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Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

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Oldvation Guy

Posted 2019-10-08 11:33 AM (#550046 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
May 2011
Posts: 81

Location: Ozark, Arkansa

Many thanks to Al for supplying the manhole cover, and a new rosewood Ovation bridge! I was originally going to go with an Ovation thin slot ebony bridge if I could find one, when it suddenly dawned on me. The carbon fiber top is already going to sound bright without emphasizing that even more. So, the rosewood and wide Ovation pickup may soften that a bit.

More thoughts of the mad scientist...The bridge is going to be a focal point of the Phoenix theme. I will either hand carve wings into the bridge, or use other thin pieces of wood to create the wings of the Phoenix. Then I will add a tail below, and head above the bridge. Can't wait!

Oldvation Guy

Posted 2019-10-09 9:06 PM (#550066 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
May 2011
Posts: 81

Location: Ozark, Arkansa

It just struck me, the new top is en route from the west coast, the bowl access cover and bridge are en route from the east coast, and I am in the middle of the country trying to put Humpty Dumpty back together again.

What a blast!

Dan, what do you think are the chances of removing the right side epaulet intact? Or will I just have to sand it down? As I mentioned earlier, I could only get the full dreadnaught size top from Thomas. I will be turning it into a cutaway top and then placing a custom pick guard over that area.

Basically, this pic below is what I am aiming for, with the addition of the pick guard in the upper right quarter, and then the custom woodwork at the bridge.

Edited by Oldvation Guy 2019-10-09 9:31 PM

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Oldvation Guy

Posted 2019-10-09 9:40 PM (#550067 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
May 2011
Posts: 81

Location: Ozark, Arkansa

LOL! I just noticed in the pic, the left ear is broken off exactly like my headstock! But I know it isn't my guitar pre-bashing, because mine has a full preamp, not the knobs.

DanSavage

Posted 2019-10-10 2:21 PM (#550071 - in reply to #550066)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 2316

Location: Pueblo West, CO

Oldvation Guy - 2019-10-09 7:06 PM

Dan, what do you think are the chances of removing the right side epaulet intact? Or will I just have to sand it down?

It's probably glued down with epoxy, so it could be heated to soften it. The CF/birch/CF is probably also epoxy.

The tricky part is to heat up the epaulet enough to soften the glue holding it to the top, but not heat up the top so much that it softens the epoxy holding the CF to the birch.

That being the case, it would be safer to sand it down.

arumako

Posted 2019-10-11 5:56 AM (#550078 - in reply to #550046)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
October 2012
Posts: 1034

Location: Yokohama, Japan

Oldvation Guy - 2019-10-08 1:33 AM

More thoughts of the mad scientist...The bridge is going to be a focal point of the Phoenix theme. I will either hand carve wings into the bridge, or use other thin pieces of wood to create the wings of the Phoenix. Then I will add a tail below, and head above the bridge. Can't wait!

Wow! That sounds exciting! Really enjoying being a spectator in the farthest eastern corner of the earth here. WRT removal of the epis...you might try putting some boiled water into a ziploc freezer bag, and place that on top of the epi. I've used the technique to remove bridges, epi's and even necks.

I'm not sure as to the type of adhesives used to keep the Adamas birch/FRP sandwich together, but I suspect they are resin based products. And if other Os are any indication, it will probably be able to withstand the heat of boiling water without separating. As long as you don't get too aggressive, you should be able to take it off pretty clean. Covering the epi's first with some masking tape has been helpful for me. Once off, the epi's will have a tendency to curl-up (the tape keeps the pieces together). Spray a little bit of water on the underside of the epis and iron at a low temperature by applying pressure slowly and the epis will flatten out. Once it flattens out, there might be a need to keep the epi pieces together with some CA or epoxy, and it can be stored for use in a different project.

However, since my experience in this regard revolves more around Celebritys and not Adamii (have never worked on an Adamas), I defer to whatever Dan says! Really enjoying your thread and definitely sending good vibes your way! Thanks for sharing!

By the way, what kind of human species keeps a stash of Adamas tops like that just sitting around? How and where you guys source your stuff is just out of this world!

Edited by arumako 2019-10-11 6:07 AM

Jonmark Stone

Posted 2019-10-11 8:44 AM (#550080 - in reply to #550045)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
May 2008
Posts: 1555

Location: Indiana

Oldvation Guy - The carbon fiber top is already going to sound bright without emphasizing that even more. So, the rosewood and wide Ovation pickup may soften that a bit.

Don't know how many of these woven tops you've played before but if you're expecting it to be bright, I think you're in for a surprise.

I'm enjoying your project.

Oldvation Guy

Posted 2019-10-11 9:35 AM (#550083 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
May 2011
Posts: 81

Location: Ozark, Arkansa

Thanks for the tips on removing the epaulet. I think I will try to remove it before I resort to sanding it off. I might repurpose the wood pieces for the Phoenix bird I am putting on the top. If not, I have a really good selection of wood to choose from to make the bird.

I just reached out to the Ovation repair shop for a price to put the original finish back on. They asked for pics to quote a price for repairs...I wish I could be there when they look at the devastation. Made it clear, AGAIN, that all I want is their price for painting the whole bowl. I am still leaning toward a shiny bowl finish of my own.

Al's parts should be here today, but the top won't arrive until later next week. Doesn't matter, I will be gone this weekend and I have a TON to do before I can even think of mounting the top.

I discovered I can buy pick guard material by the sheet and create my own custom pick guard. That will be fun too. I have a daughter who is a sculptor grad student who told me how to make molds to repair my battered suspension ring trim, so that will be an adventure in itself.

Jonmark, I am just going by what I have heard of carbon fiber guitars on YouTube. I have never actually played one myself. But hey, the Adamas top is just a high end laminated top, right? JK.

The bowl repairs are going better than I feared they might. This is going well. Just dragging out because of splicing it into life...

Edited by Oldvation Guy 2019-10-11 9:51 AM

Jonmark Stone

Posted 2019-10-11 10:41 AM (#550084 - in reply to #550083)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
May 2008
Posts: 1555

Location: Indiana

These textured adamas tops are real cannons. Balanced but plenty of rumble. You're going to like it.
Carry on. Fun to watch.

Oldvation Guy

Posted 2019-10-13 8:48 PM (#550124 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: RE: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
May 2011
Posts: 81

Location: Ozark, Arkansa

Decided to start smoothing some of the repairs inside the bowl. Used a Dremel tool with a beveled stone to take off the high points of the material buildup. Lots more crack repairing to go, but very encouraged so far.

I will have to make a special jig to realign at least one spot where the suspension ring broke through I had hope to use a clamp and a couple of pieces of masonite treated with mold release to flatten the spot at the cutaway. But after it had set, and I removed the pieces, it still was not as aligned as I want it to be. I will cut the crack open now that the fiberglass layer is stabilized and hardened, and line everything up with a different approach. I will get a pic when I do that.

Once I have all the cracks satisfactorily leveled on the inside of the bowl, I will put thin fiberglass over those repairs on the inside of the bowl, but not more than necessary, to try to preserve the tonal quality. If I don't take those high spots down first the repairs will be uneven, and thicker than I want.

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Oldvation Guy

Posted 2019-10-15 7:38 PM (#550158 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: RE: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
May 2011
Posts: 81

Location: Ozark, Arkansa

Decided to tackle the ear replacement tonight. I was blessed to discover that I had some vintage mahogany in an old end table we were getting rid of a couple of years ago. The wood is an amazing match for the mahogany in Ovation necks/headstocks.

I rough cut a chunk to check against the headstock after I trimmed the broken edge away with my bandsaw. The bits of dark brown on both are blade burn. A little light sanding removed that. The tone of the chunk is slightly darker because of the angle away from the light. It is close enough for me!

Edited by Oldvation Guy 2019-10-15 7:41 PM

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Oldvation Guy

Posted 2019-10-15 7:45 PM (#550159 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: RE: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
May 2011
Posts: 81

Location: Ozark, Arkansa

Next, I masked off the headstock to prevent bleed over of the CA glue. I only applied glue to the headstock, not the donor piece.

After I removed the tape I could see from the bleed over to the donor piece, the finished ear should be really really close to the original finish color. Grain lined up nicely, and the little bit of end grain visible underneath the headstock should show up in the donor piece because I mounted it an an angle.

I will leave it to harden completely overnight.

Edited by Oldvation Guy 2019-10-15 7:50 PM

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DanSavage

Posted 2019-10-16 12:05 PM (#550165 - in reply to #550159)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 2316

Location: Pueblo West, CO

It looks good.

I've always used hide glue (OBG) when repairing ears, mainly because if the piece doesn't match when sanded, it's easy to remove.

Oldvation Guy

Posted 2019-10-17 7:49 PM (#550179 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: RE: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
May 2011
Posts: 81

Location: Ozark, Arkansa

I discovered I had the grain oriented wrong on my chunk and had to take it off. I took your advice, Dan, and used hide glue to put it back on. But I got what I feared as a consequence, a glue line. I think I can hide it in the end. But here is the sequence of photos of carving and sanding.

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Old Man Arthur

Posted 2019-10-17 8:53 PM (#550181 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10777

Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR

Yeah... You can see the line.
But if anyone comments, you can proudly claim that YOU did that.
Then you can let them feel how smooth the Joint is, and remind them that YOU did that!

Oldvation Guy

Posted 2019-10-18 10:07 AM (#550183 - in reply to #550181)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
May 2011
Posts: 81

Location: Ozark, Arkansa

You are so right, Art. I am too much a perfectionist for my own good. I really ought to be glad to have found so close a match of the wood, and be content!

I have a little more shaping to do, but it is pretty good.

clrules

Posted 2019-10-19 6:09 AM (#550188 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
September 2005
Posts: 138

Location: Birmingham, AL

I think it turned out great.

DanSavage

Posted 2019-10-19 1:33 PM (#550190 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 2316

Location: Pueblo West, CO

Me, too.

leonardmccoy

Posted 2019-10-19 3:28 PM (#550191 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
December 2015
Posts: 287

Location: Katmandu

You followed the contour perfectly. Nice job!

Love O Fair

Posted 2019-10-19 6:33 PM (#550192 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
February 2016
Posts: 1802

Location: When??

How you guys get these ear repairs to come out matched up so nice is all Greek to me. Excellent work!!

BCam

Posted 2019-10-19 6:50 PM (#550193 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
October 2014
Posts: 270

Nice work, lucky you had the old end table. I've found that old table leaves, often found at flea markets and junk shops can be a source for nice mahogany and other woods.

arumako

Posted 2019-10-20 12:07 AM (#550195 - in reply to #550188)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
October 2012
Posts: 1034

Location: Yokohama, Japan

clrules - 2019-10-18 8:09 PM

I think it turned out great.

Jonmark Stone

Posted 2019-10-20 5:25 PM (#550196 - in reply to #550195)
Subject: Re: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
May 2008
Posts: 1555

Location: Indiana

Oldvation Guy

Posted 2019-11-02 8:35 PM (#550298 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: RE: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
May 2011
Posts: 81

Location: Ozark, Arkansa

Decided to do something fun today on the rebuild, and fitted the top to the bowl. Cleared the old epoxy first. It is an extremely thin layer. Be careful playing with sharp things. Actually cut my finger on the edge of the suspension ring, not with the chisel.

Edited by Oldvation Guy 2019-11-02 8:38 PM

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Oldvation Guy

Posted 2019-11-02 8:40 PM (#550299 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: RE: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
May 2011
Posts: 81

Location: Ozark, Arkansa

Remember it is a full dreadnaught top, going on a cutaway body. I laid the top on the bowl to figure out where to trim the bracing, then cut two of them with my Dremel tool. Rounded the ends as originally designed.

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Oldvation Guy

Posted 2019-11-02 8:45 PM (#550300 - in reply to #549891)
Subject: RE: Adamas II 1581 Rebuild

Joined:
May 2011
Posts: 81

Location: Ozark, Arkansa

Then I was able to lay the full top on the bowl and rough trace the outline I needed for the rough cut. After that I kept shaving it down with the sanding drum on my Dremel until I had what I wanted. I will cut carbon fiber plugs for the holes from the leftover bout material. I am not worried about a perfect fit on the edge because I am doing a pick guard on the bout to cover up where I modified the top.

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