|
|
Joined:
August 2003
Posts: 4619
Location: SoCal | I believe that Ovation/Adamas should consider including in their marketing the advantage of the bowl that give the guitars a the 'green' advantage of a high level instrument. Ovation has been praised in the past for their innovation and forward thinking. Nothing wrong in reemphasizing the advantages of old.
Ovation (later Adamas) burst onto the market with amazing innovations. Sometimes it is important to remind artists and prospective buyers.
The ability for those aware of the problem (environmentalists, artists and prospective buyers) to recognize a product that minimizes the world-wide market of wood while creating a superior guitar could assist in bringing Ovation/Adamas guitars to the forefront.
In the past several years, there has been a movement for guitar makers to move to sustainable woods or non-wood material (i.e., laminate), or at least avoid what happened to Gibson a couple of years ago over their source of ebony.
I won't bore you with all of the available articles.
However, many sources of woods that in the past were used (i.e., Brazilian rosewood and ebony) are no longer available due to treaties or due to deforestation. Companies like Martin have tried alternative material such as laminate. In some cases, companies like Takamine will use laminate to support their pre-amp. There has even been experimenting with bamboo. Whether a laminate sides and back can compete with solid wood sides and back is subjective but my opinion is that it can't. Yet, the bowl can and does.
Think about it, an Ovation/Adamas bowl may have a carbon footprint to build the bowl but doesn't use wood for the sides and back.
I am not advocating laminate or other material for the tops. The top is only part of the guitar (but major) and in a wood top, you have the sides and back.
Ovation fret boards that use ebony could use the impregnated rosewood similar to the Adamas.
Ovation/Adamas use wood for the neck but a small amount and from sustainable material. Yes, the textured top Adamas has a very thin piece of wood between the textured top and bottom but again a small amount. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
December 2008
Posts: 1453
Location: Texas | Wouldn't it be a tad cynical to market a "green" guitar with a bowl containing petroleum-based material?
An "Eco-guitar" would be more believable if the back was made of a renewable resource… like wood. ;-)
But seriously, if there were a way to make the bowls with sustainable plant-based materials (soy Lyrachord?) there could be a compelling eco-friendly story to tell. (Whether that's possible and it would be physically strong enough and sonically satisfying are big questions.)
|
|
| |
|
Joined:
August 2003
Posts: 4619
Location: SoCal | I said that there would is a carbon footprint.
We are talking about wood that some would consider non-sustainable or obtaining the wood damages the environment (i.e., clear cutting).
Most of the sustainable wood are fast growing bamboo or soft pine or increased costs. Unfortunately, companies won't have a choice down the road - as a consumer, you can have a bowl that has provided quality stability for forty-nine years, sound projection, etc, or sides and back of artificial material. Don't think you can mix tofu.
Artificial grass with concrete base saves watering but has a carbon footprint as most manufacturing does; batteries for electric cars have a large carbon footprint as well as the cost to produce the electricity and recharge stations. Los Angeles has poorly designed freeways for a large population creating stop and go. Yet, they do not fix their infrastructure due to the cost. Always a trade off.
Select wood for the sides and back, in addition to the top, is a small percent of the deforestation (a lot to pulp, building supplies, etc.) but still considered a serious problem. Ovation has from, the beginning, reduced the amount of select wood by not using it for the sides and back.
Most of the major guitar companies using wood for top, sides, and back are bemoaning the fact that in the future select wood will no longer be available. Companies are scrambling to find alternative sources of wood that could be used that isn't regulated or restricted by international treaties.
So, what do they do for the sides and back? Guess their answer has and will be to go to an artificial back and sides. However, unlike the bowl, laminate which has a carbon footprint and it may affect the playability and/or their position in the market.
Ever pick up a piece of laminate flooring...hard and rigid.
Forty-nine years ago, Kaman came out with the 'artificial bowl', an innovation for the future that companies like Taylor, Martin, etc., made 'cute' jokes about the bowls but are now trying to emulate in one way or another. Maybe not a bowl but a serious reduction of select wood by using artificial material.
We can't forget that using a bowl shape has a long history for instruments, as well as allowing the design staff the ability to do a little tuning, if appropriate.
Oh, by the way, your strings, strap, picks, capo, case, music printed with ink on paper, Dunlap 65, etc., are not very eco-friendly.
Artificial bowl is not enough to sell a guitar to a customer who plans to buy an all wood guitar. It is only part of the image to be presented to get the prospective buyer to consider Ovation. Maybe just to pick up an Ovation and play it...think about it, when we played the Ovation or Adamas, we were hooked.
So,will there be a good marketing department to project who, what, and why they should check out the product? I believe DW has done that numerous times with their current product line.
Edited by Tony Calman 2015-05-17 2:41 AM
|
|
| |
|
Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10777
Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | As much as we would all love to be Tree-huggin' Hippies and buy the World a Coke...
That ain't happenin' 
It seems that most people figure that they will die before it gets "too bad" so they don't care.
People don't buy their guitars by which one has the lightest carbon footprint.
They buy guitars because of looks, and sound... but mostly Looks.
Even if a guitar is made from Rosewood and Ebony and other rare woods, that doesn't account for all that much wood in the big scheme of things.
Not that many people play guitars.
After you buy an guitar made out of exotic wood, you would expect it to last Decades.
Cheaper guitars are made outta plywood and High-Pressure Sawdust.
And you would still expect them to last for years.
Much longer than most of the other crap that wood product are used to make.
They clear-cut acres of trees for Toilet Paper.
Sustainable, wood-free, guitar...
If you don't count the chemical resin, the electrical power to run the factory...
Or the fuel to transport it for each time it is sold.
And all of that cardboard and packing peanuts to pack it. 
|
|
| |
|
Joined:
October 2005
Posts: 4042
Location: Utah | Lyrachord is non-GMO and organic (chemically speaking)!
|
|
| |
|
Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 112
Location: Bristol England | OMA
Well said! |
|
| |
|
Joined:
December 2001
Posts: 7222
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | I'm with Tony on this. The point of Marketing is to get the name out there to new people. Yeah, tone and looks ultimately seal the deal, but you have to get them in the door so to speak.
Ovation has been so far ahead on some aspects of this, but the seem afreaid to tell anyone (at least in the past). Just look at what marketing has done for Tesla. Yeah, they don't run on gas, but is making huge batteries any better? Same for Prius. But once folks get into the showroom... even if they find out they aren't all that green... they are well built cars that are at least trying.
Ovation has been that way, maybe not on purpose. They even modified the bowl with glass beads for the LX which uses even less Lyrachord (whatever that actually is).
And lets face it. Guitars are supposed to be ROUND. The first ones were. Square and sides were done for mass production.
History Of The Guitar form the History Of The Guitar Explained
The guitar was implicated in history as far back as 3000 years ago (around 40A.D.) in the form of the Cithara of India, the Roman Citar and the Moorish Oud. There was not a single person who invented the guitar, it rather evolved over time from these ancient guitar-like instruments into the modern guitar we have now. It was not until 1779 when the real first modern version of the guitar was “invented” by an Italian man by the name of Gaetano Vinaccia. This guitar had the shape and setup that is still used in modern day designs. In the late 1850s, the first classical guitar was developed in spain, and was the only other type of guitar with differences in design that stuck through time, and is still used today. 
So take your pick for marketing, and yes it's a small amount, but while the other companies are trying to figure out how to build their guitars with the few woods they can still legally buy, Ovation is using a fraction of that on each each guitar and I believe the Wood that is sandwiched in the Adamas tops, could easily be sustainable as well. It's a way to get the growing population of environmentally consious people (regardless if you agree with them) into the door. And just like Prious and Tesla especially once they hear the guitars and see the guitars... they will buy them. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
March 2008
Posts: 2683
Location: Hot Springs, S.D. | I don't think most guitarists give a flip about sustainable anything (except sustainable sound). As a matter of fact, there are some (and we all know at least some) whose ego would drive them to choose a guitar with the rarest, most unsustainable wood available just so they could brag about how much it cost and how few there are.
Tone. Playability. And getting them into the stores so people can try them. All the rest is just gravy. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
August 2003
Posts: 4619
Location: SoCal | A number of music industry individuals and environmentalists are taking notice and action. A short of the film concerning Sealaska...couple of key words "Greenpeace" and the "Music Wood Campaign" if you want to check it out.
http://musicwoodthefilm.com/the-film/
http://musicwoodthefilm.com/page/2/
LOS ANGELES (Billboard) - Sustaining the supply of natural materials isn't a new idea in the musical instrument industry, which depends on old-growth wood to achieve the best tonal quality.
"The paradox is that musicians as a group tend to be pretty progressive and ecologically savvy and concerned -- until it comes down to their guitar," C.F. Martin & Co. head of artist and public relations Dick Boak says. "They don't want to take the chance that they won't have the absolute best tone. It requires a little bit of education and it requires them to see the product."
Some of the most sought-after woods come from trees that can take hundreds of years to develop their acoustic characteristics. Through the years, instrument companies have developed everything from clarinets that can be ground up and recycled into new ones to Martin acoustic guitars and Gibson Les Pauls sourced from responsibly managed forests.
But a collective effort by Martin, Gibson, Fender, Taylor, Yamaha and others to preserve their supply of old-growth wood from clear-cutting -- in which all trees within a designated area are removed -- is beginning to bear fruit.
The industry heavyweights have partnered with Greenpeace on its Music Wood campaign, with an initial focus on Sitka spruce, a key material in guitar and piano soundboards.
SPRUCING UP
After meeting with Greenpeace and the instrument makers last summer, Sitka spruce supplier Sealaska agreed to a preliminary audit of its logging practices. A full assessment by third parties accredited by the Forest Stewardship Council is set to take place in summer 2008, and if Alaska-based Sealaska decides to implement their recommended reforms and apply for full FSC certification, it will be on the road to more selective logging and consideration of surrounding habitats before it cuts.
Greenpeace started Music Wood after it traced clear-cutting of Alaskan spruce to a variety of industries, particularly home construction in Japan. "Instrument-making is a very small percentage of the problem," Greenpeace forest campaign director Scott Paul says. But the companies' leadership on the issue "can have really significant implications on the ground," since Music Wood supporters "are arguably the highest-end and highest-profile consumers of any (tree) species coming from this forest."
Paul says Sealaska's own numbers showed that, without significant changes, "they would be out of their old-growth within 15 years," and credits the company with showing "a lot of leadership and a lot of willingness to explore" sustainability solutions.
Boak puts the level of threat to old-growth woods like this: "If 1 is totally plentiful and 10 is completely unavailable, I think spruce is a 6, and I'd put mahogany at 7.5 and ebony at 8." Demand from China and political pressure within certain countries to restrict rare-wood exports after decades of mismanagement means "the price will go up and they will become rarer and rarer."
Natural Resources Defense Council senior resource specialist Debbie Hammel says that just a fraction -- less than 5 percent by some estimates -- of the continental United States' old-growth forest is still standing, forcing buyers of certain woods to look to other regions and countries such as Russia.
"We do believe that marketplace demand has a lot of potential for directing the market in a more sustainable direction," Hammel says.
NEW PRODUCTS
Still, instrument makers say it isn't widespread consumer demand for green instruments that's been driving their eco-friendly measures. Martin's Boak says the company required all 750 authorized Martin dealers to stock its sustainable wood acoustic guitars after it found some dealers unwilling to take a risk on them.
Thirty percent of Martin's total manufactured units are made of high-pressure laminate, a material made of eucalyptus and fast-growing domestic woods. Yamaha once manufactured a popular snare drum and guitar from bamboo, which replenishes itself quickly. But the company that supplied the bamboo parts went out of business, Yamaha Drums product manager Jim Haler says.
Boston-based First Act, which built an environmentally friendly electric guitar for Guster's Adam Gardner, is rolling out its Bambusa line of electrics to instrument stores this year. The $399 guitar, currently available via firstact.com and at the company's retail store in Boston, is made of bamboo and covered with a water-based finish, rather than traditional polyurethane.
Rather than a reaction to diminishing wood supply, First Act marketing VP Jeff Walker says that "this is more of a charge led by our head of product development for guitars, who was seeking alternative ways to come out with an exciting new product."
Reuters/Billboard
Posted by Musicwood Crew on March 19, 2015 ·
Some quick news, Sealaska’s land bill has successfully been passed by Congress, they have swapped their original land selections for more valuable productive forest areas and now we hope they will become FSC certified.
----------------------------------------------------------
If you see the video, note that Chris Martin, Bob Taylor and others were serious enough to go to Alaska concerning this source of spruce.
Note the quote from Martin: " C.F. Martin & Co. head of artist and public relations Dick Boak says. "They don't want to take the chance that they won't have the absolute best tone. It requires a little bit of education and it requires them to see the product."
Yes, get O's and A's in their hands...get them to compare the "absolute best tone". Walk out of the store with a U.S. Ovation.
Check out the early marketing pieces that Ovation used highlighting the innovation of the bowl (Jerome's OvationTribute). Ovation no longer has the only pre-amp but is the only one that has the bowl. And, it uses a lot of wood by not making a box.
Edited by Tony Calman 2015-05-17 2:13 PM
|
|
| |
|
Joined:
August 2003
Posts: 4619
Location: SoCal | From the Josh White sheet of 1967 on Jerome's site: http://www.ovationtribute.com/Catalogues/Josh%20White%201967%20Broc...
Edited by Tony Calman 2015-05-17 2:33 PM
 (Bowl.jpg)
Attachments
----------------
 Bowl.jpg (134KB - 0 downloads)
|
|
| |
|
Joined:
August 2003
Posts: 4619
Location: SoCal | part of same brochure...in his words
 (JoshWhite.jpg)
Attachments
----------------
JoshWhite.jpg (86KB - 0 downloads)
|
|
| |
|
Joined:
March 2008
Posts: 2683
Location: Hot Springs, S.D. | The article seems to back my point. The MANUFACTURERS are the ones who are more concerned with sustainability than the consumers. Ovation IS already more sustainable than other brands, but I don't think that from a marketing standpoint, that fact will sell guitars.
But what Josh White said IS what guitarists are looking for . Tone, playability, and to some extent, durability. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
December 2006
Posts: 6994
Location: Jet City | I'm with Alison, but I do like the idea of a marketing campaign opening up with video of the devastation of the rain forests, with flashes of various Gibsons and Martins and Taylors and ending with: "was it really worth it?"... fade in the round back.
Just spew, but it's not often us roundback fans get to take a jab at the wood box builders.
I could care less if a guitar's plastic or wood. I bought my UKII thinking it was a wood guitar back in 82. It's the baddest axe on the planet, I wasn't disappointed at all when I finally figured it out. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
December 2004
Posts: 565
Location: Denmark | One option - maybe a niche - would be to organize some kind of recycling of the bowls. Build a new guitar to me on the Ovation bowl I return :-) |
|
| |
|
Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10777
Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | tpa - 2015-05-17 2:42 PM
One option - maybe a niche - would be to organize some kind of recycling of the bowls. Build a new guitar to me on the Ovation bowl I return :-)
We had that, it's was called the MotherShip.
Just send in a broken guitar and they would build you a New one.
|
|
| |
|
Joined:
December 2004
Posts: 565
Location: Denmark | Yeah, thats it. It was kind of popular, wasn't it?
Edited by tpa 2015-05-17 5:35 PM
|
|
| |
|
Joined:
August 2003
Posts: 4619
Location: SoCal | Education of store buyers, floor salesmen, and prospective buyers is a small part of need (but important) to get a prospective buyer to hold & play.
Ever have a floor salesman (or sales woman) tell you that we don't put a plastic guitar in the separate guitar room (with Martin, Gibson, and Taylor)? I have. Heck, even we joke about "salad bowl", "tupperware", "plastic", etc. Many of our OFC posts are available on Google and Bing. Look at other guitar blogs and you will the see the same jokes demeaning the guitars, specifically about the bowl. At present, Ovation and Adamas is seen as a brand and guitar of the past once other guitars found ways to integrate a pre-amp.
From what I have heard, Ovation is often the guitar on the tour bus (probably based on the bowl durability) but the artist doesn't want to be seen performing with a 'plastic' guitar.
Ovation has similar quality of select wood tops (AAA in a Custom Legend, Legend ltd, Custom Elite), rosettes and inlaids, great necks, ebony fretboard, pre-amps, hardware such as tuners, etc., to compete with higher price points. Yet they don't, at least in sufficient numbers.
Rarely is the advantage of the bowl emphasized in media and stores v. the continued production over the ancient design of a wood box. Most of the time, you can't find a new Ovation in a store.
Sure, Martin, Collings, Taylor, and others may experiment with bracing, slope, etc., but most of the time all they are doing is a copy (or similar) of guitar designs of old. At this time, at the same price point, stores are more confident in an inventory of wood boxes. In the past when I attended NAMM where they had Ovations and Takamines together, I saw more discussing the Takamine. Martin appeared to have a lot more activity by store buyers than Ovation.
There is a need to emphasize Ovation without bizarre finishes, changes to the bowl, changes to the pre-amp series, changes to the headstock or logo, fairly recent move from center hole or epaulets to the 'blow hole', etc. I don't believe this will increase sales. DW has a solid product now that needs to be reintroduced. They need talking points (especially about the bowl as it appears to be the most discounted) to create interest for favorable articles, confidence by dealers to stock, buyers to actually play the guitar, etc.
Even if DW brings on the pre-Fender models, I fear that they will fail as at this point the only area the Ovation line can compete is the cost which creates lack of profit. I do suggest they reduce the number of present models, at least at the beginning.
I will leave this subject. However, I remain convinced that DW needs to use anything that gives them a marketing tool and advantage focused at dealers and staff, artists, and prospective buyers. This is 'out of the box' time. DW will only have a short time (? 2016 winter and summer NAMM) for favorable media and store orders. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
August 2003
Posts: 4619
Location: SoCal | At the great prices and quality that they gave us on repairs or custom orders, I doubt if it was a major profit center. It was almost a gift rewarding those that believed in the Ovation and Adamas products. There was a reason that we called it the 'mother ship'. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
January 2009
Posts: 4535
Location: Flahdaw | I agree with Allison. MOST guitar buyers couldn't care less about the "green" aspect of a particular guitar. A few might. Enough to build a marketing plan around the idea? I doubt it. |
|
| |
Sustainable production
