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Location: Canada | arthurseery - 2015-04-11 1:23 PM But their job is NOT to Make Guitars... Their job is to Make Money.] Greed knows no boundaries it would seem. Well that's the purpose of every business isn't it (maybe with the exception of Ubuntu). So unless you have some benevolent sponsor there is always a need to be profitable to be able to pay for supplies, labour, infrastructure, research, etc in the long term and provide a readson for the the enterprise to exist. Its not constructive in this thread to look backwards on how to NOT accomplish that goal, but rather appreciate the idea that the new owners seem to be commited to finding a way on how this could be done with Ovation. This has been discussed quite a bit over the last few days/weeks and I think most have come to the realization that this will not be an easy task and will have to overcome a lot of hurdles. But I think we all hope that there will enough goodwill, skills, assets, innovation AND financial backing to make this work somehow and hpefully in a few years we will have opportunity to buy a new Adamas again.
Edited by d'ovation 2015-04-11 3:16 PM
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | I cannot understand why some people feel a need to defend corporate greed... Every Time.
Also, I was responding to the statement:
jbblunck - 2015-04-11 9:28 AM
Amazing to me how Ovation's business cratered so quickly with the purchase by Fender.
It is possible to make a good product and a good profit without screwing people.
“Customer first, employee second, shareholder third” So sez Jack Ma.
Many companies do that... Fender ain't one of them.
Edited by Old Man Arthur 2015-04-11 6:42 PM
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Location: Pacific Northwest Inland Empire | We have plenty of time to debate the issue. "Time will tell". Bottom line though- "Put your money, where your mouth is". |
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Location: Pacific Northwest Inland Empire | And, a lot of mouths. |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | merlin666 - 2015-04-11 1:15 PM arthurseery - 2015-04-11 1:23 PM But their job is NOT to Make Guitars... Their job is to Make Money.] Greed knows no boundaries it would seem. Well that's the purpose of every business isn't it "purpose" Actually no. For some yes, but not for all by long shot. Investment Cap companies and the like look at how to make money. Money is their commoditiy. But for the rest... most of the most successful companies and corporations make a product or provide a service they are best at... the money is just icing on the cake, the reward if you will. |
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Location: NJ | Ive been trying to get a gibralter order since namm....... |
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Location: Steeler Nation, Hudson Valley Contingent | I've spent the weekend mulling over my conversation with Bill. And though I certainly retain a respectful level of caution about getting my hopes too high (Who wouldn't after last year huh?). I have come to one conclusion that is too positive to keep to myself.
Everything he said had far too many details to be nothing but pure market-speak. His ideas were thought through with some sincere attention to detail. His questions for me were based in reality and often related to many topics discussed on this forum and others with regards to strengths and weakness of the Ovation BRAND and CONCEPT, not the guitars themselves. This is an important distinction. He knows , just like we do, that the instruments are good. He is focused on getting them into people's hands to see for themselves.
In other words, they are taking their time, thinking things through, and nosing around in both obvious and discreet ways to get feedback from the people who play guitars at every skill level. It is difficult to not be at least a little impressed with the effort if nothing else.
So I remain cautiously hopeful. Which is a darn sight better than how I felt about Ovation a week ago. |
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Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota | I don't think that they got to the Market Position that they are at now, and have the Big Name Drummers (I will take your word for that) using their Products, if they didn't *know* their demographics, and their Target Audience.
And then to be able to use that knowledge to give the Artists what they wanted in a Quality Product to keep bringing them back for more.
Selling one of something crappy gives you a sale, but not the base and resales that you need to advance and compete in the Market and earn that Name for yourself. And if people don't come back, you are constantly looking for more people to dump just one piece on. It is a never ending race to earn a buck and stay in business. But if you make Quality, and do your due diligence on the market, the product and explore every possible avenue to get it out there, and make people WANT it, and come BACK for more, you have a solid base and a good chance at a long and profitable run with it.
DW did this with their Drums, and now they are doing it with our Ovations/Adamas. I am hoping that what they launch will be something we can all be proud of, and Want To Have! It would be a Win/Win for all of us then! I am very Excited, but then again, I am always Excited, I rely on level heads like yours to keep me in check!  |
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Location: Texas | But for the rest... most of the most successful companies and corporations make a product or provide a service they are best at... the money is just icing on the cake, the reward if you will. If there were no icing...they would not be a successful company. The bottom line is always the purpose...or it's a hobby or Radio Shack, Edsel, Kodak, Ovation, etc. This is probably a chicken/egg discussion.
Edited by jay 2015-04-13 11:58 AM
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Location: Steeler Nation, Hudson Valley Contingent | I've always felt that there is a great difference between turning a good, comfortable profit and squeezing every thin dime from an enterprise to the exclusion of all other business concerns. The second can only be accomplished by trading off quality and stripping down labor cost. Such slash and burn profit mongering does not lend itself to long-term business success for a variety of reasons. |
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Location: closely held secret | Companies are in business to make money, period. Otherwise, they'd be non-profits.
There's a difference between making money and making money in an intelligent, sustainable fashion. The former is "damn the torpedos and who cares about the customer once they've paid". The latter requires actually caring about the customer satisfaction long term. |
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Location: Sunshine State, Australia | I don't think Ovation will ever regain anywhere near the reputation it once enjoyed. Too many guitarists regard it as a cheap low-medium quality (crap) guitar and I firmly believe the reason behind it stems from somebody's STUPID decision to call Celebacies 'Ovations'. Regardless of the quality of the products that may come of this venture, it's going to take some pretty nifty marketing to shift the attitude of established guitar players, which is where I assume the US made product will be aimed. Nifty marketing, AND innovation, AND quality. Thats a big ask. |
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Location: Sydney, Australia | It's do-able though. Think about Japanese cars in the early '70s - cheap crap. Then they became, good value for money. Now it means quality at a reasonable price. |
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Location: Flahdaw | richard.parker - 2015-04-13 10:58 PM
It's do-able though. Think about Japanese cars in the early '70s - cheap crap. Then they became, good value for money. Now it means quality at a reasonable price.
Think about AMERICAN cars in the 80's - cheap crap. Then they became, good value for the money. |
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Location: south east Michigan | Agreed Bob. |
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Location: Orlando, FL | I think Ovation is a brand ready for a competent reboot/relaunch.
It is possible to overcome the sins of the past - low quality import guitars indistinguishable from high quality USA models - and generate new interest in the brand. But it's not a simple task. I feel better about a longer more purposeful process than I would if the mothership were just reopened tomorrow. |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | It is not like all of those "low quality import guitars indistinguishable from high quality USA models" are gonna disappear. As we speak, I am sure that hundreds of AX, TX, and Celebrity guitars are working their way through the assembly lines of Asia.
And Ovation will forever be plagued by "I played an Ovation once a Guitar Center, it was crap".*
But! Everyday that I go out an play someone compliments my Ovation/Adamas.
(and it ain't cuz of my playing) 
*BTW-- I played a couple of Martin HPL guitars next to a Celebrity at a Guitar Center and the Celebrity sounded much better than any of the HPL Martins, which sounded like wet cardboard compared to a CC24.
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Location: Orlando, FL | Arthur you are very right about all those lower quality ones not going anywhere soon. But ideally there will be something to identify the new from the old. Maybe it's as simple as a new label or maybe something altogether new. But if they make a great product that CAN be distinguished from what came before - both good and bad, and they can get them in the hands of infulencers, then a lot of naysayers will give them another chance.
Sad to say but I think, ideally, if you could look at a new (future production model) Ovation and say, "Oh this is one of the new ones!", that would be a good thing. It's f'ing crazy that ovation built $400 guitars that looked almost identical to $4000 guitars!
With a rebranding or relaunch, you want to draw a line in the sand and say this is who we are now, and this is what we do now. Sometimes you build on your legacy, sometimes you distance yourself from it. Often it's a bit of both. |
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Location: Denmark | Its almost like christmas. You never know what Santa brings :-) |
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Location: Canada | Designzilla ideally, if you could look at a new (future production model) Ovation and say, "Oh this is one of the new ones!", that would be a good thing. It's f'ing crazy that ovation built $400 guitars that looked almost identical to $4000 guitars! With a rebranding or relaunch, you want to draw a line in the sand and say this is who we are now, and this is what we do now. I think that just before the end they did some tinkering with a new logo and headstock and a bridge with pins. There was some prototype that was released and discussed here. I don't think that was the right direction to go, though. |
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Location: Cologne/Germany | Hi guys, tomorow the german music fair starts at Frankfurt, Namm's European equivalent. Found out that Ovation will be there... so I did a bit of research. The address given on the fair's website for the brand is Lunar Court 3450 93030 Oxnard CA you may know that one? Then I Found out that the Guitars will be shown by GEWAmusic, a distributor. they also do DW drums in Germany. So I guess they are the actual distributor in Germany ( which used to be Fender). unfortunately, or, strangely, the GEWA website does not work. But on their Facebook account I found a photo. (Which is just an illustration). anyway, with Ovation Logo . Will try to post it. Georg
Edited by red-twins 2015-04-14 4:23 PM
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Location: Cologne/Germany | Sorry for the mistakes. My "german" iPad's word correction is getting on my nerves...
Edited by red-twins 2015-04-14 4:26 PM
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Location: Cologne/Germany | That's it, you did better than me....will be there on thursday
Edited by red-twins 2015-04-14 4:29 PM
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Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota | red-twins - 2015-04-14 4:28 PM
That's it, you did better than me....will be there on thursday
PLEASE take pictures for us????
That set up is Classy, incorporates Modern Lines with Old Wood Beauty and Quality. The guitars are hung at a playable angle, good lighting! The deck or walkway staging with the simple barstool... I like it!!!
Edited by naellis58 2015-04-14 8:20 PM
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I heard from DRUM WORKS yesterday!
