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Location: SE Michigan | Totally hypothetical here, but if it was 100 to 10 to 1 then potential sales dollars might look like...
100 buyers in a range of $300 - $600 ............ $30,000 - $60,000
10 buyers in a range of $700 - $3,000 ........... $7,000 - $30,000
1 buyer in a range of $4,000 - $15,000 ....... $4,000 - $15,000
Your proportions are probably about right, but don't forget that there are at least a couple dozen competitors trying to carve market share out of those same segments. I would also expect that the profit margin gets thinner as you get near the bottom end of the price range. There is money to be made in all three categories, many companies do just fine by finding their niche. |
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Location: Northwest Arkansas | I play almost every guitar that costs over $1000.00, on a regular basis, to satisfy my gas. Plugged-in, Ovation rivals any guitar on the market. Acoustic. They come up rather flat. I'm not talking about the "older" Hartford guitars, I'm talking about the new stuff. Not one "import" sounds remotely like an acoustic. I love Ovations, but most of us play unplugged a large amount of the time. I believe Fender could give a rat's rear about Ovation. That's why they put Guild in Hartford. I don't see nice things as far as Ovation in the future. The signature models and the Adamii might do OK if they don't price them out of the market. You all have heard me talk about my love for Ovation. You know what Fender does to acoustics. I'll leave it there. |
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Location: Chicago | "Acoustic. They come up rather flat." (?) I beg to differ. Listen for a few seconds to our UNPLUGGED Adamas and Elite below ("GUITARFIRE CD > Audio" ). I've been to Guitar Center/Sam Ash etc. many times, played many axes. My 1581-5 is superior. It's not "brand loyalty": it's ears, heart and hands.
Edited by dobro 2013-05-08 6:33 AM
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Location: Northwest Arkansas | I said the sig models and the Adamaii would do "Okay". I'll keep my 2005 Adamas, but I've sold everything else. I agree 100% that the older O's sounded great. But the new ones. I've seen the same one's sit on the wall at my local store for 2 years. He cleans them and puts new strings on them. They just don't sell. I just think Fender couldn't care less about Ovation. That's too bad. They make some great guitars. But when all people get to play are the cheap laminate top "Celebrities", they don't actually get to play the Ovation standard.. I compare the Celebrity to the Dodge "K" car. They had the Dodge name but that was it. Someone who would love and care for the brand, please buy the company and give Ovation a fighting chance.
Edited by AdamasW597 2013-05-09 8:42 AM
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Location: Chicago | Hey, at least Kaki is carrying the Adamas torch! I'm more impressed with her than with Saylor Twit. I would not doubt that the "skinny" girl plays Taylors because she likes the coincidence of name and brand |
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Location: Right now? | "Noah", be careful; you don't want squirrels building a nest in that guitar (haha)! 
Willa
Edited by WillaMuse 2013-05-16 1:03 PM
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Location: closely held secret | Ovations still show up... Nice uke. 
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Location: Chicago | OK, so here's my last thought as we watch the Ovation recede into the sunset. Because it has an awesome legacy, whatta you wanna bet that in X years it will be revived like flare pants, turntables + vinyl, or the Ford Mustang? .... a beautiful retro gem amidst a swamp of generic electric-acoustics! Hip once more! In order for that to happen, however, it has to RIP for quite a while. It would not hurt to clear the horizon of the low end trash. I think of this example: after the 35-year tsunami of digital keys and synths I now note refurbished MINIMOOGs on stage again. Why? They are super-cool and have an unique voice. Heyday: 1970-75. |
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Location: SE Michigan | BTW I was just in Guitar center the other day. I played the new Martin Artist Series, nice but nothing to get all worked up about and i dont like the new neck profile. Know what caught my eye (and ears)?? The low end Taylors. I was quite impressed with what you can get in a Taylor guitar for $500-$800. Looks like Taylor has dialed in a way to deliver a very serviceable solid-top guitar at near entry level prices. After playing a few I think the competition should be concerned. |
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Location: Sunshine State, Australia | legend74 - 2013-05-18 5:08 AM OK, so here's my last thought as we watch the Ovation recede into the sunset. Because it has an awesome legacy, whatta you wanna bet that in X years it will be revived like flare pants, turntables + vinyl, or the Ford Mustang? .... a beautiful retro gem amidst a swamp of generic electric-acoustics! Hip once more! In order for that to happen, however, it has to RIP for quite a while. It would not hurt to clear the horizon of the low end trash. I think of this example: after the 35-year tsunami of digital keys and synths I now note refurbished MINIMOOGs on stage again. Why? They are super-cool and have an unique voice. Heyday: 1970-75. Another example - valve amps! |
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Location: Tennessee | Looks like Taylor has dialed in a way to deliver a very serviceable solid-top guitar at near entry level prices. After playing a few I think the competition should be concerned. Made in Mexico. |
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Location: Pacific Northwest Inland Empire | Speculation & conjecture. All very fine, and accurate, "in the eye of the beholder", though I agree with Paul- "the music is in me". I love these guitars, think they are inherently a better design, but will not mourn & writhe in pain, with their fading. That's business. I deal with beancounters, understand their role, don't always agree with their direction, but THAT'S BUSINESS! And yes, it affects, to an extent, the quality of my life, but there are bigger-fish-to-fry.
I like checkin' in, so keep up the diatribe. |
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| It's funny... I've been a pro for years but only started playing Ovations 13 months ago.... And from the very moment I walked into a gig, rehearsal or sound check I've had to defend my choice of guitar... I now know what is meant by the "O" stigma! I believe a lot of it comes from the fallout of the import market. I made a point of a buying a vintage Hartford made Custom Legend when I went looking for an acoustic/electric knowing that I'd be getting the real deal and at least could decide for myself if it was a quality instrument. I think a lot of the negative vibes come from two places... People are turned off by the "plastic"... And.... The music business in all of it's forms has turned it's back on innovation. Everything has to be "vintage" or "reliced" or ROOTS.... Some how a throw back to a past era. Ovations were designed and built during the Space Age. People have a tendency these days to celebrate the musical styles of the past.... Like Dobro wrote just above... Years from now people will rediscover Al Dimiola and modern music and Ovations will be all the rage. Will. |
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Location: Australia | I couldn't care less about any perceived O stigma any more. Most people speak out of ignorance because they've never played a decent one. I've seen more than one convert who's been floored by the sound of my Adamas.
I really thought Fender would've done a great job with O just like they did with Gretsch.
This really sums up Fender's attitude towards Ovation. The stupidest pic I've ever seen.
http://www.themusiczoo.com/blog/2013/factory-tour-fender-custom-sho... |
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Location: south east Michigan | Fender & the ol' Mothership.
Reminds me of a foreign invaders occupation of another country.
Never the less.... They are doing good work at the old mill by the river, and that's a good thing.
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I wonder what ever happened to Ovation's laser vibrometer.
That was an interesting machine.
I'd think it would be just as useful a tool for a wood box as a roundback. |
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Location: Flahdaw | Brad Durasa - 2013-05-20 9:55 AM
I wonder what ever happened to Ovation's laser vibrometer.
I believe that it and the world famous Orgasmatron are now part of JeffW's unique but warped collection of personal pleasure devices. |
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Location: Chicago | One more thing: My experience on YouTube reveals that many vintage shows by the Big Boys feature a TERRIBLE sound from an Ovation. It has to do with venue, pickup + PA, Pickup direct, bac micing etc. But there is a lot of unfair "evidence" from the days when sound production was more primitive. This for example, is not Al's best sound (maybe the cheesy chorus?): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LyLNYdKIVgM
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Location: Miami | It's a shame that potential guitar buyers can't hear a higher end O or Adamas with an OP-PRO through a Bose L1 or the like, instead of hearing a low end Celebrity unplugged and forming their opinion of Ovation on that :-/
(nothing against Celebs, just sayin'
Edited by Jukebox Joe 2013-05-22 9:53 AM
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Location: Sunshine State, Australia | joetunon - 2013-05-23 12:52 AM :-/ (nothing against Celebs, just sayin') I've always said (and others) that's the real reason for the Stigma. Nothing to do with marketing or endorsements or availability or accessibility or slipping off your knee. A Celebrity is NOT an Ovation. They are what they are - a cheap wannabe. If you've owned a real USA 'O', you know the Celibacy's are cheap s#it. Well made cheap s#it, but cheap s#it. If that offends anyone, get over it. THEY'RE NOT OVATIONS! They should NEVER have had the Ovation marque on the headstock. Have 'Celebrity - by Ovation' on the Label by all means, but call a spade a spade. |
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Location: sitting at my computer | joetunon - ... (nothing against Celebs, just sayin') just agreein' |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Time for the Celebrity Bashing...
My first "Ovation" was a made-in-Korea 4861 Balladeer.
I have owned CC44, CC57, GC057, TC12, multiple CS257's, CSE24's, CSE44, CC54i,
and I currently have a CC29S-4C.
All of them were/are nice guitars for what they are... affordable guitars.
I would match the quality of a Korean CSE Celebrity to the current AX series.
(which is why they don't make the CSE series anymore)
Celebrity Guitars have nothing to do with the "O Stigma"...
(USA Ovation owners bash Celebrity's more than the general public)
Crappy-sounding X-series Martins haven't caused people to say that CF Martins suck.
Amongst the "guitar community" people don't like Ovations because they are Plastic.
"They sound like a Toy" "They don't sound like Wood" "They slide off of you Leg"
All of those are code words to try and hide prejudices of people who have never played an Ovation.
But somehow a Rainsong, Blackbird, Emerald, or Composite Acoustics are Cool.
(But as good as the CA guitars may have been, they could not survive financially)
My Prejudice is that I heard and played-with an Ovation in 1971, and I was hooked.
People in the General Public bash Ovations because they have heard other people do it.
And they want to be accepted by the tribe.
It is like bashing the Yankees... You don't even have to like baseball, it is just FUN!  |
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Location: Miami | OMA, I agree that lower end Martins don't cause people to say Martins suck, but the point is that you can find both hanging on the wall. Not any more with Ovation, though. The Celebs are now their ONLY point of reference. And that's what sucks.
I also agree that people bash Ovations because they have heard other people do it. Nevertheless, we know what we got, and so do our audiences. And as I've said before, people STILL ooh and ah at my Ovation and Adamas like they've never seen or heard anything like it before. I could totally see what someone else said: high end USA Ovations coming back as a specialty collector's item with a whole new audience to appreciate them.
Until then, as I said, we and our audiences know the goods when they hear and see them. |
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Location: sitting at my computer | joetunon - ... Not any more with Ovation, though. The Celebs are now their ONLY point of reference. And that's what sucks. agreein' again! Yes most initial O bashers were "plastic" haters who probably never even played an Ovation. But nowadays even IF they wanted to actually try one they likely can't. I doubt if their opinion will change much with only Celebrity models hanging on the store walls. Maybe if they're honestly comparing 'em to the equally priced options. Imagine trying to form an opinion about beer when all you ever get to taste is Budweiser.  |
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| I think it's the cheaper ones that set me off. The first time I ever saw an Ovation was when I was 15. My friend's cute sister had one. I tried it and it sounded like crap, but I had nothing to compare it to. I just thought Ovations were cheap starter guitars. It wasn't until earlier this year that I tried a vintage Ovation Glen Campbell and fell in love. The sound and quality was there. Upon more research I found that vintage Ovations are the best, aside from the US ones, of course. They just fell into the import-hype that all major companies fell into. Personally, I really love the older models and I want to add one to my collection as soon as possible. I think it's just poor education, along with an absence of PR. |
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Location: Flahdaw | I would like to see the sales figures. Just how many CHEAP Ovation imports are they selling in the US, and what is the total net profit from those sales. Chances are, if I was CEO, I would say "let's just drop the product in the US." |
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The "O Stigma": getting the truth
