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Joined:
January 2006
Posts: 1483
Location: Michigan | just maybe some hope to get e-bay back on track and allow sellers to take other forms of payment.
if it amounts to anything and they go back to allowing users to take other forms of payment i will start selling again . GWB
http://detnews.com/article/20100623/METRO01/6230347/1409/rss36 |
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Joined:
May 2009
Posts: 364
Location: Bellevue, Washington | From the article in response to eBay's court date: ""They had 30 days to answer," Macuga said. "On June 15, they were defaulted by the court -- it was 62 days and they still hadn't responded.""
This just makes me laugh. I lost 2800 dollars due to PayPal allowing another buyer to scam me by abusing the "Item not as described" clause that immediately throws out all of your PayPal seller protection, and then shipping me back an empty box after sending the money back. My reason for laughing, is that to this day I still am fighting PayPal to get my money back, and they do the exact same thing with their HORRIFIC customer service. "I'll call you this Friday" means I'm not going to hear from them for at least another month.
Nice to see that they care just as much about making court appearances as they do helping their customers. I hope PayPal gets destroyed by this eBay lawsuit. |
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Joined:
December 2001
Posts: 7236
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | I'll let this topic run its course as long as it remains civil and informative.
Speaking of informative.. the statement in the beginning of the article "EBay has required all sellers to use PayPal exclusively since 2008" is false, or only partially true at best.
You'll be offered payment options when you list your item. Payment options for most listings include:
* PayPal
* ProPay
* Moneybookers
* Paymate
* Merchant credit card
* Payment upon pickup
Notes:
* Payment by personal check, cashier’s check, bank-to-bank transfers, or money order isn't allowed for most eBay purchases.
* This doesn't apply to: some Motors categories, the Real Estate and Adult Only categories, and capital equipment. For a list of excluded categories, see the accepted payments policy. accepted payment methods |
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Joined:
August 2007
Posts: 494
Location: Location Location Location | Ah, a chink in the Ebay armor. I couldn't be happier to read this. Thank you for posting it.
I've been an Ebay seller since 1999. A large portion of my income depends on it, and I too have been burned by the Great Wall of EbayPaypal. I'll be following this very closely. |
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Joined:
February 2005
Posts: 11840
Location: closely held secret | What ebay/paypal has done is require electronic payment. I'm not defending it, but they've done this to protect themselves in case of financial investigation. Of course, there's the added benefit of being the principal on-line payment system.
You can still take check or M/O for payment. You just can't suggest it. If the buyer asks you if you will, you certainly can. |
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Joined:
August 2007
Posts: 494
Location: Location Location Location | Ebay's put the squeeze on sellers, that's for sure. You can try to justify this Paypal thing anyway you want, but they're, in effect, running a monopoly. Casual sellers would accept checks and money orders as a matter of course, and any other method of payment costs sellers money. Ebay is Seller fat. Sellers are dispensable.
So just by saying that sellers can no longer solicit checks and money orders puts huge fees in EbayPaypal's pocket.
Ask any merchant what their fees are like for money services such as those listed in a previous post. Checks & money orders were one way to hedge your bets. Ebay has increased fees year after year, telling you they're giving you this and giving you that, all the while they've got their big hand deep in your pocket. Paypal used to announce increases. Now they just increase fees. I've seen the fees approaching 5-6% on sales. What can you do about it? Nothing. I hope the courts see fit to change the situation. But I don't count on it. Ebay is huge, and huge means better lawyers, and cronies in high places. It's the American way, and as always, it benefits those with BIG money.
Ebay is a monopoly. And an unchecked monopoly can pretty much do whatever it wants. |
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Joined:
December 2001
Posts: 7236
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | "Checks & money orders were one way to hedge your bets." and like it or not, the #1 way to get ripped off. That was actually the real problem. When a significant portion of sales that are taking place on your site are fraudulent, one has to do something. I was lucky, and maybe you were too, but seriously, when we started being able to buy blank checks and print whatever we want on them, that was the last time I accepted a check from someone I didn't know. Same for Money Orders.
This is so overlooked, but think about it. I still see people whip out their checkbooks to pay for stuff at stores. While it's easy enough to just make bogus checks and write them, it's actually just as easy to print real ones with someones real account number. The "out of state" Money Order drawn on a small bank. That's priceless. Go into a store or even a bank and cash a worthless piece of paper that's only verified BY THE WORTHLESS PIECE OF PAPER...
I actually have no problem paying fees really. They are lower than most, and ease of PayPal has garnered me sales that I otherwise would not have made. It's just the cost of doing business... which... to get this back on track... makes it difficult for the average joe who just wants to sell a guitar. Frankly I don't know how anyone even gets started on eBay anymore, you need law and computer science degrees just to create a listing now.
Think about this. If a court does make a ruling that takes money from them, guess how that will be paid for... yep.. MORE FEES. Sometimes it's better to leave sleeping dogs alone. |
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Joined:
August 2007
Posts: 494
Location: Location Location Location | Miles, I'm a bit disgruntled now, so that's why the rant. I wouldn't mind paying the fees if the service I got were the same, but it isn't. Have you tried calling a PowerSeller line lately? Everything's outsourced. You wait on the phone for an hour, and as a seller, you've got a 1 in 100 chance of having anything resolved in your favor, even if you're right. Paypal? Forget it. I've had to lose money when I've been right as well. I'm not a guy who thinks he's usually right either. I bend over backwards to see the buyer's point of view. I don't want to beat to death what I think is wrong with Ebay, because I've made a decent living from it for quite a while now.
Regarding checks & money orders, my own experience is this: 2 Bounced checks in 11 yrs. I collected both of them. Of course the buyers were fortunate enough to hear my sunny smiling voice at 7 am on a Sunday, but c'est la vie! Never had a problem with money orders. Maybe I dodged a bullet on that front..Maybe as you indicate, it was an Ebay preemptive strike. I just hated having Paypal shoved down my throat.
The only competition Ebay has right now is Amazon, and I think they're both supporting each other's policies by adapting much of the other's way of doing business, and in effect, creating a wall against other competition. A pretty good business strategy. Hey, we're not a monopoly. There's 2 of us! But we'll keep out a third.
When I signed up with Paypal, it was free, and you got good protection as a seller. |
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Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10777
Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | BTW -- Donahue sez that they make more money from PayPal than they do from their Auction site.
That is why he is trying to steer eBay towards the Amazon sales model.
And yes, it has been suggested that eBay should separate the Auctions from the Fixed Price listings...
But the Auctions attract too many potential buyers!
Buyers come for the Auctions and then end-up buying from the Fixed-Price mega-stores.
Just hook the fish and reel it in.
As to PayPal... I'm a sucker.
I get money from eBay sales into my PayPal account, then spend it.
So I pick my online stores by who accepts PayPal.
I there are two sellers and one accepts PayPal, the PayPal gets my business. |
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Joined:
January 2006
Posts: 1483
Location: Michigan | i quit selling on e-bay years ago when they made you accept payment by paypal or other electronic sites. i had a few hundred sales and purchases only using checks or money orders and everything went pretty smoth.since the switcth i have not listed anything on e-bay because they are a f#%&ing monopoly on the sell and the purchase. f-them.
miles thanks for your patience, this is not a political thread but e-bay is a real day thread that allot of use. GWB |
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Joined:
April 2010
Posts: 1227
Location: Connersville, Indiana | I know there is a price for using it but, What ever happened to contacting the seller and wire the money. You can go to Walmart and wire money anywhere. Done it many time when the kids needed money. Quick, easy, dependable, or am I just goofy.
Kit Mann Ovation Plug it in |
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Joined:
December 2001
Posts: 7236
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | "Quick, easy, dependable, or am I just goofy."
In a way yes, in a way no. Unfortunately the days of "trusting" a seller or buyer on eBay, just based on their merits is long gone. A bank wire can be reversed as easily as anything else. Or better yet... an unscrupulous person will just wire you money, from someone ELSES account.
The crooks of the world have really sucked the fun out of eBay to where now it's a business. It's no longer for the weekend garage cleaning. Heck, I can't even imagine how anyone gets started on ebay now. I really can't and don't blame eBay and Paypal for creating limits and creating fees to cover their responsibilities. I'm just unhappy that we live in a world that made it necessary.
And here's a slightly different perspective. A smart seller on eBay should never pay any eBay or PayPal fees. I know I don't. |
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Joined:
November 2005
Posts: 1126
Location: Omaha, NE | I sell around $50k per month in merchandise over the Internet and receive credit card payments through a conventional merchant account. The problem here from a seller's perspective isn't PayPal, its all the consumer protection laws.
My sense (just calling it like I see it) with a lot of PayPal gripes is that consumers enjoy generous legal protections, but then they get a taste of what its like from the seller's perspective and they suddenly cry 'foul!'
Other than personal odds and ends, I don't sell on eBay.
But for every PayPal horror story I've ever heard from incidental eBay sellers, I've got 20 more from my on-line department where I was hosed by an unreasonable buyer. It happens. Its a cost of doing business. |
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Joined:
October 2005
Posts: 4071
Location: Utah | Originally posted by Omaha:
But for every PayPal horror story I've ever heard from incidental eBay sellers, I've got 20 more from my on-line department where I was hosed by an unreasonable buyer. It happens. Its a cost of doing business. I think you've explained what the problem is. For someone like me who wants to sell maybe one or two items per year, eBay/Paypal is a complicated and expensive business minefield. For the pro, it is a business and you deal with it. But for the casual seller who wants a sales venue akin to the old newspaper classifieds it has become aversive and unreasonably expensive.
Which is why Craigslist and our local ksl.com classifieds are so popular. |
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Joined:
May 2008
Posts: 4996
Location: Phoenix AZ | Was interesting that I booked a trip last night on American Airlines and I was able to pay using PayPal. I thought that was pretty cool. |
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just maybe strike one against e-bay & paypal
