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Location: Yuma, AZ | What do you do about the Ovation crack? It seems that many older Ovations have a crack (more than finish) from the bridge to the rim, near the middle. I have a Balladeer and a Custom Balladeer, both from the '80's, that have the typical cracks. I use these guitars for gigs and they seem stable, but I worry about the crack spreading.
The traditional repair is to glue a cleat inside the top, behind the crack. Then a triangular strip is sliced out of the top and replaced with a matching strip of wood. With the high-tech glues like Gorilla glue on the market today, I am thinking about running a strip of glue on the inside of the top, down the length of the crack. I just want stability. I don't need cosmetic perfection.
Any advice or observtions on the "Ovation" crack would bve greatly appreciated. I will hold off my glue repair until I hear opinions.
Thanks,
Larry Dean
desertdean21@yahoo.com |
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Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | You can use a thin veneer strip on the under side. Careful with the Gorilla glue. it can get very messy. I'd be inclined to use the "white" glue or modern hyde. If you don't have clamps that can do the job you can cut a couple of wedges from scrap stock to clamp the veneer to the top by wedging agaisnt the back.
Might want to place the gain of the veneer adjacent to the top gain |
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Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands | r u sure it's a crack in the wood? |
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Location: Yuma, AZ | Yes, The crack goes through the wood. Thanks for the replies. |
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Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | Larry... Gorilla glue will expand up through the crack and out the top.... |
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Location: Upper Left USA | "Gorilla Glue" is a near cousin to the spray foam insulation filler stuff. If you don't apply force on the parts being fit, it will rearrange their position for you! |
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Location: closely held secret | Oh. I saw the header and thought someone was dissing Moody again. |
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| Let's just be thankful that cliff has bags to pack. |
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Location: Illinois | I have concerns with a strip of wood laid from hole to button end. The grain runs the same way. Yeah, that's the way they do the multi-piece back on the 'wooden boxes', but there is no string tension back there and you've already got structural issues. Unless you can get a strip with the grain running cross ways to the sound board grain, I'd be afraid the crack will just continue down through the new strip.
Also, check the condition of the braces. They could be seperated or worse, cracked as well. Re-glue or replace as needed.
Diamond shaped patches are in order. No need to inlay them, just good powdered, mix-it-with-water hide glue works best. Don't use that liquid hide glue they sell in squeeze bottles. It isn't very strong. Lay the diamond shaped patches so the grain is perpendicular to the crack. It isn'tnecessary to feather the edges of the patches, but it looks more professional that way.
Yes, you'll need to clamp. A tongue depresser cut slightly longer than the bowl depth, then wedged between the bowl and patch works good. Probably should place a clamp across the top for these to push against. You don't wanna push the top up with the tongue depressors.
I got these hobby sticks at the Michael's. They look like short paint stirrers. Make your patches, then test fit your tongue depressor clamps then when you have them all made mix up and heat the glue and re-install. You gotta work quick before the glue cools and sets.
Visit Frets.com. Frank Ford will fill you in on the ins and outs of hide glue. He knows his stuff. |
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Location: SoCal | Wait a minute...I don't see why this wouldn't be handled any different than a finish crack. Use water sol glue or CYA from the underside if the crack is all of the way through, then topside. If not through the wood - forget about the underside. Use the water sol glue or CYA to build it up, sand, buff. This is catalyzed polyester and you can sand without damaging the finish. Could even mix acrylic paint with the glue to try and hide the crack. StewMac says 2,000 grit but I use 3,000-12,000 on the cracks. Search archive, there is a lot there.
Pressure of the top and the glue should make it as stable as a non-crack top.
However, why did it crack into the wood? Is there a loose or missing brace, bulge in the top? Probably not a bad idea to check the underside. |
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Location: Boise, Idaho | Tony, what do you mean by CYA? It means something different to me, but doesn't fit in that context. |
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Location: SoCal | SORRY, not Catholic Youth Association...CyA (Cyanoacrylate) |
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Location: closely held secret | Canadian Yachting Association.
(oh, wait... maybe he means Cyanoacrylate ester adhesive... otherwise known as super glue...) |
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Location: SoCal | Well, when your brain housing group is a little slow...guess you could use a glue stick to avoid glueing your fingers to your forehead :p :D :p |
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Location: Boise, Idaho | Originally posted by Tony Calman:
Use water sol glue or CYA from the underside if the crack is all of the way through, then topside. I'm still trying to figure out how to cover your ass from the underside if the crack is all the way through. I'll check it out in the mirror. |
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Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | Mark.
Welcome to the other side of the line.
.....sheez, I'll be needin a brain scrub |
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Location: Midland, MI | I think Mark is chanelling cliff. |
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Location: Atlanta, GA. | I'm still trying to figure out how to cover your ass from the underside if the crack is all the way through. I'll check it out in the mirror. Mark,
PLEASE don't report back with your findings!!! |
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Location: Yuma, AZ | Thanks for the advice. I have discovered that the main crack (in the 12 string Custom Balladeer) is through the wood directly beside a brace (right up against it). A piece of wood inside won't do any good, so I am going to take Tony's advice to use the CYA. I will try to build it up with several applications.
Thanks to "Skinny Baby Lee" for suggesting a thorough examination of the braces. The other guitar (Balladeer) proved to have a loose brace and the surface crack does not go through the top wood. I wlll re-glue the brace, using white glue, and then attack the surface crack with CYA.
I still haven't found a bridge saddle for the Balladeer.
Thanks for your help. I hope these wonderful sounding guitars are good for many more years of music making.
Larry Dean - desertdean21@yahoo.com |
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Location: Illinois | If you gotta get your glue from a bottle, use Carpenter's glue. It's the yellow stuff. It's stronger for this application.
I still think, though you want to push the top back into position and reinforce. Filling the crack won't fix the underlying problem and it will contiue to open up. |
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Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | It would be nearly impossible to effectively "push the top back" together.
open cracks are a result of stress and shrinkage (that's gonna be a field day for my fellow miscreants).You are essentailly working with less material than originally constructed and putting the pieces back together will place even more stress on the area. |
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Location: Scotland | Glue alone wont do the job. One of the better ways to repair a top crack like this is to make a splint. You need to open up the crack to a "V" shape. There are lutherie tools available specifically for this task. You then take a piece of spruce, make a V-shaped splint and glue it into the crack. This will stand proud of the top so will need to be taken down flush. The better the match in terms of colour and grain of the splint the better the repair will look. It sounds pretty easy but it takes a lot of skill and experience to produce a stable repair that also looks cosmetically acceptable. |
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Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands | I recommend two books:
Guitar Player:Repair Guide by Erlwine
D.I.Y Guitar Repair by Filet
You might find them useful. |
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Location: Illinois | Frank Ford at Frets.com has helped me VOLUMES over the years. CHeck him out for fixing the wood parts... sorry part on your Ovation.
Ya know, You gotta love this place. No matter how many ways we find to bust up a guitar there are just as many ways to put it back together again.
As my buddy Yakov says,"What a country!" |
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Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | duct tape. |
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The Ovation Crack?
