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Posts: 7251
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Based on comments in another thread, I did some searching... and although we've touched on this topic in a couple of threads, I didn't find a lot of discussion so I thought I would bring it up.
I am curious on what people think about the differences. I like the Epulets more because I think the guitars with them project better, but the center hole models seem to be more fun when I want to entertain myself as I can hear them better from the playing position. |
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Posts: 10583
Location: NJ | epaulets for me. The top has more room to vibrate and you get a great tone and they just look so damn much better than the center hole |
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Posts: 55
Location: Frozen Tundra | I had lust for the little holes for decades.
.... strike that...
Now that I have them, I couldn't be happier. "what Al said"... |
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March 2002
Posts: 15686
Location: SoCal | Such a personal preference. It's the overall guitar that hits me. I'm thrilled when I play my 68 Deluxe Balladeer, and thrilled when I play my 83 1537 Elite. |
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Posts: 5750
Location: Scotland | I find the multi-hole guitars are better behaved on stage at volume. Acoustically I have no preference, the centre-hole guitars of the same depth as a multi-hole maybe have a little more bass. |
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November 2002
Posts: 35
Location: Reading, PA | I mentioned this subject once before too, I have an Elite, but when I recently played a Legend I thought it had more projection. It sounded quite like a traditional guitar. You can do some muting for a little variation in sound with the multi hole. I would have really liked to have seen the sonograph during the factory tour of the two different styles, but I was just too amazed at the site of the test jig and the output and the theory etc.... etc.... Can't wait until the next tour. I might just have to buy one...
Jim |
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November 2002
Posts: 32
Location: Warsaw, Indiana | In 79 when I bought my 78 Adamas, part of the mystique and appeal of the Adamas when I first saw it on TV were those strange little holes surrounded by leaves. When I first played one I fell in love with it and have been faithful ever since. For me it embodies the Ovation look! |
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May 2003
Posts: 69
Location: UK | They are definitely the coolest addition to guitar construction since the f-hole (was that Lloyd Loar, btw???), in my humble opinion.
I was delighted to discover I could afford an America made Ovation that had them!
There is one tiny drawback - I have had to adjust my style to avoid hitting the raised edges with my thumbpick if I move my hand towards the fretboard. In fact, I think the idea to embed them in the soundboard like new collectors 2003 might be the way to go.
On a related topic - is it my imagination or do my insides actually vibrate when I'm playing my bowl-back in a way I never experienced on a conventional guitar?
:-) |
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June 2002
Posts: 6202
Location: Phoenix AZ | I really have multiple anwsers here. Just call me a fence sitter (amongst other things). To clarify, I assume we are talking about wood top guitars. Comparison of fiber top multiholes to wood top center holes likily has more to do with the material than the number and layout of the holes. So, in my opinion ...
1. Depends on the price point. If we are talking about the upper end of the line then I would say that multihole vs. center hole is pretty much a wash for me. I recently aquired a deep bowl Custom Legend that sounds every bit as good to me as my deep bowl and mid-depth Multiholes (Elites). At the lower end of the line (plywood tops) I can hear a bigger difference, with the center hole models like the 057 sounding better than the multihole ones like the celebrity deluxe.
2. Depends on the vintage of the guitar. The eariler generation centerhole guitars (especially the shiny bowls) have a ring and projection that the later Multiholes just can't touch in my opinion.
So, overall I'd have to say that "I Am A Centerhole Guy Living In A Multihole World". I agree with Paul, you really have to consider the whole package. It's not just the holes that will make you prefer one guitar over another. I've got some very nice sounding multiholes, but time and again if I close my eyes and just pick up a guitar to make some good sound and enjoy the crap out of playing it - it's gonna have a centerhole.
On a side note, when I do (rarely) play out and I use a multihole, it seems that it is somewhat distracting. People look at the guitar and don't pay attention to the music (maybe that's a good thing). But it bugs me when people come up and ask about the guitar, like "What'n da hell IS that thing?". I would prefer something more stealth like, such as a good old trusty Legend.
Dave |
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February 2003
Posts: 2178
Location: the BIG Metropolis of TR | Hey Dave...YOU'RE A FENCE SITTER!!..............You're welcome! :D
But I guess I'm a fence sitter too because in someway I agree with what everyone has said in this thread (Boy!! How's that for fence sitting!!)
Meaning that I enjoy playing both models equally,I know there are tone/sound differences between the two types just the same as there are tone/sound differences between like models - such as balladeers vs legends etc. and std elites vs elite T's etc. Playing styles and how it sounds to your ears influences what model one might prefer.
I guess if you "pinned" me to the wall to choose centre-hole (How you like my accent!) or multi-hole I would probably pick (pun intended) the centre-hole 'cause they are the more "Traditional"(If you want to call any Ovation "traditional")Them thar multi-hole one's are "Newfangled"
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Mike(JMHO) :cool: |
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Location: puerto vallarta, mexico | what models of the elite had ply tops? |
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February 2002
Posts: 5750
Location: Scotland | Only a few USA models, the Limited edition Guitar Centre Koa Elite, & the Waterfall Bubinga collectors. Probably one or two others. All of the Celeb Deluxes, which I suppose is an Elite, kinda. |
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Posts: 110
| It seems less likely that the pick hits my CL 12 string's top, but my 6 string celeb suffers everyday from picks. Maybe its just me....or maybe I'm more careful with my CL. |
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May 2002
Posts: 3005
Location: Las Cruces, NM | My opinion (everybody has one) is big single sound hole, Glen Campbell, Paul Simon etc., vs little piddly holes all over the guitar that dampen the booming bass is BIG HOLE WINS. Sorry that I'm so non commital.
Bailey |
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Posts: 5750
Location: Scotland | Sorry Baily, but that's garbage. The multi-hole design does not in any way "dampen bass" |
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December 2001
Posts: 10583
Location: NJ | I agree with paul but think it is "rubbish" |
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March 2002
Posts: 873
Location: puerto vallarta, mexico | so what makes the elite standard different in the way it sounds? i thought it was mostly detail. i guess i am asking, because i just bought one (6768 deep cutout) to replace a balladeer (deep, no cutout)i sold. i havent seen it yet other than in photos. i see they were made in 93,94, 95. i really was looking for a gig guitar and the old balladeer didn't have a cutout. i miss that upper register. it cost less than the old balladeer i sold, so i thought i was making a good move, as i really like my multi hole guitars (both early adamai with carved headstocks). they do draw attention, especially down here. what do you think of them as a gig and or recording guitar? i know you must have played a few paul t. i kinda related them to a les paul studio. no frills, but often prefered for studio work. i like their clean look. this one is i guess cherry burst. kinda light red around a natural top. the photos also made the bowl look brown, but the owner swears it is black. some tend to think lots of extra inlay and binding diminish the sound. what do you think?
anyway i have what might be the only multi hole center hole ovation. (aka "vomit on toast" per cwkII). my brother just picked it up in phoenix for me. he says it is a really beautiful guitar (he's an auctioneer not a musician.) he told me it had all of the stuff my other guitars have all in one. that might be, but i think i might add a humbucker just to be sure. i will pick it up in detroit at the end of this month.
moody, did you ever get my e mail re travel plans to los angeles?
well the roofing crew has arrived to pour the new roof. looks like i beat the rain. |
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March 2002
Posts: 15686
Location: SoCal | Nope. moody.pi@cox.net |
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June 2002
Posts: 6202
Location: Phoenix AZ | I know I'll get myself in trouble here, but ... I agree with Al and Paul T. that there is no fundamental physics reason that a multihole guitar should have less big bass sound than a center hole. In fact based on common sense (and a little acoustic physics), the center hole guitars should have less response becvaise there is this big dang hole cut right in the middle of the soundboard. I believe all this and I truely trust and respect the expertise of my compadres on this thread. But I'm sorry - to MY EARS, a comparible center hole vs. multihole wood topped guitar both with spruce top (let's say a deep Elite vs a deep Custom Legend) - the center hole is louder, clearer, and has more bass. I just played these two guitars 5 minutes ago and to my ears IT'S TRUE. I also just compared a SS Elite to a SS Legend. SAME RESULT. Don't shoot me - it's just my opinion and maybe my ears have been conditioned over the years (call it "ear condition", get it?). Just for kickers I also compared an old DEEP Glen Campbell shiny bowl to a deep bowl Adamas II. I won't comment on my conclusion, 'cuz that would really stir up the sh**. Dave |
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Location: puerto vallarta, mexico | paul, just sent another e mail. maybe your filter is keeping us foriegners out. |
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February 2003
Posts: 2178
Location: the BIG Metropolis of TR | Ooohh Yeah! I forgot about the "vomit on toast" that musicamex bought - he's got the "Best" :rolleyes: of both models rolled into one!!
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Hey Russ, you'll have to let us all know how it sounds (maybe Ovation should put out a model like that :D ) Also.....You have to Pour your roof??? :eek:
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Mike :cool: |
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November 2002
Posts: 27
Location: North Carolina | I purchased by Balladeer Special after trying an elite and several other Ovations. I new nothing about Ovations at that time so I picked mine just by the sound. I thought the center hole with the mid size bowl sounded the best. |
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May 2002
Posts: 1445
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | "Just for kickers I also compared an old DEEP Glen Campbell shiny bowl to a deep bowl Adamas II. I won't comment on my conclusion, 'cuz that would really stir up the sh**..."
I'm glad you mentioned (or didn't mention?) this Dave because I had been a "multi-hole, why would you want anything else" guy for a long time. Then I got my 1968 GC six-string and was totally blown away by the sound of it. I hesitate to say better than a deep bowl Adamas because I haven't heard one of those for a while and haven't had the opportunity to do and A-B comparison but from what I remember...
Wayne |
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February 2002
Posts: 5750
Location: Scotland | Dave, getting into the acoustic physics of guitars is a nightmare, believe me, I teach acoustic design. It seems that most players judge a guitar on it's bass response, and there is certainly a subtle difference between centre-hole and multi-hole designs in that respect. I would suggest however that this difference is far more apparent to the player, rather than a listener several feet away. I find a greater difference between the two styles in the midrange (we're taking guitars of similar price range & bowl depth here) and it's the mids that really define the character of a guitar. It's horses for courses, my '68 Deluxe Balladeer is now the guitar that gets played the most around the house, & is great for recording rhythm parts, but my SMT leaves it dead in the water for lead & fingerstyle guitar, the consistency of it's acoustic response across the it's entire playable range is infinitely superior. |
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Posts: 15686
Location: SoCal | This is a bit of an apples and oranges discussion. I have a 1983 Elite 1537. And I have a 1968 Deluxe Balladeer shinny bowl. They sound different. But both wonderful. But for different reasons. If I had to pick one of the two to live with exclusively (along with my wife of course), it would be the Elite. It has a pickup, seems to be sturdier, I love the woods on the top, fretboard and binding.
But I love the sound of the DB. It's a front porch kind of guitar. It has history in it and it makes me feel good.
I also think Miles has an important point. Ovations have two acoustic sounds. What you hear when you play it, and what it sounds like when somebody else plays it. Which one is important to you is going to have an impact on your choice.
Personally, I think that almost any US made Ovation is pretty damn wonderful. |
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Sound Hole vs Epulets
