chance to play it and was satisfied and even impressed with the quality of the material and generally of the instrument, my neohew is something of an instrument repair person as well as an excellent fiddle and mandolin player, so I assume he made any adjustments that the mandolin needed and I didn't ask him if any were needed (he bought it used).
All that said, we are back to the "old days" question of that we used to buy our instruments from a store and the store owner did the adjustments that you had to do, making the factories lazy and careless as their quality control was done at the local store. They can't get away with that today as the catalogs have put that quality control system out of business. The factories better check out what they are shipping if they want to preserve their reputation.
Bailey |
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February 2002
Posts: 5750
Location: Scotland | Very few moderately-priced imported instruments leave the factories with perfect set-ups. If an example happens to play really well it's usually down to chance rather than adjustment. Distributors will check the imstruments on arrival but as long as they meet fairly broad tolerances they will not get any serious set-up work. You cannot realistically expect budget instruments to have a couple of skilled man-hours spent adjusting them & still be available at a budget price. Some stores, especially the smaller operations will set-up instruments free or at a nominal charge as a service to their customers, but you can forget it with the likes of GC. These mandos are great for the money, but as Dave said, the name on the headstock is the real problem, not the standard of factory set-up which is no better or worse than other similarly priced instruments. |
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July 2003
Posts: 1922
Location: Canton (Detroit), MI | Hi all,
A couple of notes:
First, I would agree that Kaman needs to get their act together about set-up. I bought a "second" Epiphone MM30 mandolin a month ago, and all I did was put on new strings and it was ready to go!!!! I believe Gibson has their Epi instruments set up on entry to the U.S.. That is indicated by the sticker on the back of the headstock. My Casino and Les Paul Standard have the same stickers and they also have beautiful set-ups.
Second, about the Ford Mahwah plant....it closed because it was an old plant, and it was impossible to get the required quality there without spending a large amount of money on the plant to modernize it. As was said, there were problems....and when Ford no longer needed the capacity, it was closed.
I have a 2001 Ford Escape built at Kansas City and it has never needed to go back to the dealer; it has 26,000 miles on it. Just drove it to Nashville and back (to Detroit) two weeks ago. |
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March 2002
Posts: 1380
Location: Central Oregon | Originally posted by Old Applause Owner:
Hi all,
A couple of notes:
First, I would agree that Kaman needs to get their act together about set-up. I bought a "second" Epiphone MM30 mandolin a month ago, and all I did was put on new strings and it was ready to go!!!! I believe Gibson has their Epi instruments set up on entry to the U.S.. That is indicated by the sticker on the back of the headstock. My Casino and Les Paul Standard have the same stickers and they also have beautiful set-ups.
I agree. I have an Epiphone Riviera J.K. sig (335 style) & it came set up beautifully. In a hsc for $550, including shipping. It is as nice to play as any guitar I've ever tried, isn't anything special as far as sound quality, but for the money it is an excellent value. Two of my buddies bought Epi's after I got mine, one got a Dot & one an LP & they were both real nice playing guitars right out of the case.
On the other hand, the 12 string Celeb I bought (thinking it was a *real* Ovation) looked great, sounded really good & played like crap. If I hadn't found this forum I wouldn't have an Ovation right now.
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February 2002
Posts: 5750
Location: Scotland | Dave paid $285 for his Mandolin, a quality instrument regardless of set-up issues. How is that possible? The factory has to build it, it then has to be shipped from Korea to the USA where it incurs customs charges. The distributor adds his cut then it goes to the store who needs to sell it a price which will yeild a profit, some of which will go to the government as sales tax. It's hardly worth the effort, nobody is making any real money selling that kind of instrument for less than 300 bucks, the only benefit is to the consumer & ultimately it's very bad for the instrument retail industry. If this trend continues stores will end up paying customers to take instuments away........... actually that's the only way I'd consider owning a Taylor. |
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Posts: 1922
Location: Canton (Detroit), MI | I also have a Celebrity CC01, which looks great, sounds great, AND plays great....after I put a new set of extra light strings(Martin SP+) on it after I bought it...maybe I got lucky, but set-up is the best I have ever had on any acoustic I have ever owned, and seems as good as any guitar I have ever tried at our local Guitar Center(maybe that isn't saying much, though).
For what it's worth, my Epi MM30 mando cost me $190(it was a new instrument stamped "2nd"---Elderly Instruments has new ones for $210, I believe). |
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Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 5750
Location: Scotland | Originally posted by Old Applause Owner:
For what it's worth, my Epi MM30 mando cost me $190(it was a new instrument stamped "2nd"---Elderly Instruments has new ones for $210, I believe).
To put that price into perspective: the average charge by a good repair shop to re-fret a mandolin, regardless of how much it cost new, is around $200. I have a Calton mandolin
case which retails at around $500. You gets what you pays for. |
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December 2001
Posts: 10581
Location: NJ | I want a rolls but only want to pay for a volkswagon. |
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March 2002
Posts: 1380
Location: Central Oregon | I think you're in luck Al. If I'm not mistaken VW bought out RR a few years ago.
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June 2002
Posts: 6194
Location: Phoenix AZ | VW bought Bentley (BMW bought Rolls), but personally I think Al looks great driving that AMC Pacer loaded with Ovation goodies. DW |
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Posts: 14842
Location: NJ | ". . PartyOn, Garth!! . . ." |
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New Mandolin Adjustments
