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Location: Texas | It was simpler to draw this than to explain it.
How difficult would it be to adjust a Viper neck this way, if the neck is otherwise ok? (The strings in the drawing are a pretty accurate illustration of the problem.)
Any thoughts?
Thanks… |
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Posts: 1227
Location: Connersville, Indiana | Can't you adjust the angle of the bridge withe the two bolts. Maybe the neck is ok and the bridge is crooked.
here is a link to Ovation owners manual unless you already have one
http://www.ovationtribute.com/Owner\'s%20Manual.html
Other than the neck bolts slipping this is the only thing I can think of that might cause that. Hope you find the answer, i love mine |
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Location: Texas | Kitmann,
Thanks for the suggestions…
I just realized that my drawing was incorrect, the arrow should be pointing UP, of course. I don't think you can adjust the bridge in that direction…
Plus, I'm positive that it's not the bridge, it's the neck. I just tried gently pulling on the neck, and I can get it to move closer to the correct angle, so your speculation about the neck-bolts may be correct. I need to explore a little more…The fact that I can move it relatively easily by hand tells me that the neck needs to be tightened &/or possibly reset.
It may be simplest to just add some sort of shim between the neck and the body by the low E to keep the neck in place and solid. A guitar pick is about the right thickness, so I wedged one in there temporarily while I decide whether to fix it or ship it back to the seller. It's kinda beat-up, but now that it's "splinted" it actually plays and sounds pretty sweet…
This one has not been treated gently, it's hard to tell if the neck situation was caused by previous abuse or by shipping.
Thanks, |
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Location: San Bernardino, California | Loosen the strings.
Loosen the neck screws.
See if you have enough play to get the neck into position. |
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December 2008
Posts: 1456
Location: Texas | Originally posted by BruDeV:
Loosen the strings.
Loosen the neck screws.
See if you have enough play to get the neck into position. Yes, it will go into the correct position, but even with the screws then well re-tightened, the neck drifts back out of position with just a few minutes of playing. It should be pretty easy to shim it to keep it from drifting, though… if I decide to keep it.
Thanks! |
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Posts: 3084
Location: Brisbane Australia | Do what the factory does......soak a piece of thick paper in water based wood glue (not sure what the brand names are over there, Aquadhere in Oz)......put it between the neck and the body....position the neck and tighten.....let dry.
Walla.....!!
AJ |
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Posts: 1456
Location: Texas | Originally posted by AussieJames:
Do what the factory does......soak a piece of thick paper in water based wood glue (not sure what the brand names are over there, Aquadhere in Oz)......put it between the neck and the body....position the neck and tighten.....let dry.
Walla.....!!
AJ Thanks for the advice AJ…
Would that make removing it again much more difficult?
Erlewine's book suggests putting sandpaper, screening, or other course material between the neck and the body to "grip" the wood and prevent the neck from rotating side-to-side once the bolts are re-tightened.
In the meantime, since there is a tiny gap alongside the neck anyway, I think it would be pretty easy to fashion a shim that would fill the gap, keep the neck from moving, and be virtually invisible. Is there any reason NOT to fix it that way?
or… I may just return it, it's much more beastly than the beauty that was advertised anyway… |
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Posts: 39
Location: MA | I've run into this issue on several guitars I've re-furbed.
Even if the neck stayed in the correct position when tightened, it is a good idea to fill the wedge-shaped opening between the neck and body with a shim to make sure it never moves. The problem I had was finding the exact size & shaped shim.
Luckily for me, I work for a company that has CNC machining capabilities. I used feeler gauges to determine the exact dimensions required and sketched the shim I needed and gave it to a tech to make for me. That worked great but we now have a machine that "prints" plastic parts the way an inkjet printer prints ink. So I again give the tech the dimensions I need and "walla" I have a shim in under an hour.
My feeling is-- a guitar pick will work but a full shim/wedge will give better sustain by making better contact between the neck and the body.
If you can get me a sketch of what you need, I'd be happy to have it made for you. No charge.
--Mike |
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Posts: 1456
Location: Texas | Thanks Mike, I appreciate your kind offer. I'll see if I can fabricate something myself first before I make you do all that work.
I agree that making it the right shape to fill as much of the gap as possible makes sense. The guitar-pick was just an experiment to see what would happen. I was thinking that it is a good excuse to cut up some credit cards anyway… ;) To really do it correctly, I might need to sand the piece into a slight wedge shape with the thicker part toward the nut.
It's absolutely covered with long finish checks, is that a common problem on old Vipers? |
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Location: NW Washington State | I've seen a lot of pictures of Vipers, but not with finish checking. Got pics? Might help with the neck problem too.
-Steve W. |
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Location: Connersville, Indiana | Hey Standing I would return where you bought it from and put up a thread asking for help finding a viper to buy. I'm sure there is someone in the OFC that has one they would sell. Just a thought :) |
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Location: Brisbane Australia | "Would that make removing it again much more difficult?"
That's the reason they use the paper......it will separate.....simple but cool idea.....
AJ |
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Posts: 1456
Location: Texas | Originally posted by numbfingers:
I've seen a lot of pictures of Vipers, but not with finish checking. Got pics? Might help with the neck problem too.
-Steve W. I took some photos, but I couldn't get the checking to show… The clear finish has long, mostly parallel, cracks about 1" to 2" apart. I suspect that it was caused by abuse, not age…
Originally posted by kitmann:
Hey Standing I would return where you bought it from and put up a thread asking for help finding a viper to buy. I'm sure there is someone in the OFC that has one they would sell. Just a thought :) Yes, I should have done that in the first place, I know better. I may start over if and when I actually get a refund. It was an impulse purchase… |
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Location: Texas | I created a shim that fits perfectly. The neck is dead-on and seems to be staying there…
So… I spend some time playing the guitar and start to think maybe I should overlook the cosmetics and keep it anyway, since it plays and sounds pretty nice… but I notice that the intonation is slightly off, so I start tweaking the brass saddles, only to find that most of the saddles are solidly stuck in the slots. The adjustment screws turn, but the screw heads come out of the bottom of the bridge instead of moving the saddle, and they won't tighten beyond the current position. I completely loosened the strings, and tried gently pushing and tapping on the saddles themselves, but they won't budge.
Does anyone have any thoughts on how to loosen them? |
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Location: San Bernardino, California | Some the brass saddle bridges had screws holding down the saddles.
If there are slots in the bridge plate that's a good indication of that type of bridge.
If so you'll need to remove the bridge to get at them.
I usually reemove one of the cup washers (there are usually two per screw) and add a teflon washer between the remaining cup washer and the bridge plate. |
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Location: San Bernardino, California | Here's a bad picture of some examples.
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Location: Texas | BruDeV,
Yep, brass saddles with slots. I'm sure I could figure it out eventually, but I'll be lazy and ask; do you remove the bridge by unscrewing the angle adjustment screw from the back or is there some other trick?
Thanks for the advice… based on your photo, I'd guess that you've worked on a few of these before… ;) |
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Location: Brisbane Australia | Yes he has.... ;)
Yes remove the angle adjusting screw on the back and the bridge just lifts off.......no need to remove the strings........don't forget to unclip the earth wire.
While the bridge is off make sure the mounting posts turn nice and freely
If I'm dismantling a git for the first time I usually screw them out clean the threads and use a little spray lube
AJ |
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December 2008
Posts: 1456
Location: Texas | Thanks AJ, I followed your directions, took the time to clean everything up and now the saddle adjustments work perfectly… BTW, this one has the bridge with the black plastic cover and slots for each saddle, with "Viper" engraved on the pick-guard. (photos eventually…)
The archives contain a wealth of information on the subject of O-electrics, so I've been voraciously reading through them, trying to learn what I can before, inevitably, posting my next dumb question ;)
Thanks! |
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Posts: 1456
Location: Texas | Originally posted by AussieJames:
Do what the factory does......soak a piece of thick paper in water based wood glue (not sure what the brand names are over there, Aquadhere in Oz)......
AJ I found some references to Aquadhere, but I'm not sure what the equivalent would be here in the States, does anyone know? Franklin Titebond Glue? Elmer's wood glue?
This Viper has clear acrylic aftermarket knobs. Does anyone have a spare set of Viper knobs for sale? …or could someone post the diameter and height of the original knobs and I'll see what I can hunt down?
Even the case needs work. How would you go about removing silver-paint (stenciled) on an old brown case without damaging the case itself? I guess I could paint over it; is "baby-poop tan" a stock color at Sherwin-Williams? ;)
…or I could use this method:
Thanks! |
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Location: Connersville, Indiana | Hey Standing WD-40 works sometimes to remove paint and road tar off cars it may help with the funky color. Or you could take it to a body shop and have a real cool airbrush done to your case. I mean I would but then again I'm mental........ :D |
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Location: Connersville, Indiana | I like the Orange sticker |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | I believe elmers wood glue, but someone should know for sure. |
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Location: Boise, Idaho | I've cleaned small paint marks off cases by using a green dish scrubbing pad and just household cleaner. You might have to try some paint thinner, but it might take the brown off. I've also used oven cleaner, but that may be way too strong. |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Originally posted by standing:
This Viper has clear acrylic aftermarket knobs. Does anyone have a spare set of Viper knobs for sale? …or could someone post the diameter and height of the original knobs and I'll see what I can hunt down?
When I had a Viper, I just used a set of Generic LP knobbies like THESE.
(I just gave you that link as an example, you might be able to find a better deal) |
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Help with Viper neck adjustment…
