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Joined:
March 2006
Posts: 1634
Location: Chehalis, Washington | I posted this in the For Sale section, then thought I should post it over here for your thoughts:
I have just spent the last two weeks dealing with one of the most bizzare situations I've ever seen. Beware of ANY new ebay buyers hailing from France - I had a new ebayer using the name Moore_pepper_2000 use the BIN on my 1869, then send me a cashier's check for the guitar and shipping, which he wanted sent via his own courier. As he's out of the country, I figured that shouldn't be a problem - maybe he has someone who does this for him all the time.
When I got the cashier's check, it was for the price of the guitar...plus $2700! Now, I've checked on shipping to France before, and it was in the $150 range, so what was with this? I emailed the guy, and he explained that he was having several items shipped to him from the US and needed a large chunk wire transferred to his shipper, and figured this would be the easiest way.
Anyone here trusting enough to send $3700 cash to someone you don't know assuming they won't screw you?
After conversing several times, I finally, against my better judgement, sent the transfer (which cost him over $150 in WU fees) and emailed him the info on it. The next day, he sent me an email claiming that the value of the US dollar had fallen, and his shipper needed more money, so please wire another $1000 and he would send me a check overnight to reimburse me...
Needless to say, I refused, and let him know I was not willing to be his money transfer (or laundering?) station, and unless he could deal with this himself, I was not interested in continuing with the transaction. He responded "no problem, just deduct your ebay fees and send me a refund. You can wire it to my shipper..."
So now, I sit here with $1000 from a possible money-laundering scam and the guitar, which he NOW says he doesn't want, and have no idea which agency I should contact about this guy. I would just as soon send him his money back and be done with him, but he claims that his "financial institution" will not accept a check or money order, which is why he needs a wire transfer.
Anyone here deal with this type of thing before, or have any thoughts? |
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Joined:
January 2006
Posts: 175
Location: Eugene, Oregon | :(
Are you going to have to pay your bank back? Did the check clear as good? |
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Joined:
March 2006
Posts: 1634
Location: Chehalis, Washington | Cashier's check - cleared just fine to the bank, or I wouldn't have sent the initial wire transfer. |
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Joined:
March 2006
Posts: 269
Location: Nîmes, south of France | Edensharvest,
Yes this is scam ! I urge you to NOT ship the guitar and have NO deal with this person.
Scamers scan ad's on the internet or forums, they always offer MORE than you request, arguing for fees, financial agent, or so on. They usually proceed payment by check via Western Union, because no identitity is needed. When you cash the check, your bank says ok, with trust you ship your item, then your bank says it is a false one and debt your account 3 weeks to 2months later: you loose your money and your guitar...plus the money in excess you eventually sent back to him !
Months ago i was contacted by scamers on the internet, that was following an ad i put in a US website; they offer me 20k € for aircraft parts, that was twice the price i was asking for. Fortunately i was informed by my bank they were scamers, who operate from countries of far East Europe, the check was from a bank of Ireland, sent from Italy !!! I kept the check at home as a "souvenir" and am laughing every time i see it !
The only way to secure international payments is a bank transfer or eventually paypal, and the price is the price! If you receive a lot much more, that's not normal and scam is not far from you. Most important you must NOT send him any money back, this will be "lost money" for you...and good money for him!!
The France channel is bad for us honest french people, but fortunately there are ways to not be trapped by scamers. |
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Joined:
January 2006
Posts: 175
Location: Eugene, Oregon | OK, that is what I thought. So now you have the cash that the guy wants sent back as a refund?
This is kinda spooky. |
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Joined:
March 2006
Posts: 1634
Location: Chehalis, Washington | Originally posted by Pokeypup:
This is kinda spooky. Tell me about it! |
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Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 5750
Location: Scotland | This smells really bad. I've had a few similar experiences but refused to get involved. If you have his money, keep it and send nothing, no refund, no guitar. His scam, his loss. You could send a refund and if he's used a fraudulent credit card transaction to send you the cash your bank could claim it back retrospectively. A negative feedback is a small price to pay for not losing a bundle of money. If he's legit he has legal channels to pursue to recover his money, and unless he does so I'd leave it be. |
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Joined:
September 2005
Posts: 3619
Location: GATLINBURG TENNESSEE :) | I would contact ebay and have them make a record of it. Then I'd leave the cash in the bank and see what happens next. It doesn't sound like you have a lot of other choices. |
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Joined:
April 2005
Posts: 331
Location: San Angelo, Texas | Hey Andrew, do not hesitate....contact the FBI immediately. There is a good friend of mine that got involved in something REAL simular, and ended up with the FBI coming to HIM and wanting to investigate HIM for the goings on. |
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Joined:
April 2004
Posts: 13303
Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | Cashier checks can be fraudulent. Clearing you bank means nothing until the funds are collected from the issuing bank (who often knows nothing about it because the cc is counterfeit).
I fear you will be out the $1000 you sent back to this scammer but you won't know for probably 60-90 days. That is why the scam is becoming so popular with the thieves....appears legit until several months down the road. |
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Joined:
March 2006
Posts: 269
Location: Nîmes, south of France | You're right Stephen. The 2 key words here are "International" and "Delay", scamers play with that and win most of time ! Edensharvest, you know what you have to do now. |
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Joined:
January 2006
Posts: 175
Location: Eugene, Oregon | Originally posted by stephent28:
Cashier checks can be fraudulent. Clearing you bank means nothing until the funds are collected from the issuing bank (who often knows nothing about it because the cc is counterfeit).
I fear you will be out the $1000 you sent back to this scammer but you won't know for probably 60-90 days. That is why the scam is becoming so popular with the thieves....appears legit until several months down the road. :( Yikes!!
I think that he has sent the guy or this guy's "courier" $2700 not just a grand.
Is that the extra he had you give back at first,
Eden?
eta: Do call the FBI for your own protection. |
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Joined:
March 2006
Posts: 1634
Location: Chehalis, Washington | Out of the $3700 he sent me, I sent back $2700, minus the WU fees. I still have $1000. The check came from a Wells Fargo bank, nothing saying international on it, though it was postmarked from France. No worries on the feedback thing, as this guy already cancelled his ebay username. I emailed ebay about it, and they said that it was not closed due to anything illegal or suspicious. The scammer claims that he didn't have any intention of using it again...
I will contact the FBI, ebay, and Western Union immediately. Thanks for all the input. |
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Joined:
December 2001
Posts: 10583
Location: NJ | If there has been a scam, it has been tried on me.
this is a major one in the first degree. contact local authorities and let them handle it. don't keep the cash unless they tell you to.
good luck I HATE stuff like this it gives e bay and ebay sellers a bad name. I am closing in on 10 years on e bay and I can tell you that it is a blessing and a curse. |
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Joined:
January 2006
Posts: 175
Location: Eugene, Oregon | I'm sorry this happened, Eden.
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April 2004
Posts: 13303
Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | Dee....should I be concerned :rolleyes: ;) |
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Joined:
January 2006
Posts: 175
Location: Eugene, Oregon | Originally posted by stephent28:
Dee....should I be concerned :rolleyes: ;) Dee? Who's that? ;)
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Joined:
March 2006
Posts: 1634
Location: Chehalis, Washington | FBI report has been filed. We'll se what happens...
Lots of things don't add up. The cashier's check was mailed from France, no return address, but was issued from a Wells Fargo bank. The guy's ebay address is in Indiana, with a 206 area code phone number, which is Seattle. He called the other day several times, and the number that came up is a 601 number from Jackson, Mississipi! The western union transfer has been picked up, in Paris on Friday. I'll have to call my bank tomorrow and find out about the cashier's check, and see if it's good or not. |
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Joined:
March 2005
Posts: 1421
Location: Orange County, California | Read my Lips:
El Cheque es NO BUENO!!! :p :D :p :D |
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Joined:
March 2006
Posts: 1634
Location: Chehalis, Washington | Now say that in French...and I'll kill you!!!
:mad: :mad: :mad: |
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Joined:
March 2006
Posts: 1634
Location: Chehalis, Washington | Totally off topic, Fred, where in OC are you? My dad actually works in Orange, but lives out in Yucaipa. I grew up down in Riverside. |
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Joined:
July 2003
Posts: 1922
Location: Canton (Detroit), MI | edensharvest, I hope this comes out OK for you....what a nightmare!!!!
This just reinforces why I refuse to sell outside the U.S. on eBay. If you set your auctions up with this policy, you can BLOCK non-U.S. bidders (yes, there are exceptions; specifically if the person set the eBay account up in the U.S. and then MOVED, but they are rare).
Roger |
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Joined:
March 2004
Posts: 629
Location: Houston, Texas | Gosh, have I got this right? The $1000 you have now is most likely worthless and you have probably already lost $2700?
I hope that's not the case. You did the right thing in filing the FBI and other reports. I hope this turns out alright for you! |
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Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 5750
Location: Scotland | Originally posted by Old Applause Owner:
This just reinforces why I refuse to sell outside the U.S. on eBay.
Roger So everyone who who doesn't live in the US is out to get you? Sounds like Gdubyas foreign policy. Get real, and use a little common sense. My company sells worldwide via ebay. As long as you stay alert to possible scams, which are usually patently obvious, it's not a problem. As much as I despise paypal using them gets rid of most of the scams ( note "most") through buyer/seller protection, but then Paypal themselves have their own scams (also known as their terms and conditions) so ultimately you can't win regardless of territory |
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Joined:
June 2006
Posts: 29
Location: Port Angeles, WA | Sorry to be the bearer of bad news here, but this is the oldest scam on the Internet. Also, this is one of the reasons most seasoned eBay sellers refuse to take International bids.
This check will most certainly bounce (it will take a while to clear the banking system) and you'll be out whatever you send this person. You were right to contact the feds, but you should have done it before you send anything back to him. Sorry if this comes too late.
As for eBay scams in general, thankfully I've been free of them. But then again I'm very careful only bidding on items that seem reasonable and making sure the seller has a good number of feedbacks, near 100% positive, and has been a member more than a few months.
My wife, who is a seasoned eBayer, made bad decision twice in the last few months. First, she paid for a small item by check. Guess what? Checked cleared but she never received the item. Not worth chasing the guy for $15.
The second bad decision was on an iPod that was being sold by someone with 100% positive feedback, but only 13 sales, and had only been a member for 2 months. If she'd done some research, she would have seen he had another account that had been closed a few months before. She promptly paid via PayPal, and then the next morning she got an email from eBay saying this guy's account has been closed and to take steps to recover her money. She never received the iPod, and Paypal refunded most of her money, but she's still out $75 of the $225 she paid.
I recently was interested in a computer that was selling for a few hundred dollars, but should have been a few thousand dollars. The listing said to contact the seller via an email address before you bid. The seller said I could use BuySafe to purchase it for $1500, still about a grand shy of what it would normally go for. I stayed away from this auction like the plague, but I still see similar auctions daily. I wonder how many of those are legit?
The lessons to be learned here are:
1. If it seems too good to be true, it most likely is a scam.
2. Check not only the positive feedback and number of sales of the seller, but also how long they've been a member.
3. If in doubt, don't bid. It's not the end of the world. |
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Need thoughts on ebay scam
