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December 2005
Posts: 117
| Looking at my nut on my ovation 1778t, it seems that string tension has pulled it away from the head a little bit.
On the high side it's fine, it's flush with the head or neck or whatever, but on the bass side it's been pulled up. How should I fix this?
How is the nut held on? |
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October 2006
Posts: 5576
Location: big island | ask tupperware. he had to get his fixed the day after he received and played his U681 12 String. bi-lateral testicular torsion, he called it. had to go to the hospital even. :D |
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December 2005
Posts: 117
| I just popped it off on accident kinda... It's just glued on. Anyway, I guess it was as flush as it's gonna get. So my next problem then:
Now there's a buzz on the e string only, and only if it's open. It doesn't occur if I play any frets at all. So I'm pretty sure it's buzzing against that first fret. Is there a way I can put something between the string and the nut to raise it just a little?
The buzz was there before I popped the nut off, it was the reason I was looking at the nut in the first place. |
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Posts: 10777
Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Poor Street Musician fix-- Piece of matchbook cover...
Next Project: Go get a new Tusq nut.
Next-next Project: Figure-out how to un-glue that nut. |
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December 2005
Posts: 117
| Hmm. I actually literally put two small pieces of matchbook cover underneath the string in the nut. It fixed the buzz.
But now that string seems really high above the frets at higher frets.
Is the string supposed to be about the same distance from the frets the whole way down, or should it be close at the first and far at the twelfth? About how high above the frets should these distances be?
I just had a guitar tech guy at a local shop make me a custom shim for under the saddle, and I'm starting to think maybe the nut was the problem. |
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Posts: 2804
Location: ranson,wva | i cant tell you the measurements because i set all mine up by feel and sound but i can tell you that the strings are closer to the board at the first fret than they are at the 12th.....jason |
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Posts: 225
Location: Stow, Ohio | nonis,
post a picture of your problem.
I think I can offer up a permanent and easy solution |
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Posts: 5576
Location: big island | wow! i'm likin' this new guy, elliot, real well already! saw what you did with the celeb neck, good goin' man. welcome again! |
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Posts: 225
Location: Stow, Ohio | Thanks Lanaki.
I offer up any tips or tricks when I can. |
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Posts: 2804
Location: ranson,wva | id just replace the nut,level the slot,reglue it...jason |
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Posts: 225
Location: Stow, Ohio | Originally posted by nonis:
Hmm. I actually literally put two small pieces of matchbook cover underneath the string in the nut. It fixed the buzz.
But now that string seems really high above the frets at higher frets.
Is the string supposed to be about the same distance from the frets the whole way down, or should it be close at the first and far at the twelfth? About how high above the frets should these distances be?
I just had a guitar tech guy at a local shop make me a custom shim for under the saddle, and I'm starting to think maybe the nut was the problem. You are talking about the action or string height.
This is affected by more than one thing.
1. Fret leveling
2. Neck relief or neck bow
3. Nut height and or the depth that slot where cut for the nut.
4. Saddle height
Let's say the low E string (bass string) in buzzing at the first fret when played open. does it look lower than the other strings? Yes?
if no, does the nut slot look as wide as the string or wider? A wide slot will cause the string to buzz untill fretted. Yes?
Either of the last two can be fixed with liquid super glue and some plastic shavings. I use an old bridge pin for the shavings.
Take a file and make yourself a nice little pile of shavings.
slide a box cutter razor blade (not a utility blade) between the fretboard and the nut. this will keep the side of the nut closest to the fret straight and true.
Using a paper clip or toothpick mix a little bit of the shavings with a drop or two of super glue.
you must use the liquid and not the gel.
mix it up quickly with the toothpick, and apply a small amount in the slot. DO NOT fill the slot completely. just put in enough to fill the slot 1/3 to 1/2 way of the depth. let the mixture set up...usually about 5 minutes. since you didn't fill the slot completely there should still be plenty of slot left for the string. put the string back in the slot and retune....
Is the buzing gone? yes? YAHOOOOOO No? Damn
Next would be the neck relief.
if you have a capo this will be easier if not, just as well.
Fret the low E at the 1st fret with one hand, and fret the low E at the 13th fret with the other. now look at the gap between the fret and string around the 7th fret. is there a big gap or is the string sitting on the fret? if the string is sitting on the fret then you have to much back bend and you have to have a neck adjustment done. if you have a gap that you could slip a thin guitar pick in you should be fine.
other than that I would have to see the guitar to know what is going on.
I hope some of this helps, and sorry in advance if I confused you more. ;) |
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December 2005
Posts: 117
| Both of those two things seem fine.
A few days ago I took my guitar in to a local guitar shop to see about some buzzing around the 7th to 11th frets on the low e string. He showed me that all the frets were unlevel, so I had him level them. That didn't fix the buzz, so he made me a custom shim to go under the saddle raise the low strings a little higher than the high strings, since the high ones were fine. So I brought it home all excited about that, and then I realize that when I play the string really hard open, it buzzes that same buzz.
I'll probably end up just taking it back to him, I was just wondering what you guys thought. Heh, this will be like the fourth time he's had to put new strings on it in a week period for me. |
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April 2007
Posts: 225
Location: Stow, Ohio | Try putting a little shim material under the nut.
loosen the strings enough to get them of of the nut, tap the nut until it comes loose from the neck.
Start with a some aluminum foil strips cut to the size of the nut (bottom) use foil because you'll have more control over the overall thickness of the shim. I think foil is about .002 of an inch thick.
or you can cut up a feeler guage. those will have increments from .001 to .020
Not not to be a smart @zz but are you sure there isn't anything loose inside the guitar? i.e. wire harness against the body? |
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December 2005
Posts: 117
| Yeah, I'm positive. And if it were something rattling due to the frequency, detuning it would cause it not to make that buzz, right? If I tune it down to a d, it does the same thing. |
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Posts: 225
Location: Stow, Ohio | Not always.
Does your guitar have an access panel in the back?
if so just check things out inside.
the only other thing is your action may be to low for your playing style i.e. heavy strummer.
To bad we aren't close in proximity I would be happy to take a look at it for you. |
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Posts: 225
Location: Stow, Ohio | here is a trick I learned along time ago.
it involves a continuity checker.
Take one lead from the continuity checker, and connect it to the problem string between the nut and the tuner. then take the other lead and touch the 1st fret. pluck the open string normaly.
does the light, light up?
if the first fret registers then you'll have to raise the nut a touch, if it doesn't then move on to the next fret. if the next fret registers then the fret is high and will need to be taken down.
do this up the fret board a couple of frets on each strings. becareful not to give yourself false reads. if the string vibration comes in contact with the fret or frets you'll see the light flicker.
now put on a capo and test the first, second, and third frets the same way.
this really only works onthe first couiple of frets |
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December 2005
Posts: 117
| What's a continuity checker?
I tried putting a little piece of cardboard just under the string, between the string and it's place in the nut. This raised it up a little bit, and the buzz is gone. Does that mean that I should get the nut replaced, or just raise the action at the saddle some more, or what? |
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December 2005
Posts: 117
| I took it back to the guy at a local music shop here, and he is going to make me a new bone nut. He was just going to shim it, but he said that the graphite one was hard to get stuff to stick to and it was soft. And he said that the groove for the nut was uneven because of the finish they put on the head. It caused the nut to tilt in toward the fretboard. |
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April 2007
Posts: 225
Location: Stow, Ohio | Originally posted by nonis:
What's a continuity checker?
it is basically a pen shaped light with a pointed tip on one end and a wire with an aligator clip on the other. usually runs on AA batteries.
it will tell you if there is a short in a wire. |
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Posts: 225
Location: Stow, Ohio | I hope this trip is the one that does it. |
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December 2005
Posts: 117
| Oh, I see. So it will tell you if the string is touching the fret? That's clever. I have a Multimeter sitting on this computer desk, that is similar, but does more, right? |
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Posts: 10777
Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | What's a continuity checker?
A multimeter (electronics testing equipment thingie, with two wires, and a dial switch with many choices) set for Ohms. Ohms=resistance. 0 Ohms=continuity.
It would be nice if you had one that beeps...
This is a cheap mutimeter...
And when I say cheap, I got one EXACTLY like this for seven bucks. So don't buy THIS one!
Go to Auto Zone or Home Desperate.
But it is a useful tools for electronics, automotive, and "Why don't this work" around the house. |
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April 2007
Posts: 225
Location: Stow, Ohio | Originally posted by nonis:
Oh, I see. So it will tell you if the string is touching the fret? That's clever. I have a Multimeter sitting on this computer desk, that is similar, but does more, right? Yeah the Multimeter will do the same thing.
There should even be a continuity setting on it. |
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December 2005
Posts: 117
| Cool. Thanks for all your help... I'm hoping that this new nut will do the trick. If not, I'll definitely try out the continuity thing. |
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April 2007
Posts: 225
Location: Stow, Ohio | You're welcome |
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December 2005
Posts: 117
| Well, the new nut did the trick. It sounds amazing, and it looks nice too. He evened out the spot that it sits in, so it's perfectly flush now. The only thing is that it's white and the rest of the 1778t is black. :p If I ever need to replace the saddle I'll have to get a white one too. Can you get just the saddle or do you have to replace the whole pickup thing too? |
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Posts: 2804
Location: ranson,wva | does it have the thinline or the opp saddle/pup in it??
jason |
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December 2005
Posts: 117
| How can you tell? I remember it's like a gold cradle that holds the saddle, and in between the cradle and the saddle there's a metal piece. And the shims go under the cradle. |
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December 2005
Posts: 117
| It's the only ovation I've ever had, so I dont know what others say, but the preamp says op30 if that makes a difference. Although, that is replacable, so it probably wouldn't matter, right? |
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Posts: 10777
Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Comments from a Newbie--
I have only taken apart two of my bridges/saddles...
One of them, the pickup and saddle was one piece (as far as I could tell).
The other, I lift the saddle out, and the pickup is a separate little bar with a wire coming out.
One is a Thin-line, the other is... The Other...
I'm guessing that is an OPP Saddle/Pup. (OPP-- Orleans Parish Prison?)
Well, that didn't help... |
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December 2005
Posts: 117
| Hahaha. Thanks anyway. So if I can lift the saddle out easily then it's replaceable, and if I can't then it's one where you have to replace the whole thing? |
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March 2002
Posts: 15682
Location: SoCal | If nuts were easily repaired, we would have fixed Clifford a long time ago...... |
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Nut repair