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| This comment was originally posted on the Sell/Trade Board with regards to the 1968 Deluxe Balladeer for sale. However, as it may be of interest to some who might miss it in its' present location, I am re-posting it for the sake of convenience.
Regarding the serialization of shiny bowl guitars, there is one popular misconception that needs to be addressed. The numbered serial numbers did not end when the A-XXX and B- XXX serial numbers began, but rather, they ran concurrently until about 1972 when the system began at zero with the oval metal labels.
I personally own Model # 1122 with a Serial # of 10890, which is both: 1) typed on the paper label with brown ink (only used during the end of the paper label run), and, 2) stamped into the neck block. And, I have pictures of the Cat Stevens Model # 1617-4, which bears the same paper label with brown ink, and has Serial # 13338, although I cannot verify if this number is stamped into the neck block.
The highest serial number that I have personally seen on a shiny bowl is in the 3000 range, although it could be a bit higher. The serial numbers I have seen in the 5,000 - 6,000 range have all been early textured bowls. Therefore, it could be safely stated that there were a maximum of no more than 5,000 (perhaps 6,000) shiny bowls, including the A-XXX and B-XXX serial numbers. All C-XXX serial numbered guitars have the textured bowl. |
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| One more comment with regard to shiny bowl serialization. The # 5 12-strings were introduced in 1967, much earlier than most believe. I presently own Serial # 731, which is one of the earliest 12 strings produced. It has a three-piece top, and the Serial # is stamped on the neck block in a circle, instead of a rectangle.
Serial # 731; however, is not the first 12-string, as the model shown in the 1967 catalog was probably the prototype. The pictured model has a flat termination of the fretboard at the soundhole, while Serial # 731 has the curved termination that follows the contour of the soundhole. |
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Location: SoCal | I've never seen a Cat Stevens model. Model # 1617-4 denotes a Legend, natural face, with a p/u.
By the way Bob, your GCDB, now my GCDB, has found a good and permenant home. Many thanks to you. |
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Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Also posted for the other thread;
Bob;
Do you have any thoughts on the approximate number of Glen Campbell Deluxe Balladeers (deep shiney bowl) made? Someone told me fifty to a hundered...was it you?
Do you still have one of these, Bob?
Wayne |
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Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Paul, I think Bob's referring to the very early Cat Stevens owned Legend that was on Ebay a while back.
Wayne |
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| Paul,
I am glad that you are still pleased with the GCDB. It is an outstanding guitar in every sense of the word; however, I do not regret passing it on to you because I am confident that it is being played more.
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Wayne,
It appears that Mr. Moody has answered your question regarding my former GCDB. He is now the proud and rightful owner of that instrument, which is undoubtedly the best sounding, best playing guitar of any brand that I have ever owned. It is also the most balanced instrument that I have played, with an incredible clarity and resonance on every fret.
With regard to the number of GCDB's produced, I was not the one who originally conjectured the figure of 50. If I recall correctly, I believe that was cwk2. However, I do not believe that the number could possible exceed 50. In the past seven years of extensive research, I have only seen (or heard of) four GCBD's without the inlaid GC initials. This figure (four) includes the aforementioned instrument presently owned by Paul Moody, the one owned by Dave Witko, one owned by Sam Stathakis, and a fourth owned by a non-OFC member in California.
There could be as many as eight with the inlaid GC initials, as it has been reported in print that Ovation kept eight guitars on hand for the personal use of Mr. Campbell during his TV program heydey. It could be assumed that all of these had the initials.
I spoke with Glen Campbell several years ago, and inquired as to the whereabouts of these original GCDB's from the TV show, and he told me that he still owned most of them. However, we know that there is at least one beautiful example that he doesn't still have, that resides in the Northern Territory.
Sincerely,
Bob Frith
Regarding the Cat Stevens guitar, this was not the model name, but rather a guitar that belonged to Cat Stevens. I have seen various pictures of Cat Stevens playing the guitar, and printed the pictures from the auction listed last year on eBay. Although the auction closed at over $3,500, it appeared to be a scam, and the seller was banned from eBay the following week. I did not follow up with the high bidder, but I trust that the scam was discovered before he sent money. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | Bob and I have had several discussions about this topic and it's also clear that serial numbers were duplicated between the acoustic guitar line and the storm series. Also some of the old guitars seem to have had their labels replaced at some point. And there are even some examples which have a 2nd label underneith the visible one. I've got one like this and I'm afraid to remove the top label to see what's under it. Dave |
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Location: SoCal | Dave, when you say "duplicated", I assume you're not just saying that the same serial number line was used in different guitar lines (ie, Axxx used in both acoustics and electrics), but the actual number (ie A408), used in two different guitars? |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | Yes, I mean the exact same number on acoustics and on storms. Like A-202 and A-202 on a storm and an acoustic. Dave |
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Location: boulder | Dave,
I can't believe you had me lift an overlaid rossette on my Josh white s/n 670 and you won't lift a label. :p
I wish we could start a shiny bowl/storm serial # list and just find out for ourselves what s/n goes to what guitar. add as we see em. peace |
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Location: boulder | just another time killing thought on the #7 and 8's. if I recall the book says they had two sets of guitars for glen at his ready. There was a girl who was responsible to make sure he had tehm when he needed. Does this mean there are 50 -16 (glens) -4 (otherwise known) =30 left somewhere out there in the world. i need to build up my guitar karma to find one i think. peace |
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Location: SoCal | I would guess that they had 2 sets of guitars for Glen (6, 12, and nylon) and then a few more guitars for others on the show to play (I remember a piture from Guitar Player mag of a group performing on the show, Glen, the Smothers Brothers,and and few others, and Dick Smothers was playing a Deluxe Balladeer.
If there were 6 for Glen, and a few extras, that would account for the 8.
Oh yeah, the count might be higher as I remember an episode (from when the show was on CMT a few years ago), where Waylon Jennings was playing a T-head, and Glen was playing his T-head, with the initials. So the 8 might include 2 T-heads. |
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Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | IMHO, it is unlikely that there are that many initialled GCDB guitars. Like Moody, I think the book reference to eight guitars includes 6-string steel (GCDB) X2, 6-string nylon X2, 12-string X2, and electric X2 for a total of eight.
I have collected everything I could get my hands on of the original GCDBs, including video, ads, magazine clips posters, you name it. In about 90% of this stuff I can identify the guitar as being the one I have due to the distinctive grain in both the Brazilian rosewood bridge and the top.
In the other 10% of the material is another GCDB with a plainer top, a nineteenth fret marker and wider spaced initial inlay in a more western type of font with a dot inlay between the initials.
As for about 50 or less of the production models, I can believe that alright…in eight years of Ebaying, I can only remember seeing Bobs guitar (twice) on there while I’ve seen dozens of the later GC Artist model for sale.
Wayne |
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Location: SoCal | I would be very surprised if there were more than 10 GC DB's still in existance. |
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Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Here ia a really lousy video capture pic of the two original GC Deluxe Balladeers in action on the old Goodtime Hour in March '69.
Merle Haggard is playing the one I have and Glen is playing the second version with the different font and extra 19th fret inlay.
This pic is not good enough to see much detail but the video itself is very clear.
Wayne
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Location: SoCal | hmmm, am I the only one who can't see the pic? |
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Location: boulder | hi tony,
no I see it. It's two dolphins. (no really I see it). Glen is wearing a brown leather coat and thinking how someday he'd like to sell me his guitar. mike |
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Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Take a look now, Tony...I changed the file to a jpeg instead of a bitmap.
Wayne |
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Location: SoCal | Boy, those are beautiful guitars. I waited 30 years to get one and am glad that I'm now an owner. |
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Shiny Bowl Serialization
