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Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?

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Old Man Arthur
Posted 2010-09-28 3:17 PM (#363982)
Subject: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?



Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10777

Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR		Yes, No, Maybe?



So I got myself a new toy. I am hoping that this will be good to take outside during Portland Winter.
Y'know? Damp, Nasty, Not-too-cold-but-definitely-not-warm, weather.

And I also need some BFLG advice... What kind of glue should I use to re-attach the binding. See?...



Yeah, I could just guess which glue. But this one is in really good shape for being 37 years-old...
So I don't wanna screw it up, y'know?

It came with a really ugly case... Is this original to 1973?



Anyway... This is my new Toy. I like it.
Play with it for a while and then decide which strings to put on it. :D
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Old Man Arthur
Posted 2010-09-28 7:27 PM (#363983 - in reply to #363982)
Subject: Re: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?



Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10777

Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR		I just wanna drive this back up to the top so that someone can tell me about GLUE! :p

Originally posted by Old Man Arthur:
I also need some BFLG advice... What kind of glue should I use to re-attach the binding. See?...



Yeah, I could just guess which glue. But this one is in really good shape for being 37 years-old...
So I don't wanna screw it up, y'know?

Thank You!
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kitmann
Posted 2010-09-28 7:30 PM (#363984 - in reply to #363982)
Subject: Re: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?



Joined:
April 2010
Posts: 1227

Location: Connersville, Indiana		Aurthur, what a find, for a guitar that old it looks great. I have no idea about glues, but you might want to try the Eric Clapton 12's. I use them, they last forever, even in the humid midwest. let us know how it sounds when you decide on strings. :)
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Old Man Arthur
Posted 2010-09-28 7:38 PM (#363985 - in reply to #363982)
Subject: Re: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?



Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10777

Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR		I really wanna know about Glue-ing an Academy.

Kit, I have a Bill Lawrence sound-hole pickup that I plan on using in there.
It sez that it is "optimized for bronze strings" so I have an assortment of D'Addarios and some Martin 80/20's.
I also have some Silk & Steel but I ain't sure if they would work with the pickup.

Speaking of Pick-ups and Sound-holes.
I just discovered that the Academy sound-hole is Larger than the Average Ovation.
It is about four-and-a-quarter inches, and I had to tweak the spring on the Pickup.
The pickup fit just fine in the Folklore.
Just for future reference for the Ovation Guitar Geeks.
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AlanM
Posted 2010-09-28 8:37 PM (#363986 - in reply to #363982)
Subject: Re: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?


Joined:
April 2008
Posts: 1851

Location: Newington, CT		OMA, HUGE apologies! I don't have a glue answer for you, but I DO have a KA-17, and I love it. I also happen to have an FD-14, so I have compared. The FD-14 is just a masterpiece, but the KA-17 holds up VERY well!

You'll pay a lot for an FD-14, and you'll get a lot. A whole lot! However, you'll pay only a little (I paid $135) for a KA-17 and get a LOT more than you paid for. Has to be one of the best bargains I've ever been fortunate enough to obtain.

OMA, mine looks just like yours, but I don't have the rebellious binding.

And, at least I can bump this back to the top for you.

Good luck with your new beauty!
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ksdaddy
Posted 2010-09-28 8:38 PM (#363987 - in reply to #363982)
Subject: Re: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?


Joined:
April 2003
Posts: 608

Location: Caribou, ME		I can't give you a definitive answer on glue. I've had 3 Academies (still have 2) and I didn't have to touch the binding. My concern is this: Do you have to push that loose piece of binding back down, and then it springs back up? If so, I'd be very hesitant to touch it. On the tan ones, the tops are painted(?) or have some sort of finish layer... and they can be brittle. I'm afraid if you need to clamp the binding down against its will, it will pop back up and rip some of the tan 'skin' off at the same time. Not pretty!

If it's just loose and you don't have to force it, I'd try a silicone adhesive. It looks and smells a lot like silicone sealer but it's in a smaller tube and is clearly marked 'adhesive'. It dries a little stiffer too. Plastics are weird, sometimes the strongest of glues won't glue them together just because of their chemical makeup. You could try Duco cement, which I use on regular guitar binding... no idea if it would work here but if it sticks at all it would do the job. Super glue is always an option, although I'd be leery of cleanup. Acetone will clean it up, and Ovations generally get a hearty laugh when acetone is dumped on them, I just don't know about the tan Academy skin.

As to strings, I don't string mine any differently, just garden variety 12s. Maybe you'd like a coated string like Elixirs for playing outside? No idea if they'd hold up any better in the humidity...
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Old Man Arthur
Posted 2010-09-28 8:58 PM (#363988 - in reply to #363982)
Subject: Re: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?



Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10777

Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR		Daddy knows best? :eek:
Actually, KSDaddy & MWoody, along with SeeSquare, are the opinions that I was looking for.

Update, I discovered that the binding is loose on BOTH sides of the waist. :(
I have some Crazy Glue, and I was about to use it cuz NO BODY ANSWERED.
But now that I have answers, I do like that Silicone Adhesive idea.
(Now where do I get it? Home Depot? Auto Zone? Probably either one!)

There is no buzzing when I play it.
I was also thinking that the Silicone Adhesive will be waterproof.
I figure that I will concentrate more on connecting the binding to the Bowl...
Not so much gluing it too the Top.

I can lift the binding up a look at the connection between the top and the bowl...
It looks correct and sturdy.
So I figure I will just attach the binding to bowl and allow some of the adhesive to ooze up onto the corner junction of the top-bowl. (does that make any sense?)



Any other input is appreciated.
And Yes... Academy's do sound much better than any sane person would think that they should. :cool:
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seesquare
Posted 2010-09-28 9:21 PM (#363989 - in reply to #363982)
Subject: Re: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?


Joined:
November 2002
Posts: 3665

Location: Pacific Northwest Inland Empire		Go with the silicone 1st. If it holds, great. If it doesn't, it shouldn't pull the skin off when it lets go. Duco will work on the binding, cuz it has an acetone base, but may not stick to the top finish, so concentrate on sticking it to the bowl. And, cross your fingers.......
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MWoody
Posted 2010-09-28 9:57 PM (#363990 - in reply to #363982)
Subject: Re: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?



Joined:
December 2003
Posts: 13997

Location: Upper Left USA		Here's my Two-Bits.


Cyano or Super Glue is best for small areas, Poly finsih cracks the invisible areas such as under a Nut. Dollar store or Stewmac, it hardly matters, just make sure you put just enough only where needed. If you don't then the "Uncure" stuff can remove it.
Destroys Brain Cells in close quarters.

Acrylic Solvent cement, aka Model glue, Ducro or Weld-on #16, actually melts the product and makes a permenant bond. I would use this on the binding but use care with Plastic binding since it can also melt/soften the binding and deform it if too much pressure is applied. Use rubber bands or hold in place. Used for binding and inlay work. Excess can be "rubbed" away like any rubber cement.
Destroys Brain Cells in close quarters.

Hide glue - Water soluble, especially steam/water. Bottled is ok, mix your own for serious work and needs pressure applied for the best hold.
Super safe (unless you are the Horse they rendered it from).

JB Weld - Two part Epoxy, keep some in your backpack, purse and glove box. It's a filler mostly but wrap some bailing wire or fiberglass and a hose clamp and you'll make it down the mountain.

Epoxies for inlay - Clear or Black, timing is everything.

Titebond and Titebond II & III - Wood Glue with some additives. Will steam out if required but holds wood really well.

Friendly Plastic - In heated water it becomes putty. Once cooled it is hard and makes reusable forms and transfers shapes from innaccesible areas.

Liquid Porcelin Repair - good for touch up and if you over file a nut you can fill it in a little.

3M Marine Adhesive #5200 - Goes on like Tar and takes a week to to cure, but once it does you have an incredible weather proof bond. I used this to join the top onto the Wideneck Slothead.

Duct Tape (Red) - No explaination needed.
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MWoody
Posted 2010-09-28 10:11 PM (#363991 - in reply to #363982)
Subject: Re: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?



Joined:
December 2003
Posts: 13997

Location: Upper Left USA		Also...



I used a bit of the Almond Appliance touch-up with a dab of Amber to match the top of a previous Academy.
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Old Man Arthur
Posted 2010-09-29 12:25 AM (#363992 - in reply to #363982)
Subject: Re: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?



Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10777

Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR		Thanx for the report on all those different kinds of glue, Woody...

Which one should I use?
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MWoody
Posted 2010-09-29 12:33 AM (#363993 - in reply to #363982)
Subject: Re: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?



Joined:
December 2003
Posts: 13997

Location: Upper Left USA		Acetone based duco/Model glue.

And open a window...
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Old Man Arthur
Posted 2010-09-29 1:02 AM (#363994 - in reply to #363982)
Subject: Re: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?



Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10777

Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR		I know that I've got some model glue somewhere...

I built a blue Thunderbird a few years ago, and I have an Edsel kit that I have to do eventually.

Hold it in place with Painters' Tape?


Found the Model... Now just gotta find the glue.
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MWoody
Posted 2010-09-29 9:05 AM (#363995 - in reply to #363982)
Subject: Re: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?



Joined:
December 2003
Posts: 13997

Location: Upper Left USA		All you need to know is right here!
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seesquare
Posted 2010-09-29 1:58 PM (#363996 - in reply to #363982)
Subject: Re: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?


Joined:
November 2002
Posts: 3665

Location: Pacific Northwest Inland Empire		Yeah, that stuff is great! The Shakespearean alligators still return to see me, after all these years.
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Old Man Arthur
Posted 2010-09-29 2:34 PM (#363997 - in reply to #363982)
Subject: Re: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?



Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10777

Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR		Not related to glue... But I just discovered something GREAT about the Academy.

Awhile back I got a $14 AXL suction-cup sound-board transducer/mic thingie...



The thing sounds Awesome on the Academy, even better than the Bill Lawrence Sound-hole p'up.
Much 'true-er' reproduction of the Academy sound through the amp.
And I can drum on the top with my fingers, if I were so inclined.
And the suction cup sticks really well to the plastic top! :eek:
(It would eventually fall off of the Folklore and the Morgan Monroe)
I see a busking plan coming together here... :cool:
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gulfcrow
Posted 2010-09-29 5:10 PM (#363998 - in reply to #363982)
Subject: Re: Academy KA17 -- Poor Man's Folklore?
Joined:
April 2008
Posts: 19

Originally posted by Old Man Arthur:
And I can drum on the top with my fingers, if I were so inclined.
JJ has a LESSON.
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