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Joined:
December 2006
Posts: 6996
Location: Jet City | Howdy all. I have a question for the giggers. What should I charge?
Here's the situation...
After playing with the band Wednesday at an open mic, I was approached by the owner of a local Sports Bar. They've never done music but want to try to work it in Saturday nights. He liked our sound, not too loud, not too soft and thinks he'd like to feature us there every Saturday.
They don't have a mixer or anything, so I'd be bringing PA (speakers, monitors, mixer, mics, etc...). This is a new venture for them with not much $ on the table I think as it's an experiment, but it will be work loading up the gear and setting up too. We're a four piece. Some of this is good for us just because of the exposure, but what do you think a fair asking price would be per show?
For what it's worth, it is one of the more popular Sports Bars on the Eastside and usually is pretty busy.
Any input is greatly appreciated. I meet with the owners tomorrow. |
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Joined:
March 2008
Posts: 119
Location: everywhere | You charge what you think you are worth. Talent and creativity are priceless, so lets just look at the rest....thousands of dollars worth of guitars, as much again in sound equipment. Then there's the years spent learning how to do it. And dealing with the dickhead hecklers, and driving to the gig. And setting up the sound, And taking it down again. And loading it back into the car and driving home, And staying up another coupla hours cos yourre wired after the gig.....
Have some balls and ask for what you are worth, and settle for nothing less, otherwise you are just part of the problem. |
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Joined:
December 2004
Posts: 65
Location: Phoenix | I've played bars that are combination sports bar/ live band. However, IMHO these don't go well together. Most of the week the bar will have its sports regulars who also want to see sports Friday and Saturday night too. These regulars aren't real happy with live sound. Then there's the live sound customers, they want to dance or else hear music in the background.
Now it sounds simple at first: have sports on a few weekends and live sound on weekends when there isn't a major sports event. But true sports fans will insist there's sports EVERY weekend, while folks that want to dance aren't going to go out of their way to go to a sports bar on the off chance there's a live band instead...so the regular sports fans win out. At least that's exactly how the scenario played out at our last sports/live music venue.
Now perhaps this may seem off topic, the question was about pay...but here's how I see it: ask for what you would want at a better-established club. Because you need to be able to be consistent and fair with your pricing. Giving a club a "break" (charging too little) by thinking "well, they're just starting out, and we haven't played for money either" isn't good for either of you. It's not good for the club because they need to realize that successfully having live music requires a commitment. It's not good for you because there's a lot of time and money tied up in your art. It's not good for the area music scene because good semi-pro bands eventually get undercut by bands that are willing to play for little to no money.
A four piece, for a full 3 hours or more...I'd say no less than $400. (Since you're supplying the PA, start with $500 and wiggle down to 450 but not much less).
Sadly, some bars here are only paying $250 which hasn't much changed in 30 years. We've been consistently making around 500 to 600 per night but we're a higher-energy dance band. |
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Joined:
April 2006
Posts: 2491
Location: Copenhagen Denmark | What Bill C said ..
When you are registered , then items are deductable , also for the Venue-management ( i e your band is deductable ) , as an amateur , your pay comes out of the manager`s pocket , ..
an ex. ,:
Amateur ( Not registered )
They pay 500 usd ,.. the venue needs to turn-over at least three times as much .
Cover cost of goods
Cover taxes
Overheads (electricity .. water .. soap .. rent .. etc.)
Pro ( Registered )
Deduct from taxes .. Profit ONLY !! |
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Joined:
October 2008
Posts: 489
| There is no easy answer - $200, $400, etc - these things do vary by locale.
Do some research and find out what other similar local performers are getting. If you know any well enough you could simply ask them, or you could check out their websites which will sometimes contain this information.
If you're not above employing subterfuge, contact them as though you were a club owner looking for talent and find out what they quote you. You might even take out a blind Craigslist ad with this pretext to see what you get in reply. Consider the source of whatever information you get. A local "star" who has garnered a following will be more attractive to most venues and will therefore command a higher fee.
Charging what you feel you are worth might be what more than the market in your area will bear; then again if you come in too low you will be doing yourself and the local market harm.
If you do get this gig, others are likely to follow. As mentioned above, pay your taxes. You are now a business. Keep records. Consider expenses - strings, equipment depreciation, mileage to and from gigs and practice. This is not the glamor side of things but it's a reality. The club is deducting you as an expense. If they ask you for a social security number, it's a slam dunk that someone, somewhere will be looking for your declaration of income. |
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Joined:
December 2004
Posts: 580
Location: Denmark | One way to consider:
Example: 6 persons in the dance band. Total investment in equipment is $25K rate by the hour is $40. Gig is 3hrs located 40km away.
Pack 3p*0.5hr*40 = 60
Drive 2cars*40km*0.40 = 32
Setup 3p*1hr*40 = 80
Play 6p*3hr*40 = 720
Pack 3p*0.5*40 = 60
Drive 2cars*40km*0.40 = 32
Unpack 2p*0.5hr*40 = 40
Equipment 1/25*25000 = 1000
Total: = 2024
Technically seen this is income which often means that you have to pay taxes. |
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Joined:
January 2009
Posts: 4536
Location: Flahdaw | Not that I'm performing out, or even being asked to, but I would never play at a sports bar. Most people are there to watch the 120 tv's that are hanging everywhere. They will scream for a touchdown in the middle of your best song, or boo at totally inappropriate times. For me it would be a very unsatisfying experience, unless the pay was FABULOUS. But, everyone's different. |
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Joined:
November 2005
Posts: 1126
Location: Omaha, NE | Around here, a one-nighter for a band like yours might pay between $350 and $500. For two nights (assuming you don't have to tear down and load out after the first night) you might be looking something like $600 to $800. |
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Joined:
December 2006
Posts: 6996
Location: Jet City | Thanks for the response guys, I think we're worth way more than I'll be asking for, but I'm going to aask for $100/head, $400 total and see where it goes from there.
I too have played some venues that were not music oriented, so I'm already expecting some of the above mentioned issues.
I guess we'll see how it goes. If we're good enough, we should have some listeners I think. If not, I'll turn up the mains. :D |
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Joined:
April 2006
Posts: 2491
Location: Copenhagen Denmark | Way t`go DAMON .. |
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Joined:
March 2005
Posts: 5567
Location: Blue Ridge Mountains | Very few gigs will have a sound system so having your own is a given and part of the prep and package. Yes, getting the gear is expensive but if you have the talent, gigs, and public support you can recoup most of that over time (unless you are constantly getting newer and better gear i.e.: gas);
therefore buy the best gear you can to begin with however you can...
Small groups are fun; a versatile solo or duo can usually earn nearly as much and have less of a divide...which if you are the owner of the sound system is not usually evenly divided...
Unless things have changed much (and in this economy I doubt it) $100 to $150 per person per night is average...
I am a big fan of duo's and singles who have big sounds: Like Davis and his wife at Amelia...incredible!
Best wishes on your venture (beware clubs with chicken wire in front of the stage...seriously) |
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Joined:
September 2005
Posts: 3619
Location: GATLINBURG TENNESSEE :) | You also may want to consider the fact that if you offer your services too cheap, you'll be known as the "cheap band". Each area has its going rate, and by checking with local clubs you can find out what that is. If you feel you are as good or better than the competition, charge accordingly. |
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Joined:
December 2001
Posts: 7247
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Damon, that seems to be reasonable around here. I would add $100 (and equal share as it were) for the sound system. It's either your own, or to pay for someone else... either way.. it's another "instrument" in the scheme of things. |
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A question for the pros... How much to charge for a gig?
