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Location: Havertown, PA | OK, trying to pinpoint year of manufacturer. Yea, I know, I may be a bit anal, so here goes.
According to "O"'s Cracking the code, ( and I'm not sure just how accurate) but it states in the four code series that an Ultra 1517 is a:
Ultra Electric
Std bowl
and the fourth digit being a 7 states something about a "Glen Campbell Artist Balladeer".
What would this mean if it's an Ultra. Style?
Reason is, is that the six digit series ( serial numbers) has my number ( 322220 ) potentially listed as either an '84 if it's considered a Balladeer or possibly an '85 since it's a USA Ultra. Looks like late '85 or '86 when Ultra's may have gone the way of ROK. Thoughts anyone?
Ovation , when asked, seems to just refer you back to the code page. Thanks |
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Location: Havertown, PA | Looking over the pricing guide in the reference part of this board, it seems to denote the 1517 as an Ultra Deluxe. I assume the 7 - "Glen Campbell Artist Balladeer" gave the Ultra this deluxe style recognition? |
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Location: SoCal | Nope. Sorry to say, but the model code does not apply to guitar built overseas. They have their own code, but nobody (and I'm not being sarcastic or mean here) knows what it is. The code on the Ovation website and on this site only applies to USA built Ovations.
See, another serious answer. Since you're still posting questions, I assume that either you're persistant in wanting answers, or you've decided to join the group, nonsense and all. Welcome.
What you might consider doing, and I've suggested this to people in the past and still do it myself occassionally, is pick an open afternoon or evening, make a margarita, and spend a few hours going thru the archives of posts. You'll find info similar to what I posted above, but also a ton of fun reading on Ovations. It's well worth the time. |
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Location: Havertown, PA | Hey Paul;
Sorry to say, but my Ultra is suppose to be made in the USA. Blue Oval Ultra label says so. Is this not necessarily true?
According to my e-mail response from info@ovation.com, they confirm. Thoughts? |
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Location: Minden, Nebraska | I have seen quite a few Ultra models, but never one made in the USA. Yours reminds me of a frequent saying from my professor of Greek: "Greek is a language of rules. One of the rules is that rules have exceptions." |
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Location: Havertown, PA | Good, now were getting somewhere. I've gotten strange answers before when I've asked this question. Everyone assumes that since it's an Ultra it made on ROK. I've sent another e-mail to "O", asking them again, hoping for a little clarification. I guess this could be an early model? C'mon, anyone with some thoughts on this?? |
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Location: SoCal | Ok, I've got the 1985 catalog in front of me. The Ultra has a laminated spruce top, mahogany neck and rosewood fingerboard. It's got a stacked volume/tone control and FET preamp.
The book The History of Ovation doesn't mention the Ultra's but states that the Applause and Celebrity lines were moved overseas in 1984. I'm assuming that the Applause guitars became the Ultra's but I don't know for certain.
By 1991 (per the catalog from that year), the Ultras were built overseas.
Mfinger1 (which finger by the way?) you have to realize that for years, it was very very difficult to state with certainty, when and where a guitar was built. I've got a 1967/68 Deluxe Balladeer that was built in one of those two years, but according to the serial number code, could be either year. If your Ultra has a made in USA label, then it was probably built in the early 80's, like 82 or 83.
Question, does it have an aluminium neck or a mahogany neck? in the 1983 catalog, they are listed as aluminum. By 1985, it was mahogany.
But understand that the model number on your guitar does not correspond to the model numbers in the "crack the code" lists. The non electric version of your guitar was model number 1511 (per the catalog), and that doesn't make it more like a Balladeer. It just means that the code doesn't apply.
The problem you face is that as anal as you want to be about this, you're never going to find all the answers. We've all been a bit anal about our guitars. If we weren't, this board wouldn't exist (well, it would, but it would just have Al and Miles on it). But there aren't always good answers to every question.
Again, go back thru the archives. There's probably info there on this subject that I've missed. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | OK, maybe I'm just askew from the rest of the world, but I thought 1) Ultra's were made in the USA and 2) the 1517 is the "Ultra" equivilent to the 1617 Legend, just uses lesser grade top and neck woods. Isn't that correct?
I've never owned an Ultra, so I only speak from 2nd hand knowledge. As far as the 4th digit 7 meaning "Glen Campbell Artist Balladeer", that's not correct. xx17 are Legends or Ultras. xx27 are Glen Campbell Artists. Am I totally wrong here. |
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Location: NJ | When I first got mine, I posted about it (Do a SEARCH on "Ultra" and type in my number "116").
Anyway the question arose over neck material. Since mine was black, I wasn't sure if it was wood or alu/foam. cwk2 said that the change happened in '83:
"cwk2
Member
Member # 7
posted February 12, 2003 07:48 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Not Phoam.
If it says made in Kimchi it's not foam.
the foam machine has been history since 1983
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W-2" |
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Location: Havertown, PA | Hey Paul, thanks for a little more info. At this point it may be the middle finger.
Yes your specs are correct. Now I may be more confused. It has a mahogany neck with sound hole accessable trus. The serial # 322220, says either '84 or '85. Are you saying that because it's an Ultra ( or Ultra Deluxe ) that the codes may not apply even though it was suppose to have been built in the USA and the codes are suppose to apply to USA built models? When were Ultraa first manufactured?
The "O" website on discontinued models, has a little blurb for the 1517 from their '86 manual that says the Ultra was Korean made at that point.
If anyone can shed more light on this, please feel free. I've sent this question to "O" in hope of shedding some light on the issue. You know, it's really not a "big" deal, but damn it, I'd like to know why the discrepencies!! Maybe Kaman wanted buyers to think it was American made?? Could it be a cover up?? Hah..hah..! |
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Location: Yucaipa, California | My wife and I just went to the Nixon Presidential Library in Yorba Linda.... I listened to the Watergate Tapes and, curiously, there was one that went: ".....the Ultras are going to be made in..." "SHHHH! be quiet!!!!..." .........18 minutes of blank tape.... :eek: |
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Location: Fayetteville, NC | The truth is Out There....Somewhere........ :cool: |
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Location: Warrenton, Virginia | M finger 1
Tenacity is a good thing...but maybe now consider what Moody suggested and read archives of past posts on this subject, as well as wait for the response from Ovation re your inquiry.
For what it's worth, Charlie Kaman was a good guy.....Even tho the Ovation guitar was a remarkable contribution to American society & the world as a whole; Kaman's defense contributions were even more substantial.....and they continue to be. Don't think the Kaman company have in the past or in the future tolerate anything other than ethical practices.
Sounds like you like your "Ultra"...plays well etc. For me that has always been the most important thing......and if you only spent a meeger sum for it...then you are way ahead of the game whether made in USA or bum Fxxx. |
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Location: Havertown, PA | Sam;
I was kidding about a conspiracy. You would just think that they'd kept better records?? Who knows. I have perused the postings, with some interesting results. Some belive the ultra to have legend characteristics.?!?
Your absolutely right, I'm well ahead of the game, trading a Woolworth Epiphone Bird of Paridise repro ( $15 in '82 new ) for $75 on a $185 price tag. Basically this baby ran a tad over a $100. I'd just like to know!!
Mike |
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Location: Scotland | The USA made Ultras were pretty shortlived. They evolved from the Matrix guitars and were pretty similar, with the same aluminium/foam neck but a rosewood re-frettable fingerboard and a headstock which looked more like a regular Ovaton head rather than the plastic overlay of the Matrix. The original Model numbers for USA-made Ultras were 1311 )non-electric) & 1511 (electric) To confuse matters at some point the Ultra was known as the Balladeer Special but was essentially the same guitar. Ovation then got out of trying to produce affordable entry-level USA-made guitars and Ultra production went offshore. Models 1312, 1512, 1517, 1315, 1515, 1527 & 1528 all refer to imports. That list may not be complete. Also, by the mid-80's the original 4-digit model code had turned to crap. The other giveaway, apart from the model number is, if your Ultra has an adjustable truss-rod (accessible through the soundhole) it's definately of Korean origin, the original Ali/foam necks were non-adjustable. |
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Location: Havertown, PA | but Paul, my 1517 has a made in USA blue oval label. |
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Location: Warrenton, Virginia | Mike
roger that. respect your point.
I believe you have come to the right place to find your answers...and I believe you will be a great member of the group.
I have owned ovations since 68/69....I don't know as much about them as some of the guys on this site.
I have learned a lot more by listening to them.
guys like....
moody/cliff/cwk2/standingovation/hiz/Al/Miles/Temp/Steve/Tony on and on....they can speak for themselves but from my point of view, they know a lot about the ovation guitar...specs...history etc. I just tend to listen and learn....
I feel certain some of these guys..will figure out where your ovation came from. |
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Location: SoCal | Realizing that I'm not the Paul that you sent that to, I'll say this one last time.
Putting dates to Ovations can be a very difficult thing. People here (including myself) have given you the best info they have, including their time (and you probably can't afford my hourly). You can protest that you have a blue label all you want and continue to say "yeah, but...", but you'll get the same answers.
Now if you wanna give me the middle finger, feel free. But you'll have to get in line behind my 12 year old daughter. |
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Location: Scotland | The model numbers may have changed, that list was not meant to be exhaustive. As far as I'm aware all USA Ultras had a non-adjustable neck made of high-density foam over aluminum. If you can't find a truss-rod adjustment point at the end of the neck it'll be a foam neck and consequently made in the USA. If it has a neck-rod it's more than likely to be an import. |
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Location: Havertown, PA | Paul,
That wasn't directed at anyone, you just asked which finger. Just sort of out of frustration that came out. No hard feelings. I'm sure you all can concur. |
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Location: Havertown, PA | Paul T.,
My Ultra does have a mahogany neck, with a truss rod and says "Made in USA". I really don't mean to be a pain in the a__ here. Just trying to confirm. You guys have all been a great help. Maybe others will chime in. |
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Location: Scotland | Ok, it's possible I could be wrong and there were some USA-built Ultra's with conventional necks, or someone changed the label, or it was labelled wrongly at the factory (totally possible, I have a 72 1117 which has a foil label with a 1617 model code) Bill may know if there were any USA-made Ultras made with wood necks. |
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Location: Havertown, PA | Paul T.;
Appreciate the info, guess it could have been mislabeled at the factory, but I doubt if the label's been changed. This baby was hanging grungily at a local shop. All that was needed was a thorough cleaning. Funny thing, the shop keeper asked to buy it back shortly after selling it.?? Never asked why. he may have felt it was worth more. |
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Location: Havertown, PA | Just heard back from Ovation. Kim was her name, could be a Korean guy too?? Hmmm....
Anyway, response was this:
"Listen to your friends on the Ovation Fan Club. The Ultra was made here in the USA for a short while before production was moved offshore. Unfortunately, at that time no one had much interest in maintaining a serial number log, so records are very incomplete."
How about that! I guess you guys are all I have. Thanks for you time and info. If anyone else cares to respond, the info is always welcomed and appreciated. |
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Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada | Foam as a material for a guitar neck? This sounds bizarre; when I think of foam I think of a relatively soft material. Does anyone have an idea of the thinking behind this concept? |
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Cracking the "O" Code
