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Location: Boise, Idaho | Since my first "gig" was our wedding, I don't think I could ever make enough to balance out the expenses. She did pay for part of the Matrix, so that I could play it at the wedding, though. (And all of the OFC guitar for my birthday/30th Anniversary.)
I probably should admit that for the first couple of years SWMBO made more money than I did, so that "gig" supported me for a couple years. |
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December 2001
Posts: 7233
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | While I don't have a clue as to a "lifetime" number... I don't think I've played a "free" gig since 1975. Most paid cash, but usually it was a combination of food, drink, even lodging sometimes.
Maybe it's the genre, but in rock bands, if you aren't getting paid and really even if you are, it's been my experience that you put out a bucket or box for tips right next to the "sign-up for our newsletter" sheet. Actually I remember some paid parties, where the tip bucket ended up with much more than the few hundred we were getting paid for the gig.
Maybe I just don't get it.. but unless it's just playing with friends or some friendly get-together... why on earth would you let some establishment (club, restaurant) make money off YOUR talents and get nothing for it?
I do understand some people just do not want to get paid for their art... that's fine.. take the money and give it to a charity, or your church, or even the homeless guy in the alley... but why on earth would you give it to the venue for free. I got nothing against venue's making money... But using someone else's talent to profit is just wrong and illegal in most Northern states since about 1865 :) |
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Posts: 2683
Location: Hot Springs, S.D. | When the nursing homes offer to pay, I tell them to save their entertainment buget to use on getting yet another person/group to come in. When I play for the Mammoth Site fundraiser every year, I do it for free even though they offer to pay me. After all, it is a fundraiser, so that is my contribution.
But Miles is right, if it is a bar or a restaurant, they should pay you. I will gladly donate my time to a worthy cause, but I don't consider bars and restaurants worthy causes. |
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Posts: 10777
Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | I got $107 worth of Busker Money sitting in a pile right here on my desk... :p
That's pretty much all that I have made.
So I ain't getting rich doing it... But I can grab a Coffee to celebrate.
I'm sure that I have spent some and made more, cuz all the change in in a coffee can or I used the quarters for Laundry. But most of the paper money is on my desk. There is some in assorted guitar cases too...
Do I have to claim that on my Taxes? |
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February 2009
Posts: 262
Location: VENISE-EN-QUEBEC CANADA | made 1.10 $ when a friend walk buy and said hey Dan didnt no you play guitar + many cheer'd me and my wife at her parent's 50th anivesery when whe playe'd music that was (heart warming)
as for money spent it's FAR better than drug's and booze
Daniel |
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Posts: 7233
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Originally posted by CanterburyStrings:
When the nursing homes offer to pay, I tell them to save their entertainment buget to use on getting yet another person/group to come in. When I play for the Mammoth Site fundraiser every year, I do it for free even though they offer to pay me. After all, it is a fundraiser, so that is my contribution.
But Miles is right, if it is a bar or a restaurant, they should pay you. I will gladly donate my time to a worthy cause, but I don't consider bars and restaurants worthy causes. + 1 all counts..
And I know I'm gonna tread on some toes here, and I'm sure there are some really fun legit "open mic" nights.. but in general... biggest scam going. I have heard on more than one occasion from owner/managers "why should I pay for music when I can get the same musicians to come in a play for free" |
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Posts: 2683
Location: Hot Springs, S.D. | Ah...open mic. I DO go to them, and I usually play a song or two, but my main reason for going is to take my students so they can get a taste of what it's like to be on stage, sing into a mic, and look out at the audience. When I HOST an open mic, I get paid or I won't do it. |
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Posts: 4535
Location: Flahdaw | Open mikes can be viewed as a scam, but they serve a purpose.....experience playing in front of a crowd. Really can't be replicated any other way. If you think you want to be a professional musician, what an avenue to test your resolve. Yeah, the bar draws a crowd and sells some beer, but they SHOULD get something for offering this opportunity for free. If they were real slimeballs, they would charge for letting you play. |
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Posts: 12759
Location: Boise, Idaho | We had a coffee shop here that offered on Craigslist to let acoustic guitarists play. There was a firestorm of replies from alleged musicians, similar to what Miles posted, but not as polite.
I was more of the view that it would be an opportunity for me to get some experience, but I even had too much anxiety to follow up on that. I can understand a professional think it's a scam, but I can also understand from my view that the only one benefitting might be me, unless I'd get booed. Then I'd have to say "You get what you pay for." |
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Location: Flahdaw | Well, plus the fact, no one is going to "open mikes" to hear the great music. The bar is full of the players and maybe a few of their friends. They have some drinks while they wait their turn. How is this different from Kareoke? Or ladies night? Why should bars make money off of guys hoping to pick up chicks on ladies night? Scam? |
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Posts: 61
Location: on the web | Yes, a venue owner attracts a paying crowd to an open mic and does not have to pay the musicians. But for a lot of musicians just starting out, especially acoustic guitarists, that's a fine way to hone you performance skills and/or try out new material without the pressure of being the main (or only) draw. Without an open mic, they would be confined to busking, itself a noble pursuit, but not the same as a (semi) captive audience. I know a number of people who've scored paying gigs because of their open mic performances. |
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Posts: 4067
Location: Utah | We're plotting to play an open mic in the next month. One of the local venues gives 30 minute slots. For us it is a chance to play in front of some people and to work out the kinks on stage. Kind of a dress rehearsal. I figure we're getting something out of it. Otherwise, I won't play for free at a business.
The places that have open mic nights do get some flack on C-List. But really it isn't the same kind or level of entertainment found with a paid band. Someone mention karaoke, and I agree with that analogy. People show up either because they know one of the performers or to see what kind of crash/burn happens. |
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Posts: 1126
Location: Omaha, NE | Originally posted by Mr. Ovation:
And I know I'm gonna tread on some toes here, and I'm sure there are some really fun legit "open mic" nights.. but in general... biggest scam going. Yep.
Open mic's seem to be built on the myth that the average amateur wanker is worth listening to.
They are not. And as such, the odds of developing an audience other than other open mic-ers and their friends is small. Nothing wrong with that, in and of itself. But it is what it is: A glorified campfire circle singalong.
At worst, open mic's devolve into a series of no-talents praising other no-talents in exchange for reciprocal praise of equal value.
But as to the question, I'm pretty fortunate. I play at mass every week, and the pastor and I have an informal agreement that my playing serves as my weekly contribution. Given what I would otherwise be expected to donate, that works out pretty well.
But for playing out in bars and such, never made much. And it seems like there is always just one more piece of gear that we need, so the expenses have a way of always keeping up with the income. |
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Posts: 7233
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | As mentioned.. there ARE some VERY legit reasons for doing open mic gigs. Exposure, fun, getting a feel for it to see if you can do it... etc.. all good.. There are also clubs that just take advantage of many musicians inherit good will and willingness to play.
Another aspect is to think of your fellow musicians who ARE professionals. I know of a situation where there is a fairly good local part-time band (they all have day jobs) that gets booked all the time, in all the best venues... CAUSE THEY DO IT FOR FREE... hence.. THEY get the gigs and any other bands can only get whats left... so they basically leave the area to get work if they are any good. That's kinda sad.
I'm not against open mics, or even playing for free.. Just don't get taken advantage of and have fun. |
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Posts: 4535
Location: Flahdaw | Getting back to the original topic of this thread....I think most of us on this forum are older and have done fairly well for ourselves. We're not much interested in trying to earn money playing our music. I played in bars while going to college....I don't want to do it now. I get much more out of playing in front of friends and having them say "that was great."
That said, if I was 20 again, I would do the open mics as often as I could. |
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Posts: 10777
Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | The Cool open-mic things that I've been to (the only ones) we in the "Coffee Houses" in the 70's.
Usually it was in a church. The coffee and crackers and cake and stuff were Donations only, and they had a stage with assorted semi-acoustic artists playing for free or for tips.
The Harvard Square Church of Christ (est. 1686) did this for Decades. It wasn't proselytizing, you could play any kind of music you wanted providing it was tasteful.
They did this as a community service. A nice cheap/free place to go for adults, teens, college kids, and the like. Ah... The good-old Daze!
Now, The Biggest SCAM in music is the "Battle Of The Bands!"
Where they get Dozens of wannabe professional bands to play for weeks on end. For Free!
They the finally give the winner a coupla hunnert bucks worth of studio time, and a chance to go on the the State-wide Battle-of-the-Bands SCAM! :mad:
And they don't even give them guys free beer! The idea is for the bands and their supporters to spend money.
So if you have four or five bands on Friday Night (with their 'significant others' and supporters)...
You are guaranteed 200 customers! |
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Posts: 7233
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Old Man Arthur... don't even get me started on the Battle of Bands scam. You are soooo right. Took me a couple before I figured it out. |
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Posts: 12759
Location: Boise, Idaho | Your experiences have convinced me to keep my day job.
I did have a great time playing for whoever would listen in the hotel bar in Rothenburg with Karl. He said busking was illegal without a license, but one of our group gave him some pocket change for gas money. They didn't give me anything, but I got to play Karl's #47RI for hours. That was worth a lot. Karl has my permission to post the video, but he might not want to be heard with me. |
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Posts: 1330
Location: ms | What i do sometimes if its a gig i really want is offer to give them an hour free. If they want to book me after that fine if not i go to the next place. Some of the bigger things i do that come around once a year i started out by doing the first year free but these have been well worth it. |
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April 2006
Posts: 2491
Location: Copenhagen Denmark | Originally posted by Mark in Boise:
Your experiences have convinced me to keep my day job.
Karl. He said busking was illegal without a license, but one of our group gave him some pocket change for gas money.
... differs from town t`town .. usually in Germany playing out is " free-wheelin " ..
Vic |
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April 2006
Posts: 2491
Location: Copenhagen Denmark | Originally posted by gulfcoast:
What i do sometimes if its a gig i really want is offer to give them an hour free. If they want to book me after that fine if not i go to the next place. Some of the bigger things i do that come around once a year i started out by doing the first year free but these have been well worth it. Demo-Tape .. ehr .. Demo-CD ..
Vic
... so many rules .. regulations .. soon ye`ll need a " barrister " for every turn ye take ..
Vic |
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November 2004
Posts: 1330
Location: ms | Most places down where i live don`t even look at a demo/promo pac what they really want is to see you live. So myspace with a video or heck i`m standing here talking to the guy how about i just sit down and play a bit. I`ll give you a for instance, the Shed in Ocean Springs Mississipppi a great place to play. I dropped them a demo a couple of times, talked to Brad the owner a few times,nothing. I was down there to see 3KD play and the guitar player asked if i wanted to play a short set while they took a break. I played, Brad walked up to me after and booked me for the following Friday night. Sometimes it pays to give a litte to get a little. |
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Location: Flahdaw | The Shed....I would play there just for free BBQ |
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Location: big island | (whatchit! careful how you answer this. gwb might be an IRS agent.) |
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March 2005
Posts: 5567
Location: Blue Ridge Mountains | (whatchit! careful how you answer this. gwb might be an IRS agent.) Not to worry Randy...this is a bbs...it's all marketing spoo...LOL |
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what is your lifetime $ income $ so far for playing your music???
