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Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands | ultra namm spiel |
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Location: south east Michigan | Looks like a winner.
I look forward to playing one. |
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Location: Wooster, Ohio | Remember the discussion of how long it would take to take the contour bowl to the Korean models. That discussion is over.
Steve |
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Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands | It makes sense to me too, because tacoma did something similar with their electric olympia papoose (and mine came out great). I'd have to take a serious look at it.
Ovation, Kam sa ahm ni da! |
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Location: Australia | I wonder how popular the contour is compared to the standard bowl ?
Looks like a great guitar. Does it also come with a standard bowl ? |
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Location: south east Michigan | I betcha not.
1) It seems like the Ultra is all about hitting the right "price point". I think that would mean few, if any options.
2) There might come a time when the "old" style bowl is a custom order. |
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Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | hard guitar to ignore at 800 new. I think this will do battle with the "T" series. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | I think this guitar will be an absolute winner. Should sell really well. I'm just a little befuddled by the marketing and what it really is vs. a balladeer. It's priced below the balladeer but it's got features better than the balladeer. So why would anyone buy a balladeer ??? Ovation seems to do this a lot - introduce a model to prey upon other models. If it was up to me I would have called THIS guitar a balladeer.
Dave |
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Location: NJ | I'm just trying to comprehend the extent of WHAT's done overseas . . .
Dave, while I understand what you're "saying", my feelings are that the Balladeer is a US-made model, and should remain as such. |
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Location: SoCal | Figure a street price of about $600. This guitar ought to sell like hotcakes. I agree with Dave. They should have called this guitar the Baladeer. If I were buying my first Ovation, I'd seriously look at this one.
But there's a snob in me that doesn't like the Korean connection..... |
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Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | Calling this guitar the Balladeer would completely obscure any line (no matter how hazy it already is) between US Line and Offshore lines.. |
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Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands | I don't think this is aimed at one model "preying" on another. To me, it's Ovation keeping control of production and scaring away competitors and filling a price point niche.
They felt a need to fill that $600 niche. It'd be a good place to park between your upgrade from celebrity to a fully usa model. I'd only be disappointed if they started to discontinue usa models for these usa/korean models, but I haven't heard anyone say that. To me its sensible for ovation and the consumer.
Start with your applause, move on to the celebrity, try your ultra, then to usa ovation, and then adamas. |
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Location: Hicksville, NY | "Start with your applause, move on to the celebrity, try your ultra, then to usa ovation, and then adamas."
Chances are, in my opinion, not everyone will go beyond the USA Ovation. I went from a USA Ovation, to an Applause, and then back to the USA Ovation ... it seems like a roller coaster ride, but that's more enough for me. I'm pretty content with having only one CL, and I believe that it'll stay that way for a very long time.
That ULTRA is very nice, and a good "hybrid" between the USA and Korean models. I had owned several Korean-made guitars, and if you're cautious about what you're shopping for, their quality and craftsmanship are second to none. Unfortunately, their sale/resale values are some of the lowest in the market. Someday, they might be at par with products made in neighboring Japan. In this country alone, it's beginning to be a reality in the electronics and automobile markets. For example, I used to remember a time when Samsung used to be found in the bargain aisle in the electronics dept. at K-Mart. Today, their flat screen HDTVs are not only of high quality, but one of the most expensive purchases. LG used to sell cheap desktop PCs under the Goldstar brand ... today, they sell almost everything from TVs to kitchen appliances.
Just my .02 cents ... |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | Originally posted by cliff:
Dave, while I understand what you're "saying", my feelings are that the Balladeer is a US-made model, and should remain as such. Balladeer is a "made" in USA model that is more expensive and has downgraded features than the Ultra that is "assembled" in the USA. You tell me, which is gonna sell better? I predict Balladeer numbers will plummet. Those interested in gen-u-wine USA will go the extra hundreds and pay for the Legend which at least has similar features to the Ultra. People interested in the Ultra aren't gonna pay more for a Balladeer just to get cheaper electronics, old design bowl, chinzy rosette, no abalone. Oh yeah, they get know that not only was the guitar assembled in the USA, is was actually BUILT in the USA. Sorry to be a pessimist, but I see death of the Balladeer on the horizon. Mark my words, just as ford has made the 500 the NEW Tarus, in a few years Ovation will christen the Ultra as the NEW Balladeer.
Dave |
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Location: south east Michigan | Agreed... Well with the realm of possibilities.
Here in Motown, I heard a radio interview with marketing experts who suggested that renaming the 500 to Tarus would be a huge error and have a negative effect on the "Tarus" brand name. |
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Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands | I don't think Ovation will crap out like Ford. Or confront what Tech21 is going thru. Tech21 makes a primo "sansamp", costs about 200. Now behringer (a german company) makes a sansamp acoutic di just as good as tech21's, though with housing of plastic. Behringer's costs only 30 and is made in china. Now, if tech21 was smart they would've come up with a quality alternative, made overseas, or a hybrid us/china item. Instead, they have to compete against this, from a start dead in the water. Ovation won't go thru this and make it difficult for others to compete with them. |
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Location: Round Rock, TX | Does this thing have a solid top? If it does, then I'm in the "the Balladeer is dead" camp. If they come out with a multi-soundhole model, that should put the Elite T in ICU. Without a solid top there's still a clear reason to go with the all-USA models. |
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Location: SoCal | It's got a solid top. I'll be curious to try this guitar. I would guess that it will either kill off the Balladeer or become the Balladeer..... |
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Location: NJ | This this thing WOULD make a serious gigging guitar . . . |
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Location: SoCal | That would be my guess.... |
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Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | I picked it up and played it at NAMM...
... it's a good guitar |
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Location: SoCal | I was wrong on the street price on this. It should be about $900. About the only thing I don't like is the rosewood fingerboard (I'm an ebony or walnut fan). But even at a grand, it's a helluva bargin.... |
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Location: NJ | Originally posted by an4340:
I don't think Ovation will crap out like Ford. Or confront what Tech21 is going thru. Tech21 makes a primo "sansamp", costs about 200. Now behringer (a german company) makes a sansamp acoutic di just as good as tech21's, though with housing of plastic. Behringer's costs only 30 and is made in china. Now, if tech21 was smart they would've come up with a quality alternative, made overseas, or a hybrid us/china item. Instead, they have to compete against this, from a start dead in the water. Ovation won't go thru this and make it difficult for others to compete with them. behringer has done this over and over and over. this year at namm they had EXACT copies of mxr and electro harmonix pedals. I cannot express the contempt I have for this company in words. I will never support them nor use any of their gear unless I have no other alternative. |
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Location: Scotland | Originally posted by an4340:
Tech21 makes a primo "sansamp", costs about 200. Now behringer (a german company) makes a sansamp acoutic di just as good as tech21's, The Berhringer DI is great for the money, but it's not in the same league as the Acoustic Sansamp. Not even close. |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | I'm somewhere between Al's and Paul's opinion. I use a lot of Behringer gear, but I do not expect it to be the same as what they supposedly copy. I can't address the new pieces, but I have seen the inside of several of their pieces out of curiosity or to install upgrades, and the "copy" stops at the box. Overall, I can't say they are built like tanks or built like crap. I love their DI, Shark, RTA's, Feedback Destoyers and rack effects, and these pieces are built like tanks. On the other hand, I really like the features and ease of use of their mixers, eq's and gates, but they must be handled with extreme care. They are a hard company to have "brand loyalty" with as some items I wouldn't go to a gig without, and others I install in the studio and hope I never have to move them. |
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Location: closely held secret | I'm with Miles. I'm a consumer, and I could care less if it's a copy. Behringer is great bang for the buck, and if you get a good one it'll likely last forever.
Getting that 'good one' however, may require returning a few first... |
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| The Behringer stuff is designed (copied)in Germany, built in China. They must be pretty close to the critical mass that will let them start bi-amping their PA gear and bringing everything else up to Made In UK/USA/Europe levels. Ignoring them is how UK/USA gear is going to lose out big time. Everybody used to laugh at Jap cars - sometime this year Toyota will overtake GM as the world's biggest carmaker and Toyota are making record profits compared to GM's record losses. The writing is on the wall. |
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Location: NW NJ | Originally posted by cliff:
I'm just trying to comprehend the extent of WHAT's done overseas . . .
Dave, while I understand what you're "saying", my feelings are that the Balladeer is a US-made model, and should remain as such. We already had a Korean Balladeer, didn't we? 6-8 years ago .. 4861 or something like that. Mothership bagged that one - maybe that's why we have the Ultra... |
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Location: NJ | Originally posted by The Wabbit Formerly Known As Waskel:
I'm with Miles. I'm a consumer, and I could care less if it's a copy. Behringer is great bang for the buck, and if you get a good one it'll likely last forever.
Getting that 'good one' however, may require returning a few first... crap is crap
make no mistake about it |
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Location: closely held secret | Thanks for the insight, Al. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | I think you can't paint behringer with too broad of a brush. I've got two of their mixers which are pretty darn good (1604A and 2004A). They're a little noisy, but very solid and do a good job for the buck. On the other extreme are some rack units I have (Virtulizer Pro, Modulizer Pro and Autocom Pro). All three suck DDD. Seriously, I use them as wheel chocks when I jack up the car. Absolute complete waste of money. I would neither praise nor bash behringer as a whole. Just research very well before you invest. Dave |
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Location: NJ | when I was a teenager my best friend's father would always give us this advice "once you stick your hands in sh*t you can never get them clean"
we always laughed at it back then but as the years progressed I understood more and more what he meant.
So my advice is don't put your hands in sh*t you won't get them clean. |
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Location: Australia | I hate Behringer.
By blatantly stealing everyone elses ideas and designs and selling this crap ultra cheap, they're screwing up the market.
The product is cheap,unreliable and not roadworthy. Buy quality once and be done with it. |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | I look forward to buying one of these for $250 on E-baaa.
(I was gonna type that Wednesday, but I decided to let some more informed folks post serious stuff first)
Looks like a nice guitar. But I don't comprehend making the parts in Korea, then sending it here. It is possible that the wood is cheaper over there... Make the top and neck over there, then attach them to the bowl over here. I assume the bowl is still made here. |
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Location: NJ | Originally posted by Mr. Ovation:
I can't address the new pieces, but I have seen the inside of several of their pieces out of curiosity or to install upgrades, and the "copy" stops at the box. . just the fact that they make a mixer that looks like a mackie or pedals that look like the sans amp mxr eh etc etc etc goes to show you that they are out to decieve and confuse the buying public.
Hmmmmm coca cola is 149 but I can buy the white label Kola for 59 cents. is it the same product? no one is a brand name with years behind the product and another is a product that looks like coke and tastes like crap.
if some one registered Ovation fan Klub and used the same bulletin board and layout would that be OK? of course not.
too many choices out there and if you want good gear although there are some bargains out there generally you have to pay the piper |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | Admin cat fight !!! |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Can't argue the principles. I can't afford to own the right compressors, gates and such for thousands of dollars each, well I could, but it's not cost effective for me. So I buy the most bang for buck. Could give a rats patoot where it's made, how it's sold etc etc... as long as it works up to the necessary standards.
That's mainly why I like Ovation's in general. There are absolutely better (opinion) guitars out there. But, are they worth owning? The Ultra's that this thread is about is a prime example of a GREAT value. Some will be turned off by where the parts are made.... not me.
And before anyone thinks otherwise, YES I know Al is just pulling my chain. We are two very different people and it's what makes us work well together I think. If we were on Star Trek, Al would be Kirk, and I'd be Spock. I can see Cliff opening Photoshop now. :) |
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Location: NJ | Originally posted by Tupperware:
Admin cat fight !!! hardly.
Miles and I spent many an 8 hour car ride to ohio. the first 4 hours we solved the world problems the second 4 we argue about gear.
Miles is very practical when it comes to gear. I am into vintage and as high end as I can get. Sometimes we clash.
The berhinger thing is a particular sore point. I have a mental block over the knock off products and Miles can't see why I don't see the good in the products that they developed and designed.
I prefer the glow of tubes and an eclectic mix of stuff. My cables are like a rats nest, I have stuff all over the place and keep searching until I can find it.
Miles has stuff in little bins with labels and all the cables are nicely wrapped color coded and tie wrapped together.
two different styles both effective. One main difference is that I have collected a really cool cache of vintage stuff and KEPT some of it. So I really don't see the need to go with newer stuff although there are advantages.
as for the ultra, I got one for my nephew, without the contour bowl. nice guitar not exactly greatest acoustic sound. but it functions real well and that is important.
I am the guy that will take a vintage fender amp to a gig with a neumann mic while I know others that will not take any of their "good" gear on gigs. I feel that if you have a carpenter come to your house you want him to bring a sharp saw, a tape that measures correctly and a nail gun that shoots nails straight. don't bring your crap tools to work on my house and I won't bring my crap gear to play music for you. |
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Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | Al said: I feel that if you have a carpenter come to your house you want him to bring a sharp saw, a tape that measures correctly and a nail gun that shoots nails straight. Have you found one yet? |
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Location: NJ | Originally posted by Jeff W.:
Al said: I feel that if you have a carpenter come to your house you want him to bring a sharp saw, a tape that measures correctly and a nail gun that shoots nails straight. Have you found one yet? |
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Location: NJ | . . . Al's run out of money. |
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Namm Ultra video