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February 2004
Posts: 1634
Location: Warren,Pa. | I was in Jersey visiting family and needed a sanity break, so I went to GC in Paramus. Picked up lots of Ovations. I've owned Custom Legends, Adami, Custom Elites...so it was all pretty run-of-the-mill...until I picked up a GC Baladeer with a cedar top. This guitar struck me like no other Ovation I've heard! I've had a Seagull S6, so I know a cedar top sounds different, but THIS plain-Jane Ovation made me want to trade my Std Elite LX right on the spot. Anyone else reacted to this guitar the way I did? John <>{ |
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March 2005
Posts: 417
Location: Cicero, NY | I had the same epiphany with a cedar topped Tak that I just had to own. And now I do. Played a cedar Seagulls well and, despite not liking it as much as the Tak, it really impressed me as well. Don't know what it was about the tone but it just struck me as just the way a guitar should sound. Played a bunch of others, including some O's (though I didn't have a chance to try the cedar O), which I still love dearly but nothing hit me like that cedar topped Tak.
JW, you seem to know quite a bit about wood, is it the cedar? |
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June 2002
Posts: 6197
Location: Phoenix AZ | THE best sounding wood topped Ovation I have ever heard or owned is cedar. The FD14. 'Nuf said.
Dave |
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March 2005
Posts: 12754
Location: Boise, Idaho | Loved the sound of my Classic 1713 with cedar when I first tried it out in a music store. I wasn't sure I wanted a nylon string, but got a little feedback from this board and it was still there calling me when I went back a month later. Although it was 300 miles away, a guy I work with was in the same store I was and he played a few bars of Classical Gas on it. That made the GAS pains unbearable, so I bought it. |
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February 2005
Posts: 349
Location: Snellville, GA | Only one I have is the plain jane O with the Cedar top. Bought it on the spot. |
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November 2003
Posts: 11039
Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | Originally posted by WeaserP:
JW, you seem to know quite a bit about wood, is it the cedar? They are fairly close in structure. Cedar is a less dense timber than spruce. It is also less strong, but very straight grained... because the trees grow on a slower spiral than spruce trees, and extremely stable. Cedar has a terrific ring, with fast, brilliant harmonics and long, ringing sustain. In addition to the qualities of the soundboard, the final tone comes from the strings, the air cavity, the back, the bridge yatta-yatta... |
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May 2005
Posts: 327
Location: Evansville,IN | I have cedar tree I will give to someone if they come and cut it down. That way you get the cedar, and I get rid of the p.i.t.a. tree. :D |
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March 2005
Posts: 12754
Location: Boise, Idaho | Leave it to a midwesterner to refer to trees as pita. My dad moved from the Midwest to Oregon and cuts down all the trees that are in his yard because they get in his way when he mows the lawn. Cedar trees grow like weeds there. |
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November 2002
Posts: 1300
Location: Madison, Wisconsin | They make great bedding for hamsters |
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May 2005
Posts: 327
Location: Evansville,IN | Maybe I should contact a hamster bedding company. :D At least someone would have a use for it.
I didn't plant the darned thing, and it wouldn't be so bad if it didn't block half of the sidewalk, so it may go under the ax. Whoever planted it didn't think about how large it was going to get. :( |
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Posts: 2850
Location: Midland, MI | I didn't plant the darned thing, and it wouldn't be so bad if it didn't block half of the sidewalk, so it may go under the ax. Whoever planted it didn't think about how large it was going to get. In our quiet little hamlet, the city used to plant silver maple trees on the outlawns. We still have one in front of our house. They can get big (ours is about 3' dia. and ~60' tall) and their roots tend to wander near the surface, doing interesting things to the nearby sidewalks (and the neighbor's driveway). The city doesn't plant maples any longer. Wait until they find out that mountain ash will grow to 50-60'. |
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November 2004
Posts: 110
Location: Peoria, Illinois | Now you have me thinking cedar. Damn it......... |
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December 2003
Posts: 13987
Location: Upper Left USA | As they say in Connecticut:
"SEE-dah"
I too (to one up Cruster) have 4 very large Maples in the vicinity around my home. They have upset walkways, reached the sewer 16' down and havedropped large limbs on parked vehicals. There is evidence of extreme figuring in the burl and warts on several of them and I have been taking estimates to drop them.
They are over 3' butts and exceed 60' in height. They are beautiful but they have reached that age of danger and nuisance.
The best part is there are a few Figured Maple buyers I'm in touch with. Hopefully I can recoup some loss and possibly add to the "fine instrument" resources!
A Cedar in the wrong place is a weed! |
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July 2003
Posts: 1922
Location: Canton (Detroit), MI | bauerhillboy, I reacted to it so positively, I BOUGHT ONE!!!! I've had it for over a year now. Has a very rich sound. Only thing I don't like about the guitar is the matte top, but I suspicion that adds to the sound.
Roger |
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February 2005
Posts: 11840
Location: closely held secret | Originally posted by MWoody:
They are over 3' butts and exceed 60' in height. At the Tour I observed some 3' butts that exceeded 60" in height. They kept getting in front of my video camera. |
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March 2005
Posts: 12754
Location: Boise, Idaho | Waskel,
You forgot this was the arborists board. Is engleman better than sitka spruce for tops? I noticed that Taylor wants a lot more for a guitar with engleman vs. one with sitka. |
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May 2005
Posts: 327
Location: Evansville,IN | Sorry guys didn't mean to highjack your thread. That wasn't very nice of me, and I apoligize. I still don't like that darned cedar tree. :D |
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December 2003
Posts: 13987
Location: Upper Left USA | In an act of compensation please allow me to throw in that the FD 14, S771 some other more obsure models with the Cedar tops have been crafted toward a deeper, more mellow sound.
It works. It is a lot less mainstream, even for an Ovation though. |
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Joined:
July 2004
Posts: 338
Location: Omaha | Now you guys have me confused, too. I was thinking of (trying to) order the nylon string Balladeer (in lefty dress) with a spruce top rather than cedar, but you're teasing me...
...of course, spruce, cedar, steel strings, nylon strings; lots of factors that play into the tone mix...
...and (maybe alpep or someone else can answer this?) will Ovation even build one with a spruce top if it calls for cedar? (They have to special build it anyway since it will be a lefty.) Pretty please... :rolleyes: |
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December 2003
Posts: 13987
Location: Upper Left USA | If I may be so bold as to answer for W2 on this one:
"Get both!"
This would be a double GASP (Guitar Aquisition/Significant Purchase)
I could be wiped out by a Significant other Has Other Plans (SHOP). |
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March 2002
Posts: 14842
Location: NJ | . . . just don't get FoundUnderCarKilled-ed |
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November 2004
Posts: 4413
| The difference between Sitka and Engleman pricewise has always been there. Engleman is scarcer than Sitka, but I have no idea if it sounds any better. Rather like Indian and Brazilian rosewood. The Brazilian is always way more expensive, but I have read several times that some Indian rosewood is just as good as the Amazon stuff - it really does vary tree to tree.
A lot of guitar makers these days offer their guitars with a choice of spruce or cedar for the same price. Especially true in the hand-made classical world. And more and more classical players use cedar in concert. This is maybe because amplification is increasingly used in concert halls and the greater volume/attack of spruce is no longer necessary. The tonal richness of cedar is greater than spruce to my ears (and obviously others too) but you don't get the "snap" that spruce gives to nylon strings. I don't know about cedar and steel strings so much, but all those FuD owners can't all be wrong (even tho Bongo Boy is one of them). |
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March 2005
Posts: 1421
Location: Orange County, California | Originally posted by leftovertion:
..of course, spruce, cedar, steel strings, nylon strings; lots of factors that play into the tone mix... Mike,
If you want a "warmer-fuller" sound than your 1777 gives you, than you should should have the factory make you a Lefty 1713 or 1763 WITH THE CEDAR TOP or an FD14 clone. Money no object, that's what I'd do. If you just want to soften things up, and give your fingers a break, buy some John Pearse Thomastic strings. I've played them on my 1763. They were somewhere between nylon ans steel, and very easy to play.
Remeber; opinions are like belly-buttons, everybody has one, and there's no accounting for taste (good or bad!!). |
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Joined:
July 2003
Posts: 1922
Location: Canton (Detroit), MI | The 2005 Collectors has an Engelman top, but I don't hear a significant difference between it and my 1777 with the AA (Sitka?) top....maybe after it opens up?????
Cedar is a good option, and if you can get it with a gloss finish, even better. I played a Takamine (EAN15C) with a gloss cedar top at our local GC this evening and it had a nice sound.
Roger |
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March 2005
Posts: 12754
Location: Boise, Idaho | Lovin my 1713. Going to play it. Bye. |
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June 2005
Posts: 54
Location: Mt Clemens, MI USA | I have that guitar. I really like it. As many know I gouged the hell out of the top three days in to my ownership--I'm still depressed! Anyway, I've had the guitar a good month now and I just went to GC because I was going to trade it in because the nick bothers me so much. After playing other guitars and after owning and playing the cedar O for a month, I realized how much I like my cedar O. I hadn’t noticed the difference in sound until after I had mine. I really didn't even like the spruce O's by comparison. I was going to trade in on a Ledged, but not now. I'll have to go to a good repair guy and see what he can do about my baby's gouge. |
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Cedar Tops