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| From the warranty info FAQ’s
http://www.ovationguitars.com/?fa=faq
“Is my warranty transferable?”
”No, all Kaman Music warranty policies are valid only to the original purchaser with a warranty card on file or a copy of the original sales receipt as proof of purchase”
I just wanted to ask why not???
Why the fact of buying a used Ovation releases “Ovation” of its responsibility with that product?
Should I pay for fixing this?
ADAMAS SN 16348
Thanks
Pat |
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Location: Scotland | It's standard, and not just in the instrument retail industry, that any warranty applies to the original purchaser only. Compare the warranty you get with a USA Ovation to consumer products costing the same or a lot more (like your car) & it's a pretty good deal. Why should any manufacturer take care of, at their expense, a product that someone has bought & then seen fit to dispose of? Chrysler certainly will not.
That said, from personal experience Ovation customer service have never been less than stellar in their assistance to me, whether it's been instruments I've bought new, or stuff I've aquired used. Ovation are not attempting to be "released from responsibility" The service department will not abandon buyers of used Ovations, but unlike warrantied guitars any work will be chargeable to the current owner. I've had work done on guitars I've bought used, and the results have always been worth a lot more than I've paid. |
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Location: Pacific Northwest Inland Empire | Well stated, Mr. Templeman. Particularly the "never been less than stellar" part. Accomodating, also. Think about it- they're hosting our numbers for the second, consecutive year. Either they're bucking for canonization, or need more medication! |
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Location: UK | My experience of after sales customer care for Ovation is outstanding, i cant speak for used O`s but i have heard that they will help as much as they can.
I bought an Elite Ltd Russian walnut top from Al, as a factory second a couple of years ago, only slight blemish in the top, it sounds stunning!
After a few weeks of me getting it, a buzzing started, got worser until the finger board bent like a witches crooked hand right into the top! I freaked and hid it away for a few months really pissed off and traumatised. I thought that the shitty UK damp weather had got the best of it,Got off my ass and sent it to JHS the O importers in the UK, i explained i got it from the states and it was factory second, no prob they said, they fixed the bracing that came away from the top, it turned out that not enough glue had been used at the factory, i expected to pay a bill, but it was a free of charge repair! I was well happy and its been perfect ever since.
I intend to stick with Ovation now for rest of my natural life,in my opinion "an Ovation is not just for christmas, it is for life" (anyone remember the ads) |
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Location: 6 String Ranch | Got to give some credit to JHS here too. I got to know John Skews only a year or two before I retired and he's a hell of a nice guy. We enjoyed several rounds of golf as well. Good distributors sure help make a product look good in the consumers eyes. |
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Location: Reading, PA | I think Ovation would render a fee based service commensurate with the specific problem. If my Ovation was broken I'd want it restored by those most qualified to do so regardless of the cost. And on another note... I bought a used GTI in October from an individual and the VW warranty transferred.
Jim |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | I know with cars and motorcycles the "warrantee" company is in many cases completely separate from the manufacturer. It may seem like you have a factory warantee, but in fact it is a 3rd party company who will ask you if you want to extend it when it expires too. I wonder if anyone has thought about "extended warrantee" programs for guitars. Now these can usually be transferred as they are either Paid for, or you pay yearly etc... |
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Location: NJ | if your guitar needs that much work you should probably look into a new one |
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| Well, I red the postings but I think nobody answered my question.
I’m not qualifying the Ovation customer support here, I’m really happy with it.
Also I think comparing a guitar with a car probably is not the best example.
I’d really like to know, why if I’m buying a used Ovation that FAILS, the warranty doesn’t cover it! Where is the difference? Why Ovation responsibility EXPIRES when the guitar is sold to the next owner?
I’d like to mention closer examples; very famous companies probably very well known in this board:
* Eventide
* TC Electronic
* Lexicon
As far as I know their warranty does not expire if you buy a used unit! (I'm/was customer of all of them)
I understand a warranty expiration if you perform a modification but I cannot imagine a "reasonable" (not a standard) reason for a warranty expiration if I’m buying a used Ovation.
I think if the Ovation customer support is good could be much better if they where able to offer their warranty not just only to the first owner. Their products are good then… What’s the problem?
Thanks
Pat
PS: Alpep,
Thanks God and the Ovation Customer support my two Ovations/Adamas work flawlessly, then I think you missed the point here.
Pat |
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Location: Central Massachusetts | Neither you nor Ovation have any idea what has or has not happened to that guitar after it left the factory.
Scenario 1: I am the original owner. My guitar has a problem. I send it in. Ovation says the guitar has been abused. Since I'm the documented responsible owner, I can have a reasonable discussion with them to resolve the conflict. Two parties involved, and one or the other is definitively responsible.
Scenario 2: I am not the original owner. Same deal as above. Now I can say that I never abused it -- musta been somebody else. Ovation eats the cost of repair even if the previous owner used the thing as an oar if they want to maintain a good relationship with me.
Not that they are out to screw people or make all their money repairing guitars.. it's just that adding the middle man potentially introduces social (and possibly legal) ambiguities that they'd probably rather avoid.
Just my two cents. |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Although it seems like a nice idea, I think the way in which Kaman handles used instruments is better. On one hand, although it's used, you can still get ahold of customer support and they have been fantastic for anyone that has called them or had them work on a used instrument. This gives them the opportunity to make a relationship with a new customer who isn't even in the database yet.
I would guess the more important reason is that due to the increase in number of guitars that would then be eligible, they would need an even larger staff, which means everyone pays more for their guitars.
I think this method allows them to go above and beyond many times and shine when they can, and yet still keep the overall cost to a minimum. |
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Location: NJ | PS: Alpep,
Thanks God and the Ovation Customer support my two Ovations/Adamas work flawlessly, then I think you missed the point here.
Pat[/QB]
Huh?
you are right I have NO clue what you are talking about. |
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Location: Scotland | You've lost me. I can assure you that the companies you mention will only provide warranty support at their expense, to the original purchaser, and only within the warranty period. On electronic equipment that is very rarely more than a 1 year warranty. To obtain warranty service you will need proof of purchase or have filled in & returned a warranty card.
Ovation, and most other guitar manufacturers will happily carry out work on any guitar which is out of it's warranty or bought used, but they will quite justifiably present a bill for the work. What's the problem with that?
Let me see if I understand you correctly. Say you buy a used Ovation on Ebay for a couple of hundred bucks or less, and find it has a warped neck & the electronics don't work, probably due to the original owner's neglect. Do you think the factory should put it right for you free of charge? |
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| Well,
Really it’s not my intention to argue at all, but let me tell you that you’re wrong.
It'seems that you are getting excited but you are not saying anything valuable to address this issue.
Have you ever been a customer of those companies, those guys support second owners period.
If I’m buying a guitar used on eBay, let say $100 bucks, and the company ensures “Limited Life Warranty” (Adamas), just tell me why its responsibility expires with the second owner?
If the first owner was twisting the neck or frying the electronics Ovation has the
“Warranty Service Evaluation” instance to determine if the guitar was misused, abused etc. and just say:
Dear (first , second or whatever) customer , your guitar faults are not covered in our warranty because of “misuse”.
In this way you’re protecting that valuable customer that bough and used an Adamas and did not twist the neck etc. etc.
Also from a commercial point of view, I think, in this way, used guitar prices are gonna be higher and probably that helps to make a decision of buying a new guitar instead of the used one. I think Ovation would be happy with this.
What do you think?
It’s simple, isn’t it?
Thanks
Pat |
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Location: San Bernardino, California | TANSTAAFL |
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Location: Scotland | I do not intend to get into a pissing match with you and I do not get angry over something this trivial, anger is a Human emotion. I'm just telling you how the music industry/pro audio industry works in the real world (that's Planet Earth, I'm not sure which sector of the Delta Quadrant you're buying your gear in) I personally own products by Lexicon, TC Electronics, Peavey, Alesis, Joe Meek, Symetrics, BBE, DBX, The Borg (don't understand the manual) Mackie, Berhinger, Neutrik, Roland and numerous others. I am also involved in the purchasing of similar products for the music department of a UK university, so I am well aquainted with the warranty policies of those companies & their distributors. If you are not the original owner or it's out of warranty you pay for repairs, end of story. Unless they feel like doing you a favour, which in fairness happens occasionally, but is certainly not policy. Live long & prosper. |
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Location: UK | My two cents, i reckon that any warranty honoured after original owner has sold or passed on the goods is wide open to abuse, i can see O`s point, to be fair they offer lifetime warranty on a product that stays with the original owner, that is in my eyes excellant service and a sign of confidence in their own product.
Any warranty repair if given by O, to a used instrument on a second or third owner i have had the impression from some people is evaluated by the repairer on its own particualr merits.
My company works on this basis when we repair our own products out of warranty. |
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| Dear Paul
It seams that you know the music industry/pro audio industry very well but I’m still considering that you’re wrong, at least in the cases that I’ve mentioned.
Also I consider that telling us how the industry works did not answer my main question WHY…?
Some people mentioned abuse, I ‘d like to know where and how the abuse could happen. If I’m the first owner and my guitar is not well maintained who the H. is gonna buy it???
The key point here is the “Warranty Service Evaluation” even with the first owner if Ovation thinks the guitar was misused they ALWAYS can say “Sorry the warranty does not apply in this case” period.
As I said before, the product is good + offered “Limited Life Warranty” + required “Warranty Service Evaluation” -> Why just for the first owner????
If anybody has a valid answer go ahead, but please no philosophy, no history, no the market works that way etc.
Thanks
Pat |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | If you are coming on the Factory tour... just ask, I'm sure they will tell you. |
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Location: NJ | why go and ask legitimate questions when it is easier to pontificate in front of the computer keyboard?
How can abuse happen? Wow if you can't figure that out you absolutely have problems. |
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Location: Scotland | OK, here's your valid answer.It's down to basic economics & profitability. Manufacturers & distributors have to factor into the retail price of their products the cost of warranty repairs and running a service department. If they offered unconditional warranty service to every person with a problem, regardless of whether they are the original owner or not, they'd either bankrupt themselves, or their products would have to be be so expensive no-one would be able to afford them in the first place. |
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Location: 6 String Ranch | The why is that the industry doesn't do this and nobody feels that they need to or want to be the first to do so. Once the product is out of the original guy's hands it's used and doesn't need to be covered. As Paul said, sometimes exceptions are made but that is not the rule. |
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Location: Canada | Just another spin on the subject: I bought a slightly used Ovation on e-bay and the blank warranty registration card was included. Is that still any good for me? I think I need repairs. |
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Location: Canton (Detroit), MI | Warranties are to entice a consumer into buying your product, nothing else. If the other companies selling the same product have this warranty, then you must have it as well. Having a BETTER warranty than the rest of the industry is only useful if it provides you a selling point over the other companies.
However, it MUST be cost-effective, or it cannot be done. A lifetime warranty on a guitar does not strike me as cost-effective. A guitar is too much a victim of the treatment it receives at its owner's hands.
My Glen Campbell 12-string, made in 1981, has a twist in the neck at the headstock, probably from the original owner keeping it at concert tuning its entire life, under who knows what conditions. I'd certainly like to get it fixed for free under a "lifetime" warranty, but I think this is not Ovation's fault that the original owner abused the guitar. It is disingenuous to think otherwise.
Ovation's warranty is the same as the rest of the industry because that is what they need to sell their guitars. A lifetime warranty would provide little or no advantage over their competition, and cost a great deal of money that would hurt keeping their product price-competitive.
Roger
1976 Applause AA14-4 6-String
1981 Ovation 1118-1 Glen Campbell 12-string
2001 Adamas 1598-MERB Melissa Etheridge 12-String
2003 Ovation 1777-NAT Legend 6-string |
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Location: Central Oregon | Originally posted by Paul Templeman:
If they offered unconditional warranty service to every person with a problem, regardless of whether they are the original owner or not, they'd either bankrupt themselves, or their products would have to be be so expensive no-one would be able to afford them in the first place.
That is exactly why I've pretty much quit buying Snap-On Tools. I have a large (Snap-On) toolbox at work with mostly Snap-On tools in it. They have an unconditional guarantee on their hand tools, (& they are admittedly excellent tools) regardless of who the original owner was, but their prices are so far out of line now that I've quit buying them. For instance, I was going to buy a quarter inch drive torx socket off the Snap-On truck a few weeks ago until I was told it was over $18! I bought one that was nearly identical from the local auto supply store for $8 (still guaranteed). Some of my larger (around one inch) Snap-On OEX wrenches cost nearly $70 EACH! For Ovation to offer an unlimited guarantee they would have to price them at $5,000 & up. At least.
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“ Is my warranty transferable? ”
Forums Archive -> The Vault: 2004-2005
