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November 2003
Posts: 11039
Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | Stephen, this is why you will always be MY bitch. |
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Joined:
May 2003
Posts: 425
Location: SE Michigan | Yes, it was a verified address and the buyer had literally hundreds of transactions though paypal.
So your buyer (with a verified address) used a stolen credit card? I would call the local police (where the buyer lives) and file a credit card fraud report.
Even if the guy was legitimate but the credit card was in some goofy status, it is his responsibility to make it right, kind of like if he gave you a bad check.
But I do agree, paypal should be eating his lunch not yours. I would be making more phone calls if it were me, including one to my bank about an unauthorized withdrawal, I would also be calling my local prosecuting attorney about a credit card fraud complaint. |
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Joined:
July 2003
Posts: 1922
Location: Canton (Detroit), MI | I AM a Premier member....and I thoroughly dislike PayPal, despite (luckily) never having gotten shafted(other than the outrageous fee structure for sellers). Their move to promptly ban the Google payment feature just shows that they won't play fair. Brian....there are NO other real options for online auctions. There WERE (remember Yahoo auctions?), but they have all been bulldozed by the eBay/PayPal juggernaut.
Not sure if U.S. anti-trust laws would apply to a business doing world-wide activity like eBay. With the current political climate, I doubt that anyone cares, there are bigger fish to fry.
Martin isn't a monopoly???? (just kidding)
Roger |
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Joined:
February 2005
Posts: 11840
Location: closely held secret | I set up a new account at a different bank. I keep nothing but the minimum in the account, and when paypal payments come in I transfer them to my bank account and TAKE IT OUT. Paypal can't take what they can't get to. |
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Joined:
March 2002
Posts: 14842
Location: NJ | I (begrudgingly) opened a PayPal account for the sole purpose of buying OFCswag. Two months later, I got charged for 3 transactions that I didn't MAKE.
Their Customer Service(?) staff are complete incompetent fuckwits. I had the displeasure of dealing with numerous ones on the phone. They all sucked.
After having the 3 purchases (total of @$125) deducted from my credit card, I thereby cancelled the card and patiently await the joyous day that I hear that they've been involved in some corporate scandal and have gone belly-up. F@ck'em. |
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Joined:
December 2003
Posts: 1071
Location: Carle Place, NY | My problem with PayPal was similar to Stephen's. However, PayPal did not withdraw the money from my bank account. I did not know that they could do that. I was able to resolve it although the customer service there really does suck big time.
Bottom line is that selling/buying with eBay/PayPal is a gamble no matter what you do. 99.9% of the time it goes well, but when you end up in that .1% you get screwed. The most frustrating part is that both eBay and PayPal openly advertise that you are "protected" when in actuality you're not. |
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Joined:
May 2003
Posts: 425
Location: SE Michigan | Two months later, I got charged for 3 transactions that I didn't MAKE.
Wow...I guess you guys really do have something to bitch about. I guess I've just been lucky, well over 100 transactions through Ebay and Paypal and no problems.
But I'd be pissed off as well under these circumstance. |
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Joined:
December 2003
Posts: 1889
Location: Central Massachusetts | Originally posted by Waskel:
I set up a new account at a different bank. I keep nothing but the minimum in the account, and when paypal payments come in I transfer them to my bank account and TAKE IT OUT. Paypal can't take what they can't get to. Waskel, this is the way to go. Thanks for the tip! |
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Joined:
April 2004
Posts: 13303
Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | Brain, it was a legitimate credit card used by the buyer but he later reported the card as lost/stolen.
Actually I did contact the buyer and he graciously sent me a check for the pedal and apoligized for my troubles. He said that the credit card company was doing all of the reclaiming on their own and he wasn't involved in it (or even aware until he started being contacted by people like myself).
Waskel, if the money is not in your account for paypal to reclaim, they will show you with a negative balance....forcing you to put money in the account if you ever want to use it.
If you ignore the negative balance, after 60 or 90 days (don't remember) Paypal will shut down the account and turn it over to a collection agency to collect for the balance.
They have proven to me they are a piece of shit outfit :mad: that I will be wary of from now on. The other two incidences are different but just as bad....one involving a refund and the other with me as the buyer.
Jeff.....as long as you continue to treat me well and take care of me like you do, I will always be your bitch
;) |
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Joined:
January 2006
Posts: 48
Location: Spokane, WA | I really haven't had any problems, per se, with PayPal. I sell alot of stuff on eBay, (feedbacks like 2350 or something) in the 4 to 5 dollar range, and the fees for small transactions are steep. It ends up being like 12-15 percent. The percentage is smaller for larger transactions. But, it is smooth, and fast, and reliable, and I've just decided that it's a necessary expense for selling on eBay. |
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Joined:
July 2004
Posts: 766
Location: New Hampsha | Having sold a couple of thousand items on the Bay over the years, I can truly tell you that PayPal SUCKS!!!
They always prtect the buyer no matter what and have contributed to several really slick scams because of this. So for those of you who use PayPal as a buyer; go on doing so, but you'll never deal with me.
Upgrade your account so you can accept credit card payments - go ahead! Then Paypal takes the credit card cut from EVERY payment even if it was made with a cash transfer.
Hey Buyers! Want to get your item for free? Just buy it using Paypal and wait for the delivery. If there was no delivery confirmation on the shipment, you're home free - just claim you never got it and Paypal will yank the money from the seller's account and give it back to you - You got a Freebie!
If there is a delivery confirmation, it's a tad harder - just claim it was damaged. Send the empty box back to the seller with a delivery confirmation and Paypal will once again give you your cash back. Freebie! If you don't have the cojones to be so blatantly dishonest, send your bad crankshaft back to the seller and keep the good one you bought from him.
Ask me how I know! I dare you!
If you are a seller and accept Paypal it is just a matter of time before you get screwed. Paypal engages in fraudulent banking practices that no bricks and mortar establishment could ever get away with, but because they are on the web they are not covered by banking rules - they know it and they are judge, jury and executioner and steal your money at every turn.
PAYPAL SUCKS! |
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Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 1817
Location: Minden, Nebraska | I have been using PayPal for years with not too many problems, but have one going on now. I may have to weigh in again, but I also may have to pay them a visit. Their operations center is only a few miles from where I live. Sorry to hear about the other woes... |
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Joined:
April 2004
Posts: 13303
Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | Mitzdawg speaks the truth! |
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Joined:
July 2002
Posts: 1900
| Waskel, Excellent suggestion. I thought before that without an account balance, paypal can't snipe it, and they sure can't send you a bill! So, basically they will 'take the money and run' if it's available. The PayPal theme song... "Take The Money and Run"
(Thank you Steve Miller Band!) |
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Joined:
November 2003
Posts: 11039
Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | Those of you who need an outlet to vent your frustrations and or educate yourself about PayPal's Dark Side...
PayPalSucks |
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Joined:
July 2002
Posts: 1900
| Jeff W., Excellent website. No doubt they have a serious team of attorneys. Nothing but a monumental 'class-action lawsuit' will ever stop PayPal's criminal activities. I imgaine if we did a chronology survey, we would see that PayPal's dubious activities increase at the end of each month and the end of each business quarter. Hmm... |
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Joined:
March 2006
Posts: 186
Location: The State of Hockey | I think Mitzdawg is right. As a buyer it is great. But as a seller it is not so good. I fortunately have had no problems as a seller yet. |
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Joined:
July 2003
Posts: 1922
Location: Canton (Detroit), MI | I've found that you can't sell well on eBay without taking PayPal. If you don't take it, all you hear from bidders are whines about "why don't you take PayPal?"....and if you try to only accept Paypal from bank account transfer only (if you don't have a Premier account), you have continuous problems with people trying to pay with a credit card, who don't read the listing, who then whine "why don't you take credit card?".
On top of that, when I didn't take PayPal, my items didn't sell well. The bid amounts picked up noticeably after I started taking it.
I finally gave up and got a Premier account(and get ripped every time for their exorbitant percentage). Crossing my fingers that I don't get burned.....
Roger |
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Joined:
July 2004
Posts: 766
Location: New Hampsha | My last 2 cents:
Roger - I agree. After I stopped Paypal my sales dropped and the amount realized per item dropped. But when I took Paypal I got burned on about 1% of the transactions; I don't anymore (knock on wood). Sometime I might do the math and see if the money lost up front is made up for by the money I lost on the 1%.
BUT, my feedback scores improved because I didn't have urination contests every 1%. Overall, I feel it's less stressful to do business without using russian-roulette Paypal.
Another thought - I sell mostly used motorcyle parts, which is inherently riskier than selling something that's shiney and new, as how I describe something might not calibrate with someone else.
Scammers don't care - if they want what you have you will get burned, regardless of how honest you are!
Weigh your risks and make yer choice! |
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Joined:
December 2001
Posts: 7237
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | I have waited to comment on this, but basically I think ALL are correct. I have had a couple of small issues with PayPal, all were resolved easily. The convenience is worth it to me, especially when it comes to the shipping part, but may not be for everyone.
As far as the Sucks.com websites... there is one for just about EVERY major (and a few not so major) companies out there. walmart, paypal, ebay, Microsoft, Netscape, AOL, Ford, Chevy, they all have dedicated hate sites someplace. Put just about any name in google as "xxxx sucks" and you will find pages on pages of rants.
I have found in ALL cases that I did a little digging, there was ALWAYS something a little more to the story. I have set up a couple of clubs, to use PayPal for memberships, store, donations etc... They don't use eBay at all, just their own site, never a problem.
But, I repeat what I said first. ALL of the above opinions are correct for the people providing them. However, like with anything, know the risks, know the pitfalls, know the advantages and the disadvantages and make the best choice for you.
As a buyer, if someone doesn't take PayPal, unless I know them, I buy elsewhere. |
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Joined:
November 2005
Posts: 1126
Location: Omaha, NE | Originally posted by dvd:
But, eBay is effectively a monopoly in the auction space. While there may be other online auction services out there, their audience is paltry compared to eBay. While eBay may not own 100% of the market, I suspect they would be subject to anti-monopoly laws if pressed. On what basis? The stuff you are talking about with Microsoft was fundamentally different than anything eBay does.
I've got no particular affection for eBay, but there is no logic in the "large market share = monopoly" statement. |
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OT: Paypal
