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Location: Ozark, Arkansa | And there is the unglued top on the bowl. Starting to look like an Adamas again!
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Location: When?? | What an amazing journey this is turning into. It could almost satisfy one's sense of morbid curiosity. Much like sitting in the observation gallery of an emergency operating room while a skilled and creative surgeon does their magic on a disfigured wreck victim. Heck, we even get to witness real blood. And seeing that chunk of cut off treble bout laying in the background makes it all that much more gory. Nice work, Doc! |
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Location: Birmingham, AL | <p>Looks like the modifiied treble soundhole is going to look excellent. I like the red top also! Really a great job so far!!</p>
Edited by clrules 2019-11-05 5:15 AM
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Location: Birmingham, AL | <p>Duplicate post</p>
Edited by clrules 2019-11-05 5:13 AM
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Location: Ozark, Arkansa | So, I still have more work to do on the bowl repairs, but I am starting to get ready for the top. Dan, what do I need for epoxy, or will hide glue work? Is the adhesive for the bridge the same as the top? And in one of your posts, I think you mentioned using balsa wood for bracing. Obviously this top is already braced, but I am thinking about my next build. I would think balsa is too flimsy. What is up with that? |
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Location: Ozark, Arkansa | BTW, my next experiment is going to be a longleaf pine (yellow) top, with no added bracing. I have an Ultra with a trash top, but a really good bowl and neck, as the recipient body.
I found a quartersawn 16' clear 6" plank at my local lumberyard. Wide grain, but I think I might like that effect. If not, I can stain or paint it.
So now you are wondering, how am I going to make a strong resonant top without adding bracing...?
Mwaaahahahah...
Edited by Oldvation Guy 2019-11-09 5:57 AM
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Location: Ozark, Arkansa | Decided to get most of my fiberglass work done today. I will be pretty close to being finished, if not complete, by the end of the day. I will probably do some minor sanding, but hey, no one will ever see this on the inside of the bowl. I have to rein in the perfectionist in me so I can get this done!
Repairing the suspension ring has been interesting on the bass side upper bout. I will trim the excess glass after I have it up to thickness.
Edited by Oldvation Guy 2019-11-09 11:38 AM
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Location: Pueblo West, CO | Oldvation Guy - 2019-11-08 6:43 PM
So, I still have more work to do on the bowl repairs, but I am starting to get ready for the top. Dan, what do I need for epoxy, or will hide glue work? Is the adhesive for the bridge the same as the top? And in one of your posts, I think you mentioned using balsa wood for bracing. Obviously this top is already braced, but I am thinking about my next build. I would think balsa is too flimsy. What is up with that?
Hi Steve,
Unfortunately, hide glue only works on wood-to-wood joints.
I use Hysol 0151 for most of my Ovation work including top and bridge gluing. It works on all types of glue joints. McMaster-Carr sells it. It's a little pricey at $20/cartridge.
You'll need to buy the applicator gun (~$24) to go with it as the cartridges lack external plungers. It is sold in tubes, but the mix ratio for it is 2.7:1 by volume.
Generally speaking, the longer an epoxy takes to cure the more rigid it will be once it is cured. The faster it cures, the more rubbery it will be. Also, I like the longer working time I get from slow-cure epoxies like 0151. It makes it easier to clean up before the glue cures hard.
I use balsa for cauls, such as the bridge-clamping caul, not the braces. It's soft enough so it doesn't mark the bridge and it's easy to shape.
These days I like using torrefied Adi spruce for the braces regardless of what species of wood is used for the top. Of course, these days I only use torrefied wood for the top.
I would not use torrefied braces on a non-torrefied top, nor would I use non-torrefied braces on a torrefied top.
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Location: Ozark, Arkansa | More of the smoothing work tonight.
I went to the body shop where I will have it painted to get advice. I figure these guys know fiberglass prep and paint better than anyone else I know. The guy there was very encouraging about what I have done so far for repairs.
He recommended that I get glazing to fill in the tiny pinholes left from the repairs and the low spots. It is very thin and goes on like buttercream frosting. The little pink specks you see are where the glazing fills the pinholes. I will probably do one more application of glaze tomorrow night. A little more fiberglass work this weekend, and possibly application of primer.
I still have repair work to do on the decorative trim on the suspension ring, but I am fairly confident I can repair it so the damaged spots will not be noticeable.
Should be in paint within two weeks!
Can't wait!
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Location: Pueblo West, CO | The repairs are looking really good, Steve.
Dan |
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Location: Muenster/Germany | Looks good and stable. I can feel with you, I once had an Ovation that had fallen from a wall-hanger (not without dragging a second guitar...it was a terrible noise) and also I got my hands full to repair the bowl. But it was just a little crack. Your repair looks magic to me. |
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Location: Ozark, Arkansa | More bowl work today, but I thought I would show the next step on the top.
The upper treble bout had to be cut away to fit the cutaway body. But that left the remaining sound holes open. Although I am covering the area with a custom pic guard, I don't want to leave the holes behind it in case they eventually show up in the pic guard material as slight depressions.
So, there is enough material that I cut off the top that I can make plugs out of it for the holes. Here is my first one.
I think I might change up how I am shaping them, so there is more resin that will flow around them when I put them in permanently. I am careful to line up the weave of the top when I cut them.
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Location: Pueblo West, CO | Looks good Steve.
Something to keep in mind is that as you close up these holes the bass response of the guitar will increase.
When I was building my Frankenvation, I left three of the holes on the treble bout open so the highs wouldn't disappear. 
Edited by DanSavage 2019-11-25 12:48 PM
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Location: Muenster/Germany | If you want to slightly cover the repaired holes, the color is "brown red" 53011. |
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Location: Muenster/Germany | DanSavage - 2019-11-25 7:46 PM Looks good Steve.
Something to keep in mind is that as you close up these holes the bass response of the guitar will increase.
When I was building my Frankenvation, I left three of the holes on the treble bout open so the highs wouldn't disappear.
You are right, the bass response is better with the unilateral soundholes. But it is brighter and more transparent with the holes on the treble sinde, that´s why I added soundholes on the treble side on my Adamas 2008. The effect is even stronger when you play on the higher frets.
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Location: Ozark, Arkansa | Interesting. One thing I have considered doing is adding the player port on the bass side next to the battery box so I get a better sound experience when I play.
I have also considered putting new sound holes through the pick guard, possibly in the pattern of the Phoenix bird I want on the top. This may be the encouragement I need to pursue that option. But leaving the holes as they were was not an option. Taking out the cutaway section left them poorly placed.
Another possibility would be to replace the battery box with the sound port, and move the battery with a new box to an alternate location. I might look at that seriously as well.
Edited by Oldvation Guy 2019-11-27 6:59 AM
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Location: When?? | Detlef.. not only did adding the holes increase your treble response, it also made your ivy grow thicker and greener. But what I'm curious to know is, what is the red spot thing on the bass side of the bridge?? |
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Location: Muenster/Germany | Ha,ha, that´s a small wodden june bug that I once got from my daughter. I had it glued on my workbench for a couple of years but when I found out that the Adamas carvings are no "broccoli" but acanthus leaves I thought this could be a better place;-) |
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Location: Ozark, Arkansa | LOL! I wondered the same thing about the red dot...
And with that, all the holes in the top are filled. I will back the plugs with a sheer fabric and resin to minimize mass on the top, but to give just enough reinforcement to make sure they stay put. I set them with CA glue from the top side, but I will use fiberglass resin on the bottom side.
The hardest one to fill was the sliver edge of the large sound hole which just overlapped the cutaway section. But when I am finished it will be impossible to see.
The custom pick guard will cover the entire area that the epaulet and the painted pick guard occupied. But I am still working through the final shape, and the color of the material I want to use.
To experiment I downloaded pics of all the pick guard materials offered on Ebay, and printed them off full sheet size on my color printer. That way I got the best opportunity to experiment with colors and shapes for the final pick guard.
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Location: Birmingham, AL | Looking good! |
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Location: Ozark, Arkansa | Finally have some time to get back on this project guitar.
I decided today to prime the whole bowl so I can hunt for defects. I have several pin holes that are driving me out of my mind. I have tried using professional glaze, high build primer, but they keep reappearing.
I went to the body shop where I will have the bowl painted, and the guy there really didn't have any suggestions beyond what I have tried already, so I may resort to taking a tiny drill and bore all the way through the bowl wall, and then fill it. Rather drastic, but I am running out of ideas.
I have included a couple of shots of what I started out with, so I guess I am pretty encouraged at this point.
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Location: Yokohama, Japan | WOW! That's some fine FR restoration work. Did you layup additional fiberglass sheets and smooth them out before applying the primer coat? Amazing! Carry-on! Carry-on! Thanks for sharing! |
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Location: Ozark, Arkansa | Arumako, I wanted to save myself the nightmare of having uneven surface on the exterior of the bowl. I would never have gotten it as smooth as I wanted it. So I basically avoided putting anything on the outside except filler in the actual cracks and dings.
I wanted to keep the repairs as thin as possible. I used CA to glue the crack edges together to keep them as level as possible. Because of the constant curvature of the bowl, it was a challenge to do more than a small section at a time. In a lot of spots there were (for lack of a better term) flakes of finish or places where the internal fiberglass sheeting had separated. Using CA glue allowed me to wick it back into the material, and then put the outside flakes back into place without changing the wall thickness much at all.
After the edges were positioned and glued, I cut strips of fiberglass 1" wide on the bias allowing only a half inch of glass on each side of the cracks. That held down the weight of the repair, and minimized the amount of absorption of sound waves in the bowl. Hopefully the repairs will have a minimal impact on the resonance of the bowl. It still has a nice ring when I tap it.
Edited by Oldvation Guy 2020-05-03 8:45 PM
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Location: When?? | Amazing work!! |
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Location: Ozark, Arkansa | Thanks, Love O Fair. Even as a recovering perfectionist, I am pretty pleased so far when I think of what I started with.
The real challenge is yet to come, restoring the damage to the suspension ring ornamental ridge. At least a half dozen damaged spots. I am preparing myself for "good enough" repairs on that trim. |
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Adamas II 1581 Rebuild
