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Location: Central Florida | I have a shiny bowl Deluxe Balladeer, serial # B-500, which dates it as having been built sometime between November, '68 and February, '69. I'm trying to determine if mine has an inlaid rosette or not. Since I've only seen the inlaids in pictures, they look (in the pics I've seen) about the same as the glued ones. Are the inlaid rosettes completely flush with the top? If so, then mine is most likely glued. Mine is raised, but not as much as on my other O's, so that's why I'm not totally sure.
Also, does anybody have any thoughts on why the headstock logos on many early Ovations had a tendency to fade - sometimes to the point of becoming virtually invisible - while others remained bright and like new. Does it have anything to do with exposure to light? I'm referring to the gold only logo used up until about 1977/78, before the switch to the gold logo with the black outline.
As always, I appreciate everyone's insights...
Jeff |
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Location: Scotland | The inlaid rosettes are flush with the top, and very slightly smaller than the overlaid version |
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Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Hi Jeff, the inlaid resettes are, indeed, flush with the top.
As for the logos, I'm not sure. The few I have are still in good shape. One factor could be the gradual darkening of the poly finish, obscuring the label a bit over time.
Wayne |
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| Hi Jeff,
I actually saw your guitar, serial # B500 several years ago at Ron Busch Studio in St. Louis, and I made a few notes regarding its' condition at the time. Although this is a shiny bowl Deluxe, the rosette is not inlaid, but appears to be among the first of the add-on rosettes. It also has the new style truss-rod cover that changed about that time, which does not have the slightly curved base.
It appeared to me that the neck had been refinished, as the heel and headstock are a light color, while the neck is a much darker color underneath the finish. As I recall, there was also some separation between the top and the bowl. |
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Location: Central Florida | Hi Bob,
Yep, that's the one!
I bought it from Ron Busch about three years ago.
There was some separation of the top and bowl but it has been repaired and seems to be good and solid now. As for the neck, it didn't really occur to me that it might have been refinished, but after reading your post I took it out and examined it, and that probably is the case.
I found it on Ron's web page, so I called him and asked him a bunch of questions concerning details that were pertinent to what I was looking for, and this one seemed to have all the right stuff. He gave me a super deal on it (well below what it was priced at on his web page), and I'm real pleased with it. In fact, it's arguably the best sounding Ovation I own... Although my Custom Legend's right up there with it.
My thanks to you, Paul T and Bluebird, for the verification on the rosette. As always, I appreciate it!
Jeff |
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Location: 6 String Ranch | The earliest logos were silkscreened on. It was a mix of a clear base (lacquer maybe?) and gold stuff that was mixed in for every batch. Since it's mixed every time there is inconsistency. I remember doing it, if it didn't look quite right you threw in some more gold spoo and went from there. Too much gold and it wouldn't silk screen right and you tossed it and started over. These are the ones that fade. Later we went to decals and they don't fade. |
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Location: SoCal | You know, regardig the rosette, it's entirely possible that the plastic rosette was added later. The early inlaied rosettes had a tendency to come up off the guitar. Is the bridge an original 5 point rosewood bridge or a later one? |
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Location: Central Florida | Hi Paul,
It has the original rosewood 5-point bridge.
Jeff |
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Location: SoCal | I would guess that somebody put on the rosette later (there's really no way to know for certain -- we're all guessing here). 1969 was the last year for the inlaid rosettes and rosewood 5 point bridges. In 1970, Ovation went to walnut bridges, first with the reverse wings on them, then to the bridge that they still use today. The plastic overlaid rosette came in at the same time. The reason for the overlaid rosette was that Ovation had problems with the inlaid rosette coming up and cracking the finish. |
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Location: Scotland | "1969 was the last year for inlaid rosettes & 5-point bridges"
Moody, we need days and months, not ballparks like "1969". You are a disgrace to the board, if you can't be more accurate than "1969" you really need to get a life. :p |
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Location: SoCal | Hey, I'm lucky if I can remember the 60's at all! After all, I was there.
But now that I think of it, the new overlaid rosettes and walnut bridges first went onto guitars on October 17, 1969, somewhere between 9:14 am and 9:27 am.
Or was that when I was tripping and had to use the can? It's hard to keep those times straight. |
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Location: Scotland | It was October 16th, you drug-addled imbecile |
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Location: SoCal | That I went to the can???? |
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Location: Scotland | Yeah, you forgot to wipe. |
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Location: SoCal | Yeah, I always forget that. But when did Ovation make the switch?
You know, this is the problem when a company is too busy building and developing a product. There, often, is no record of trivia stuff like when was this or that changed, that people like us end up debating 30 years down the road. |
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Location: Scotland | Not a clue, but while we're taking transition, take a look at this
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2573690210&category=33029
Serial number is 0071. Everything about this looks like a pre-production body with a non-slot headstock. Check out the shape of the headstock and the wierd colour of the molded headstock "carving". Compare the fingerboard extension, fiberglass "binding" and epaulettes to an early production Adamas. He's being way to ambitious with the starting bid, but this looks like a very rare bird indeed. |
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Location: SoCal | Interesting guitar. If he started the bidding at a grand, I think he'd end up selling it for 2. But you're right, the openning bid is too ambitious. Unless somebody has a real desire for a preproduction model that is almost exactly like the production models....
What's with the black on the headstock? |
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Location: 6 String Ranch | The actual change happened in September (I forget the day since I was there too) but the ECN (engineering change notice) wasn't signed off till Oct 16th, hence the later date. Of course the ECN was not introduced till the mid 70's but thast's another story. |
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Location: Scotland | Take a look at the fingerboard extension and the shape of the headstock, not to mention the finish which is different to production examples and very similar to Cliff' slothead. I think this neck started out as a slothead & got a prototype foam overlay, but then you're the detective :D
I'll bet this is a fucking KILLER sounding guitar |
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Location: SoCal | I think you're right about the headstock foam. The ornamentation looks like it was glued on. But the fingerboard extension looks pretty normal. Have you blown it up with Photoshop and seen something? The slotheads had fingerboard extentions that were beveled on the bass side. The production models were more squared off on the edges. This looks, to my old and tired eyes, like a production fingerboard. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | Moody, re: your comment about Ovation not worrying about keeping records for us trivia buffs of 35 years later ... Hell, they only had 3 digit serial numbers. How many (few) of these things did they actially expect to sell, anyway? Happens all the time, people don't think something is vualable until it's way too late. Wouldn't you like to see lots of colour glossies of The Beatles during their first recording sessions? Would be priceless nowdays ... but who knew. Dave |
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Location: Scotland | Paul, I haven't used photoshop. The headstock is more tapered than the production models. The fingerboard is missing the bevel you refer to, but it's much longer than the production examples and doesn't appear to have any inlays. Also the epaulettes seem a little different to the production version. I may be wrong but I think that to all intents & purposes this is a "non-slot Slot-Head"
Bill, any ideas? |
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Location: SoCal | Anybody want to email the seller for more pics? |
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Location: Scotland | done |
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Location: Scotland | Ok, got some pics. I think it's a standard production neck (apart from the weird colour of the headstock overlay and lack of inlays)the tapered appearance was an optical illusion, but it's definately a pre-tooling body, it has the same fiberglass binding ring as the slot-heads. Also the electronics are mono & has a rectangular access panel on the treble-side waist rather than a circular hatch on the bowl. |
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Of Rosettes and Headstock Logos...
