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Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Does anyone know when this paractice ended? I know the 4-digit numbered guitars had duplicate numbers stamped in the block but this carry on into the A,B,C-xxx series?. |
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Location: Pacific Northwest Inland Empire | Good question there. My JW shinybowl, ostensibly circa 1968, has the number stamped on the block. |
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| The A,B,C-XXX series ended in 1971, and the last number that I have seen is M-XXX. I purchased a K-1117-4 with serial number M670 in September, 1971, and this was one of the last paper labeled guitars before the new six-digit system with the oval foil labels was introduced. None of the A,B,C-XXX serial numbered guitars had the serial number stamped in the neckblock.
However, between 1968 and 1971, concurrent with the A,B,C-XXX serial numbers on acoustics, (electrics are another story), four and five digit serial numbers appeared. Oddly enough, these XXXX and XXXXX serial numbers apparently were reserved only for the the lowest priced, standard model guitars, especially the K-1111 and 1122. All of the higher priced guitars (K-1114, K-1117, etc.) had the letter plus three digits.
The four and five digit serial numbered guitars continued until late 1971, when the oval foil labels began, and the corresponding serial number was always stamped into the neck block. I currently own a 1971 model 1122 with serial number 10890, which appears on the white rectangular paper label with brown text, as well as being stamped into the neck block.
Cat Stevens owned a 1971 model 1617-4 with serial number 13338, and that number was also stamped on the neckblock. I have seen higher serial numbers with the number stamped on the neckblock. However, to my knowledge the numbering did not exceed much more than 15000 before the numbering system changed to six digit and began at 000001.
Therefore, including the original first generation Bloomfield labels, there should have been somewhere in the neighborhood of 15,000 Ovations manufactured that had the serial number stamped in the neckblock. |
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Location: Germany | I've got three Ovations from the 60s and only the Dlx Balladeer (#2178) has the number stamped on the neck block. Josh White (# B-298) and 1115-4 (# C-412) have not. I think sometimes they did it and sometimes they did it not. I would not assume that there is a common rule.
Karl |
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Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Thanks, guys. This is the info I was looking for.
I have a '67 Balladeer and a '68 Josh White, both iwth four-digit #'s and both stamped on the neck block.
My Glen Campbell Deluxe Balladeer is missing it's label. Frankly, I don't remember ever specifically checking the block on that guitar for a number and I am not going to be home for a while to do so, but if it ever had a serial number, it would probably be an A-XXX.
I think the Storm electrics continued to be stamped under the neck bolt dover right up to the end of their production.
Wayne |
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Location: 6 String Ranch | I seem to recall that the early numbers were stamped and when it had a letter prefix they stopped the practice. |
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Location: Pewaukee, WI | There's an 1111-4 in a local store that's missing any serial number label. It has the oval silver foil label (with the model number), and looks like 6538 stamped in the block. Standard shape bridge, and has the chrome and black tuners (black around the tuner body) with two mounting screws. Any idea on date range? I'm guessing 70 - 72, but that's a wild guess. Oh yeah, textured bowl. |
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Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Randy;
It's probably about a '72 if it has the foil label. See Bob's very informative post above. |
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| If the guitar has the serial number stamped in the neck block, it could not have originally had a oval foil label. Also, this serial number (#6538) places the manufacture date of this guitar around 1970, almost two years before the foil labels were introduced.
When the foil labels began, the stamped serial numbers in the neck block ended, period. In thirty six years of collecting and observing hundreds of early Ovations, I have never seen an exception to this rule.
The explanation for this discrepency, is undoubtedly that the guitar was at the factory for repairs sometime in the 1970's. Perhaps missing the label, the appropiate label of the period was placed on the guitar. This was a very common practice in the 1970's, when there appeared to be few consistent rules of repair at the factory.
The fact that the guitar does not have the small label above the foil label with a six-digit serial number also lends credence to the fact that there probably never was another serial number, other than the one stamped in the neck block.
In all probability, the guitar was produced around 1970, and originally came with the retangular New Hartford paper label. The label probably bore a model number of K-1111, or 1111, with the serial number typed on the label to correspond with the serial number stamped in the neck block. When returned to the factory, the missing or damaged label would have been replaced by the foil label.
It is also my guess, that if the guitar is inspected closely, one will find evidence to an old repair that was done on the guitar, possibly internal brace repairs, or a refin on the top. If it was a factory refin, there will usually be splits or cracks under the finish, and possibly splints or reinforced braces underneath the top. As well, on an old ovation refin, there are generally cracks or separation in the binding under the finish.
In the 1960's and 1970's, there were hundreds of Ovations that were returned to the factory for repairs. For various reasons, many guitars were modified, and therefore, at present they do not conform to the original factory specs, or to the period norms of components. |
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Location: SoCal | I wish that there was some rhythm or reason as to how Ovation did their serial numbers in the first 6 years of production, but it's always been confusing.
By the way Bob, I've got the GCDB here next to me. Still a great guitar, and with a carved bone saddle, the sound is wonderful. |
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Location: Pewaukee, WI | Bob, thanks for the great info/explanation. I'm thinking of grabbing this one, it's got good action, only a few short finish crack behind the bridge, and isn't too expensive.
Does anyone know about the black and chrome tuners (with 2 mounting screws)? When those were used? |
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Location: SoCal | Balladeers thru out the 70's and into the 80's... |
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Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | I just got back home last night. I checked the GCDB and there is no number on the neck block. So, if it ever had a serial number, it would undoubtedly be an A-XXX one.
Wayne |
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| Hi Wayne,
All of the known GCDB's have a A-XXX or B-XXX serial number, with the earliest that I've seen bearing serial number A-167. As stated previously, the upper end models were the first to receive the letter prefix serial numbers, (and the GCDB was at the very top of the line in 1968).
It is possible that your guitar never had a label as early prototypes were not labeled as prototypes; however, I do recall seeing a label on some of Glen's CGDB's that had his initials on the fretboard.
I had the opportunity to talk with Glen a few years ago, and he told me that he still has some of the guitars used on the Goodtime Hour. It would be interesting to know if they all had labels or not. |
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Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Hi Bob;
My guitar did originally have the label, as can be seen in the many videos and pics that are around of this guitar. However, it was obscured by the time I got it by, what I assume, is glue from an after-market preamp that had been installed at one time. I think the pre had been stuck to the inside of the bowl, right over the label.
Sometime later, the pre had been moved to the standard position on the upper inside of the bowl, but the residue remained on the label. I could make out the "Ovation Instruments" and "Patent Applied for" but that was it.
Three years ago I'd sent the guitar back to Ovation to have a new 5-point bridge installed as the original one had exploded. While at the factory, for some reason that has never been explained to me, the label was torn out. There is still some of the paper residue remaining but nothing else.
From all of the (many, many) photos and video of Glen's GCDB's I have collected over the last five years, I am convinced Glen only ever had two initialled GCDB guitars; the one I have and one other that has wider spaced initial inlays with a more squared off font, and an additional marker at the nineteenth fret. Glen still has that guitar.
Here is an old pic of mine with the original bridge and label still intact. I wish I had black-lighted the label to see if tht showed anything...I even have a 70's vintage black light around here somewhere!
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Location: Germany | Wayne,
too sad that the label has disappeared. What brand are the tuners on your GCDB? I always thought that they have golden Grovers until I saw a pic of Paul Moody's guitar which undoubtedly has Schallers on it.
Karl |
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Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | Mine are the gold Ovation/Shallers as in the above pic.
Wayne |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | My GCDB (A-472) does not have any serial number stamped on the neckblock. Paper label is intact and it has the same gold ovation tuners as Moody. Dave |
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Serial #'s Stamped in Neck Block...