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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Discuss 
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Location: Thredbo, NSW, Australia | Stunning!
I take it this is a recent 'leak' of a brand new guitar. I do hope so. |
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Location: SoCal | I believe that this was built in the factory recently...... |
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Location: Canada | Celebrity? |
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Location: Always beautiful canyon country of Utah | I am missing something here for sure!! |
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Location: moline,illinois | beautiful,can anyone blow up the label,it has the looks of a custom elite to me |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Looks like a Custom Elite, and a darn nice one.
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | That sez Custom Elite C2078AX... Made in Korea. 
Edited by Old Man Arthur 2015-08-18 12:32 AM
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Location: Flahdaw | FAIL! |
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Location: Colorado Rocky Mountains | I have always loved the look of an inlaid epi. Added to a figured maple top and the MOP binding, I think it is stunning. The epi appears to be one piece maple with some flame. Not sure this would be the right color combination for me, but I do like the material selection and layout. I have lost track of what models are now available from overseas, so I don't know if this one is new or a prototype. |
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Location: Jet City | arthurseery - 2015-08-17 10:31 PM That sez Custom Elite C2078AX... Made in Korea. The quilt one that's been popping up on facebook is being called a Celebrity Elite Plus. I guess we'll see how the branding all washes out here soon. I would like it even better if it just said "Celebrity Plus" and kept the "Elite" name, well... elite. USA built. Celebrity = center hole Celebrity Plus = multi-hole
Edited by Damon67 2015-08-18 11:16 AM
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Location: Urbana, IL | Wake me up when they leak something US made....  |
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Location: Texas | Looks to be the same piezo they used on Ovations...and to my knowledge they never used on Celebrities. So in essence, it is a high end Asian roundback? I like the figuring in the top and the MOP binding... But I am with Damon...if it is Asian, call it a Celebrity something or another...or come up with a new name. Don’t denigrate the old O line, just to sell non-USA guitars.
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Location: Upper Left USA | Now hold on fellas (and ladies)...
What if they used all of the LX requirements including the bolt on necks but made them offshore?
You would have a damn good guitar that could add enough life to start making some damn FINE guitars in New Hartford. |
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Location: south east Michigan | That's a big if. |
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Location: Jet City | I suppose if I was waiting for a factory to get retooled and restaffed.... AND I had a factory in Korea already toooled at ready do make whatever sorta thing I want, weird or not, I'd get pretty bored of just sitting around waiting.
Looks like Bill's having some fun to me.
These laminate top imports are getting lots of oohs and ahhhs on Facebook and the Ovation site
There's definitely a market |
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Location: south east Michigan | It can't be much of a shock to say that this will be the toughest crowd to be impressed. |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | On Facebook they ooh & aah over a Blue Celebrity deluxe with an OP4BT. huh?
Understand, I have owned a Bunch of Celebrity's...
And I might buy another one if I see a nifty one for cheap.
But I have a bunch of USO's, so I ain't spending $500 on a look-alike.
And I have said this before...
I have gotten made-in-Korea set-up-in-CT Ultras for $400, with a warranty and a case.
AX and TX are just expensive Celebrity's. 
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Location: moline,illinois | damon67 - 2015-08-18 11:14
I would like it even better if it just said "Celebrity Plus" and kept the "Elite" name, well... elite. USA built. Celebrity = center hole Celebrity Plus = multi-hole
+1
Damon says what i've felt all along,quit denigrating the "Elite" name by putting it on overseas models,save it for the new USA guitars and avoid buyer confusion and possible loss of sales by people buying what they think is an "elite" but not being happy because its not what we know an "elite" to be |
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Location: Tennessee | arthurseery - 2015-08-18 4:37 PM On Facebook they ooh & aah over a Blue Celebrity deluxe with an OP4BT. Most people hear the way a guitar sounds with their eyes. This guitar is designed for them. Personally, I'm not one that gets excited with photoflame tops. All show and no go. Kinda like those Korean 1528 Ultra guitars from the 90's. Very cool looking but sound is marginal. And those rosettes are plain fugly in the picture ... I hope they're better looking to the naked eye. To steal Witko's description, they look like inlaid cadaver skin. But I'm sure they'll sell a boatload of those guitars to people who are buying a guitar for all the wrong reasons. The Elite name should be reserved for truly elite guitars. |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | I think DW is simply following the model that has worked so well for them. If the name Ovation appears on the label, it will be a quality instrument regardless of where it is made.
"Design Series - The lowest priced DW drum line, made from North American maple. The only series manufactured in Taiwan (reduced production costs), then shipped to the US for quality control. Shells are available in a limited number of standard sizes. The use of HVLT™ shell-manufacturing technology (Vertical Low Timbre shell with a horizontal outer ply) results in a thick and deep sound."
The Design Series is a great entry level DW, but it's not "inexpensive" or "cheap" compared to any other DW, just the lowest cost. It's a high quality kit that goes through the same QC line as any other DW, just built elsewhere. If you want the equal to "Celebrity" in a DW Drum, you buy the Pacific Drums and Percussion (PDP) Brand which they also own.
This leak may be the first step in what would be equal to their Design series and I'm guessing the price point will be well above any Celebrity model.
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Location: undisclosed | For me the question is "What is under the veneer?" Korea builds well but selling looks instead of sound isn't what I look for in instrument. What made Ovations great were aerospace engineers using testing facilities to research optimal sound. |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Cavalier - 2015-08-18 10:21 PM
For me the question is "What is under the veneer?" Korea builds well but selling looks instead of sound isn't what I look for in instrument. What made Ovations great were aerospace engineers using testing facilities to research optimal sound.
Totally agree.. how it sounds is the ultimate bottom line. By the way, I wonder how many others noticed that DW puts the resonance "timbre" note on each shell. Sound familiar?
I know I come off like a DW fanboy, and maybe I am, but the parallel lines between certain ideas and techniques that DW uses, that are in the same vein that helped make Ovation great products are hard to ignor. |
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Location: Always beautiful canyon country of Utah | Not in vain but in vein?? |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | nerdydave - 2015-08-18 11:27 PM
Not in vain but in vein??
yup... spellcheck at its finest. |
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Location: undisclosed | We'll have to listen before grinding the axes then.... at least they are used to working with fiberglass. I'd have gone for a carbon/kevlar twill on the top myself. I do think eastern shops can rival the US in terms of quality but would like to see the regional differences capitalized on in terms of style and construction. Giving the lines different names makes sense and should be celebrated, both divisions would likely try harder if they were trying to show up the other. |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | I don't know...
They keep "leaking" photos like this, and the ones with Lita Ford, and they are still Korean Crap.
Don't get me wrong, I have owned (and own) a few Asian-made guitars that are nice...
Celebrity's and Ultra's and BC Rich, Parker P-series and Squier Fuckners...
I have Steinbergers, an Epiphone, a Morgan Monroe, a Breedlove and a few Travelers that all proudly say Made in China (or Korea, or Indonesia, or Wherever).
But don't show me Korean-crap and tell me it is something "new".
Or... Don't pee on my face and tell me that it is raining. 
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Location: Texas | Don't pee on my face and tell me that it is raining. OMA...I will forgo querying you about under what situation(s) that might occur. |
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Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota | 2wheeldrummer - 2015-08-18 7:11 PM
damon67 - 2015-08-18 11:14
I would like it even better if it just said "Celebrity Plus" and kept the "Elite" name, well... elite. USA built. Celebrity = center hole Celebrity Plus = multi-hole
+1
Damon says what i've felt all along,quit denigrating the "Elite" name by putting it on overseas models,save it for the new USA guitars and avoid buyer confusion and possible loss of sales by people buying what they think is an "elite" but not being happy because its not what we know an "elite" to be
+1 |
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| old man Arthur.......... Please stop hating. |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Who has shown you Korean crap? Korea currently makes some of the best guitars on the planet and have for many years. It's just fact. While USA companies couldn't get capital to buy state of the art equipment and couldn't afford to pay top dollar for engineers, Korea can. It's not the 1980's anymore my friend. If you are referring to some of the "crap" Celebrity and Ovation guitars that came from Korea... Like any place else those guitars were built to be what they were and shipped to Musicians Friend or where-ever without QC to boot. By the way, when was the last time you bought a NEW guitar anyway?
Or more plainly. If those "Crap" guitars were built in the USA, to the same specs, they'd still be crap guitars... but I guess you'd be happy? Maybe you should actually go to Korea and see what kind of instruments they make there. I did. |
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Location: Texas | "Korea=some of the best guitars on the planet" Not buying it. |
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Location: Steeler Nation, Hudson Valley Contingent | What do you say we all try to look at the whole picture? Without the imports selling to the masses, the USA production is not going to make it. There is no denying that there is a difference in quality, but you have to pay up front for that difference, and MOST guitarists around the world simply cannot do it! If DW is going to make a go of Ovation, they will have to do what the Kamans did: build a range of guitars that compete, each and every one of them, at their price points, and the imports have always compared favorably to their competition. The Celebrity I learned to play on is still in my family after 30+ years and still going strong. Take some comfort from the simple reality that there's a plan at play here folks. DW is probably taking some chances, but they aren't guessing. Import or not, I would bet good money that the guitar in that photo would blow the soundboard off a Taylor 100 or 200 series. And make no mistake, that's who it's going up against. And when the American models come out, they will be taking aim at bigger fish. The imports are critical to getting round back guitars into the hands of new players. If I had not started on my Celeb all those years ago, would I have eventually built the collection of USA Ovations I have now? To be perfectly honest, it's doubtful. I think Bill Xavier comes here for constructive criticism and actually tries to put good ideas to use. But import bashing serves little purpose unless your trying to publish a book about aging knights and windmills. |
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| that's the great part, its our job to make sure if someone cannot afford to buy a new USA Ovation that they can purchase one made in Korea that is leaps and bounds better than that of the competitors. In addition it wont be the cheapest, we don't want to play in the race for the bottom for price with Ovation. Not our Circus, not our Monkeys, leave that to the corporate peeps.. |
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Location: Denmark | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_Quixote :-)
Some of the better Warwicks (not Rockbass series) have been made in Korea. In the 80s MIJ was considered inferior today its considered almost high-end.
Edited by tpa 2015-08-19 2:22 PM
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Location: Urbana, IL | I have nothing against non-US made Ovations. Lord knows I made a living off selling them to folks for quite a few years. If DW can make it well and sell them for an adequate profit they'd be stupid not to do it. I just want the US ones myself. |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | old man Arthur.......... Please stop hating.
"Don't be a Hater"...
That is the catchphrase whenever someone says something that someone doesn't like.
Somehow the speaker is dysfunctional, not the subject in question.
Okay... I understand all that marketing stuff.
I also understand that I own some Excellent Asian-made guitars.
I also know that the Asian Factories will make Exactly what they are contracted to make.
So, if an import Ovation is designed to be a throw-away guitar... that is what they will make.
I bought a 1778TX that sounded great, until I played it next to a USA 1778T.
I also know that you can make affordable stuff in the USA if you want to...
Walmart was originally built on selling only USA-made stuff.
But since return on investment is the motivating factor in everything, jobs will be exported.
This ain't gonna last... People in China and Korea will soon be paid about the same as in the USA.
The difference being the people in China and Korea will have manufacturing jobs... and the USA won't.
And Bill X...
People are not posting best wishes on the OvationGuitars Facebook page because they want Ovation to create nifty guitars in Asia... Lots of nifty guitars are made in Asia nowadays.
They are happy to hear that Ovation will be made in America again.
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | mileskb - 2015-08-19 10:11 AM
By the way, when was the last time you bought a NEW guitar anyway?
Uh... Does "New Old Stock" count? Then the Blue Adamas W597T.
Otherwise, my Chinese Breedlove Pursuit 12.
And my Chinese Morgan Monroe.
And before that, my Chinese Traveler guitar.
Are we seeing a pattern here?
And WHY would I buy a new guitar when there are so many used guitars waiting to be adopted? |
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Location: Flahdaw | amosmoses - 2015-08-19 8:05 AM
Don't pee on my face and tell me that it is raining. OMA...I will forgo querying you about under what situation(s) that might occur.
NOW we're getting into DaveKell tour bus territory |
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Location: Colorado | I for one would love to play it...to feel it - and to hear it...I have played 8K$ (name your brand here) guitars and sometimes said "meh", and sometimes said "wow". I have also played 500 buck (name your brand here) guitars...and said "meh" and "wow". |
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Location: Colorado Rocky Mountains | For what its worth, check out what JD Power and Associates reports about the initial quality of new 2015 automobiles:
"Korean brands led the industry in initial quality by the widest margin ever, averaging 90 problems per 100 (PP100) vehicles, an improvement of 11 PP100 from 2014." While we may want to believe that American made products will always be the best in the world, we're being naive to reality. Nowadays, high quality products can originate from anywhere in the world. If we want to continue to buy American to support our own economy, I get it, but what is American versus what is global is no longer always easy to determine. As I said before, I think this guitar is stunning and I would sure love to play it, even if the color combination would not be my personal choice. I am, however, all about the bling. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | As long as DW continues to call the Asian made models "Ovation" the public will continue to be confused and opinion of Ovation in general will always revert to the lowest common denominator. DW has the oppotunity to take the other fork in the road. The roundback cat only has so many lives so i sure hope they don't blow it. |
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Location: Texas | How in the heck to you extrapolate "Korean brands led the industry in initial quality by the widest margin ever, averaging 90 problems per 100 (PP100) vehicles, an improvement of 11 PP100 from 2014." to "Korea currently makes some of the best guitars on the planet and have for many years. It's just fact" Where does JD Powers rank USA made Ovations in comparison to the guitars made by Kia? |
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Location: Jet City | boltonb - 2015-08-20 5:55 AM ...If we want to continue to buy American to support our own economy, I get it... Ovation is not the only brand of guitar I own, but every guitar under this roof is made here in the USA. It's a conscious decision I made. I also drive a Chevy. (I do have an Applause Uke) If there's an available choice, and I can afford it, I'll buy USA every time, whether it's a guitar on a wall at the local music store or a tomato in the produce isle. 
But my patriotic self aside, maybe we need to wonder why the rest of the world is asking us for US made Ovations... or many other USA made products... yes even the folks in Asia. It's not cuz ours are cheaper. |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | amosmoses - 2015-08-20 7:45 AM How in the heck to you extrapolate "Korean brands led the industry in initial quality by the widest margin ever, averaging 90 problems per 100 (PP100) vehicles, an improvement of 11 PP100 from 2014." to "Korea currently makes some of the best guitars on the planet and have for many years. It's just fact" Where does JD Powers rank USA made Ovations in comparison to the guitars made by Kia? Automobiles vs Guitars... beyond apples and oranges.. With any product, the question is are they building them for themselves or are they building them to spec. In the case of guitars, they are building them to spec. BUT.. interesting enough.. When I was in Korea I visited a market where they were selling "faked" Ovations. Actually they were Celebrities that were hand built with solid tops. At that time the Bowl, Electronics and I think even the Necks were being shipped there. In any case, they had what appeared to be real necks on them too. They were awesome guitars... not what they built for export.. BC Rich guitars are being built so well now that players are buying them new, and then retrofitting the electronics and hardware with top-of-the-line and they are stellar guitars. China makes Studio Projects micrphones. Essentially copies of some of the most classic mics on the planet, and they aren't cheap. However they are hand made to the Original specs and so far it's rare even when the owners of the originals can tell them apart. My point is, you can't blame the country of orgin. |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | damon67 - 2015-08-20 8:14 AM
boltonb - 2015-08-20 5:55 AM ...If we want to continue to buy American to support our own economy, I get it... If there's an available choice, and I can afford it, I'll buy USA every time, whether it's a guitar on a wall at the local music store or a tomato in the produce isle.
I buy Quality, I don't care where it's made. I'm not sure what trades you read... but Buying USA from overseas hasn't been "a thing" for many years. Some exceptions of coarse. Regarding OVations... They want Adamas guitars. I doubt they care where they are made... luckily they are (or will be made) in the USA.
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Location: Jet City | mileskb - 2015-08-20 9:24 AM I'm not sure what trades you read... Quoted from your post on another thread... Reprinted from the Music Trades - August 2015 ...From a marketing standpoint, there was unquestionably a strong global demand for U.S.-made Ovation guitars. Distributors in Europe and Japan were particularly interested in seeing production restored and promised large orders. |
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Location: south east Michigan | Yet StandingOvation's insightful post about market perception and user experience is where the rubber meets the road. |
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Location: New Hartford CT | Here's a link to a PDP by DW wood hoop drum kit I bought recently. It's fantastic, in fact now I'm getting requests to bring this kit to gigs instead of my more expensive USA collectors series lol.
Anyway, take note of the badges on the drums in photos 5 & 6. This is exactly how I'd like to see DW handle this matter of distinguishing off shore vs domestic Ovations...as things move along.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/PDP-Concept-Classic-Wood-Hoop-Tobacco-Satin...
Edited by Geostorm98 2015-08-20 12:02 PM
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | George Frey - 2015-08-20 10:00 AM
take note of the badges on the drums
DW has a stellar way of identifying their drums. It's simple and clear and you can tell the Series (similar to Ovation "Model") from across the room, just by the Logo.
Here are three of the models.. the badges are done in a simlar manner.  
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Location: sitting at my computer | I vote for different headstock logos 
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Location: Flahdaw | Think about this....
China owns most of our debt.
50% of our Federal Spending is entitlements. The majority of those folks on entitlements spend MOST of that money (other than food items) on foreign-made goods, predominantly Asian-made. (often at Walmart, a subsidiary of China ...)
Foreign workers here in the US send a large amount of money home to their families, where they don't spend it on US goods.
The US sends BILLIONS out of our country in the name of foreign aid programs.
Even the wealthy here buy European cars, Italian clothes, French wines, and other imported goods and services.
This country's economy is on the brink of collapse and there is little we are willing to do about it. |
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Location: Hot Springs, S.D. | As OMA said, overseas factories will make whatever they are told to make. Suppose DW told them to make our favorite wood guitars exactly the way they were always made in the USA. They will BE exactly the same as a USA made guitar. I'd have no problem with that. My Morgan Monroe Bean Blossom Gettysburg was made in China and I have had at least two people who owned Martin HD28's (one vintage from the 70's, and one brand new) BEG me to trade with them. Overseas guitars CAN be top quality.
Now, suppose the Legends and Elites are made overseas and they turn out to be great guitars. That leaves the USA factory to start making Adamas' and perhaps something completely new that will blow our minds. I'D be happy. |
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Location: SoCal | This thread is giving me more than a little heartburn. We have had discussions about the problem of overseas guitars branded as Ovation and the effect that it has on the reputation of US Ovations. Dave, Brad, OMA are merely saying what we have observed over the years, yet are being attacked.
I have no problem with DW using the offshore advantages to produce a product for a specific low price point...but I do have a problem with no difference in logo, head stock, and marketing between an offshore and US model.
I have bought a number of new and used US Ovations and Adamas guitars.
Yes, I have an Applause tenor uke as well as the Celeb parlor and soprano uke (limited run with the palm tree cutouts-only as my wife wanted them). I have not bought a new Ovation or Adamas since KMC became a Fender product.
Since 2007, I have bought a number of Takamines - offshore but excellent guitars (playability and quality). The low end Takamine Jasmine is not confused with the quality Takamine line as the Ovation logo on a Celeb is to the US made Ovation.
There is a short term opportunity for DW to reinforce the reputation of a US Ovation and Adamas but only if they specifically define overseas v. US production with at least the logo, head stock, and service.
Give the guitar stores a Celeb logo guitar with good turnover with the entry level market, a warranty, and repair facilities.
Yet, give the US, Asian, and Europe markets a US guitar as of old (quality materials, innovated electronics, warranty, repair staff, and dedicated employees).
Current reputation is not good. As we have discussed on this forum, it will not be easy to rebuild reputation and trust with buyers for guitar stores, artists, and players. Question that, just check out how many artists are currently playing a US Ovation or Adamas on stage. Failure will result in closing the factory down and exclusive overseas production. |
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Location: undisclosed | I had a really fun time recently at Gryphon Strings a high end acoustic Bay area shop. They told me to play everything that looked interesting so I did. Going through the archtops including vintage Gibsons was a eye opener. The 60's Johnny Smith, hand carved with floating pickups, was the quietest one acoustically, the loudest was a $700 Loar. The best neck and playability was on a Ibanez Joe Pass while my favorite blend of everything, playing comfort, volume, tone etc.... turned out to be a 60s Gibson Byrdland.
Moving on to the Nylon strings the real surprise was that Taylor couldn't make a nylon string that had anything resembling volume or tone. The best value was a brand called Kremona made in I think Bulgaria. Even their least expensive model blew away the most expensive Taylor. The best classical there was a hand made Dupont with a large oval sound hole.
My conclusion was a cash strapped archtop player wouldn't be losing much in terms of tone and playability with a Loar and a nylon string player needing value should get a Kremona. I also realized my rebuilt from a wreck and rodded ES125 and rescued from submersion Country Artist still deliver what I need. In short, the results were all over the map in terms of budget, place of manufacture and craftsmanship. Being a starving Artist means looking for the best bang for the buck and subscribing to the one monkey theory of the world population. We all breathe the same air and drink the same water and have the same aptitude for skill sets. Keeping an open mind can let you score the results of a craftsman's good day regardless if they are in Mongolia or Manhattan.
Edited by Cavalier 2015-08-20 4:19 PM
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Location: Tennessee | darkbarguitar - 2015-08-20 10:45 AM Think about this.... China owns most of our debt. Don't fall for the political hysteria and misinformation. China owns less than 7% of the US National debt. Japan actually holds more of our debt than China. |
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Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota | Tony Calman - 2015-08-20 4:14 PM
There is a short term opportunity for DW to reinforce the reputation of a US Ovation and Adamas but only if they specifically define overseas v. US production with at least the logo, head stock, and service.
Give the guitar stores a Celeb logo guitar with good turnover with the entry level market, a warranty, and repair facilities.
Yet, give the US, Asian, and Europe markets a US guitar as of old (quality materials, innovated electronics, warranty, repair staff, and dedicated employees).
Current reputation is not good. As we have discussed on this forum, it will not be easy to rebuild reputation and trust with buyers for guitar stores, artists, and players. Question that, just check out how many artists are currently playing a US Ovation or Adamas on stage. Failure will result in closing the factory down and exclusive overseas production.
I would love to see this too Tony!
Bill X - can you tell us if DW is considering something along these lines at this time, or in the near future?
I have no problem with the overseas manufacturing of lesser expensive pieces - there is definitely a market for them, and if DW doesn't make money, we will lose Ovation again!
But... if we are going to be paying more for the American Made pieces - we want it clearly visible that these *are* the American Made, higher end pieces. Tony makes very valid points.
Damon, I agree with you too - if there were IDENTICAL Ovations side by side, one made over seas, and one made here, the only difference being $100 price difference higher for the USA made one. I would pay the $100 extra for the Made in America, because I know John Budny, and the other Folks there in CT, and they are trying to feed their Families here. I could justify the extra by keeping American workers working.
Edited by Nancy 2015-08-20 7:14 PM
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Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota | naellis58 - 2015-08-20 7:07 PM
Damon, I agree with you too - if there were IDENTICAL Ovations side by side, one made over seas, and one made here, the only difference being $100 price difference higher for the USA made one. I would pay the $100 extra for the Made in America, because I know John Budny, and the other Folks there in CT, and they are trying to feed their Families here. I could justify the extra by keeping American workers working.
My apologies, I did not mean for this to sound so self-righteous, I am just very unhappy at this time with how jobs are being lost to cheaper foreign labor, and that our Government is not taking care of our own people first. I will always respect each individual's right to do, or buy what they feel is best.
Edited by Nancy 2015-08-20 9:29 PM
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | I Like It!
Two of my earliest "Ovation" guitars were Celebrity CC57's.
They both said "Celebrity" on the headstock and they were both Great guitars.
Passive volume and tone knobs, no battery needed.
I also had a psuedo-Elite CC257 (I think) that said "Celebrity" on the headstock.
I have never owned an Applause, but I played a really Nice one at "Trade-Up Music" on NE Alberta.
Lumpy headstock, Aluminum Fretboard... And they wanted more for it than a nearby Celebrity!
But this thing was Pristine with a Barnburst finish, and no paint wear on the fingerboard.
But yeah... They need different labels.
Are y'all listening"
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Location: Tennessee | naellis58 - 2015-08-20 5:07 PM - if there were IDENTICAL Ovations side by side, one made over seas, and one made here, the only difference being $100 price difference higher for the USA made one. I would pay the $100 extra for the Made in America, because I know John Budny, and the other Folks there in CT, and they are trying to feed their Families here. I could justify the extra by keeping American workers working. Yes, absolutely. I wish the price difference was $100. But in reality, the difference is way more than a hundred bucks. Are people willing to dig for $1500? That's what the difference was when Ovation moved the Custom Legend line to Korea vs. the USA model they made. They were supposed to be identical, but they weren't really. |
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Location: Colorado Rocky Mountains | Well, I, too, am solidly in the USA camp. I have never owned an overseas Ovation and the last five or six I've purchased new were all customs or very limited runs from the old factory through Al. The overseas models I have played were at least 20 years old and I was not overly impressed. However, in light of the improvement in quality that many companies have made in their overseas products over the past five years or so (I previously mentioned automobiles but there are other industries as well), I would be willing to at least try an overseas Ovation model with an open mind. However, as long as we (might again) have high-end custom model availability, it is doubtful that I would consider something less. Therefore, I am not the target consumer for entry level Ovations. |
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Location: Suisun City, Ca | stonebobbo - 2015-08-20 2:54 PM darkbarguitar - 2015-08-20 10:45 AM Think about this.... China owns most of our debt. Don't fall for the political hysteria and misinformation. China owns less than 7% of the US National debt. Japan actually holds more of our debt than China. Was getting ready to post this. Most of our debt is to...ourselves |
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Location: Flahdaw | Although I was incorrect, it is hardly "misinformation". Japan just barely eeked out China in the last few months by a few million after China dominated for 6 years. I guess I should have said foreign owners of US debt, cos YES...we own the vast majority of our debt (but I sorta trust us).
The point is that even at 7%, IF China wanted to call in that debt (which probably wouldn't happen), they could collapse our economy. The threat is enough that we allow them to steal our copywrites, hack our government computer systems, sell us tainted goods, spy on us, etc etc etc, with NO repercussions, due to the mere threat that they could hurt us economically.
What this has to do with anything is anyone's guess... |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | As this drifts waaay off topic, I will point out...
What are they gonna do? Come repossess our country?
They make most of their money from exports, and mostly exporting to US.
So it isn't like China is gonna foreclose on us.
You want something to worry about...
China is going over to Africa and gaining control over the resources there.
One more thing... Since EVERY country is in debt, who do we owe that money to... really?
Banks and Wall Street and the World Bank manufacture debt and destroy countries and economies.
Greece was doing just fine and was a very wealthy country until they joined the Euro Zone.
USA was very wealthy until we gave free rein to the speculators and hedge fund thieves.
Y'all realize that the US Government pays interest on the Paper Money that the Fed prints, right?
Edited by Old Man Arthur 2015-08-21 4:31 PM
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Location: sitting at my computer | arthurseery - So it isn't like China is gonna foreclose on us. In this wacky world who knows, sooo just in case... Learn Chinese: Lesson #1 - Saying Hello 
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Location: Jet City | Anyway... Regardless of who's gonna take us over or where a guitar is built, I think the original point was what do you think of this look? I think it looks wrong. It would look better with the traditional style eppies. I also don't know why you would put a restricting laminate on a deep bowl. I understand it more on something you'll only use to plug in, like an SSB. 
Edited by Damon67 2015-08-21 5:02 PM
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Location: Flahdaw | arthurseery - 2015-08-21 5:28 PM
As this drifts waaay off topic, I will point out...
What are they gonna do? Come repossess our country?
They make most of their money from exports, and mostly exporting to US.
So it isn't like China is gonna foreclose on us.
You want something to worry about...
China is going over to Africa and gaining control over the resources there.
One more thing... Since EVERY country is in debt, who do we owe that money to... really?
Banks and Wall Street and the World Bank manufacture debt and destroy countries and economies.
Greece was doing just fine and was a very wealthy country until they joined the Euro Zone.
USA was very wealthy until we gave free rein to the speculators and hedge fund thieves.
Y'all realize that the US Government pays interest on the Paper Money that the Fed prints, right?
You're right. Once sleazy, evil, repugnant people discovered they could make money off ANY endeavor, including the USA's own demise, nothing could stop them. Short term gain won out over morals and ethics... |
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Location: Jet City | maybe it just needs a red blanket |
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Location: Texas | Learn Chinese: Lesson #1 - Saying Hello I always thought it was Herwo Damon, agree. The Epi's certainly look plain, cheaper, less exquisite, than what we are use to. If the soundboard is laminate...it really doesnt matter what it looks like. |
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Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota | damon67 - 2015-08-21 5:07 PM
maybe it just needs a red blanket
Definetly! ANY guitar looks spectacular on that blanket and your fine photography!
I do like the color, even though I am usually not into the bursts. The depth perception and figuring of the wood with that color gradiation is really gorgeous, and you can't go wrong with the abalone surround inlay!
I don't mind the single color eppy's, but I am not certain that the color that was used, was the right one to use with the color of the face. Since we are just talking about the visual appeal vs technical details and playing...
(I still believe that a guitar can be visual Art, and be built with the most advanced technology available for exceptional sound. Which has always been a standard with Ovation/Adamas! A blending of Art and Technology!) |
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Location: Denmark | damon67 - 2015-08-21 5:07 PM
maybe it just needs a red blanket :-) The guitar, yes, I believe the thead itself already has a red blanket or two. Getting back to the photo, I personally like the more traditional exotic wood ornaments around the epaulettes better. Frankly it seems the these ornaments are relatively rough cut. And in my eyes the finish laquer looks kind of thick. I like the "traditionally" sized pickup. According to my taste the epaulette ornaments seem not to be flush with the top.
Edited by tpa 2015-08-21 6:09 PM
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Location: sitting at my computer | damon67 - maybe it just needs a red blanket Been a winning technique so far!  fwiw... Haven't been a fan of lamy tops on acoustics. Like inlaid eppies, but much prefer multi-piece design (at least 3-pieces). They're supposed to resemble dried grape leaves right? Otherwise might as well create a whole different design. imho Loong ago I used to admire the mop and abalone inlaid bindings, they were only used on the upper-tier Os, but nowadays they've become so commonplace on "entry-level" models that, well, in my mind they now have a lower-end guitar connotation. ymmv If that fingerboard and bridge are ebony, I like! |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | damon67 - 2015-08-21 3:01 PM
Anyway... Regardless of who's gonna take us over or where a guitar is built, I think the original point was what do you think of this look?
I actually like this look. Like a couple of others, bursts aren't normally something I like, but something about the depth on the this one as my interest.
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Location: Jet City | I like the burst finish, just not the eppie color with it |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | Nothing says "we're back" like Baby food colored epi's. Nice. Bet it sounds just like it looks. CLICK. |
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Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota | SOBeach - 2015-08-21 6:41 PM
Like inlaid eppies, but much prefer multi-piece design (at least 3-pieces). They're supposed to resemble dried grape leaves right? Otherwise might as well create a whole different design. imho
Like maybe WINGS??????
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | The Wings are kinda Kewel
So is Kaki's gasket thingy.
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Location: undisclosed | For me the figured top is a problem as I can't understand how it helps the tone. The whole look reminds me of the east which is fine but its a bit garish for me. I like the visual appeal of good tonewood, what you see is what you get is very reassuring. As the good wood dries up I'd like to see all synthetic guitars or the carbon/wood laminate approach brought across the line. Bracing could wind up becoming simpler and climate stability would improve. Wood, or miracle fiber W, is great stuff but very individual in nature. A craftsman can use pieces to advantage but machines currently don't. From a manufacturing standpoint a superior sound could happen and you could paint it whatever rocked your boat |
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Location: undisclosed | Funnily enough, if you think about a laminate drum shell the last thin layer is for looks and doesn't affect the tone. Its the sort of thing a drum maker might carry over to guitars but the vibrations there are quite a bit more complex as the pitch is constantly changing . It would be good to know and hear what is under the "skin" on this one. Beauty is only skin deep and the eyes aren't the ears. |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Cavalier - 2015-08-21 9:16 PM
For me the figured top is a problem as I can't understand how it helps the tone.
The whole look reminds me of the east which is fine but its a bit garish for me.
It was made in the East.
I am sure that the Korean Factory people are very Proud of making this.
Triangle fret markers. Abalone bling. Probably Ebony fingerboard and bridge.
But like SOBeach sez, Abalone seems to show-up on lower-end guitars.
I would add that the figured top appears a lot on budget guitars too.
I once had a BEAUTIFUL CS257 way-back-when...
Figured Top, Abalone Trim, Ruby Red Burst, it even had an OP-30.
But if you looked inside the manhole cover you could see that the underside of wood didn't match what appeared on the top... But it was an awesome-looking guitar.
Just to remind us what we are talking about...
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Location: Flahdaw | Might as well go for looks if you are gonna play plugged in with a peizo p/u. I love the figured tops and all the bling, but I play mostly unplugged, so tone really matters to me. Nothing beats a plain old red spruce or Adirondack top, imho. |
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Location: Thredbo, NSW, Australia | darkbarguitar - 2015-08-22 10:43 PM
Might as well go for looks if you are gonna play plugged in with a peizo p/u. I love the figured tops and all the bling, but I play mostly unplugged, so tone really matters to me. Nothing beats a plain old red spruce or Adirondack top, imho.
So how much does the wood used in the top and the bracing underneath influence the sound of a plugged-in Ovation? How much of the natural resonance - if any - does the 'peizo p/u' pick up?
Almost every time I play for an audience, and it is always amplified, I am complimented on the beautiful sound of my Adamas 2081 or my Ute. The compliments come most often, but not always, from musicians in the audience. Without doubt they are beautiful instruments, but does the sound come from the soundboard or the pickup or both?
I might add that there is an increasing number of guitar and preamp/pick up manufacturers that have both peizo and mic inputs combined in their top shelf kits. What are they looking for?
Just wondering. :-) |
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Location: Flahdaw | I don't know for sure about the internal microphones some guitars now have, where you can get a blended sound from both the peizo and mic, but I suspect it doesn't read all THAT much from the top vibrating. The best way for that is good condenser mics placed externally in several places in front of the guitar. NOW you're talking about picking up the quality of a good guitar with a quality top. |
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Location: Texas | Bar is right (maybe) "Might as well go for looks if you are gonna play plugged in with a peizo p/u." disclaimer-as usual, I may be totally wrong here... The piezo pickup really doesnt care about the makeup of its' host. It cares about pressure and vibration more, then comes the pre-amp. Thusly you can get great "Ovation" reproduction out a EA Viper solidbody acoustic. On the steel side, Plug in an adirondack and then plug in veneer using the same pickup and I doubt you can tell the difference. The character of the sound produced is related more to the piezo than the top compositon/bracing etc, imo. On the nylon side, for Ovations...I think the piezo actually improves the acoustic resposne. The EA viper nylon, plugged in, imo, sounds better, than any O nylon acoustically. Yell at your piezo and see what response you get through the amp. Do you think you are getting all the resonance and character your acoustic has to offer? So there may be something to the internal mic/piezo combo that improves on the drawbacks of the piezo. |
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Location: Colorado Rocky Mountains | I think I'd prefer lighter maple binding to match the Epi's rather than the abalone, plus just a bit lighter burst to bring out a little more yellow, then the color scheme might look more integrated and headed in the same direction. Or it might look horrible. I do like exercises like this where we are provided an opportunity to comment on models under consideration, and I do tend to value form as much as function, sometimes even more so. After all, I do ride a Harley. |
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Location: Utah | I can hear differences between different O's and A's plugged in. The body does add to the tone. A laminate with a good sonic quality underlying wood might sound essentially as good plugged in as the same guitar with a solid top. I'd guess the rest of the structure is important too, not just the tone wood.
A figured top like the one in the picture would be highly praised on a solid body electric. |
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Location: undisclosed | I agree that the wood and structure is important. I noticed my Country Artist sounded better than the solid nylon string which had more of a plank sound. Subtle stuff o some levels but the better acoustic/electric should sound good plugged in or acoustic imho. Internal mikes do pick up the acoustic sound but are more prone to feedback too so some trade offs there. Might be a nice high end option but you could add one to any Ovation after market.
A maple cap on a solid body adds high end brightness improving definition giving a crisper tone. I wonder if it would brighten up a cedar core on a acoustic. It will affect how a top vibrates for good or bad. The marketing guys might have asked for something gorgeous without thinking about how the solid top fans would respond.
Edited by Cavalier 2015-08-22 10:23 AM
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Location: Colorado | I still want to play it...Can anyone tell the depth of the bowl? I like the burst...I too want multicolor epis...for this one ...in black, brow, orange and yellow....with lines dividing the colors in the color of the neck inlays |
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| its a mid contour bowl and its just a prototype. |
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Location: New Hartford CT | Thanks for chipping in xraider, appreciate your input. |
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Location: Utah | Mid contour? Interesting. |
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| I appreciate all of you guys, even if you tell me my children are ugly.. |
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Location: Texas | lol...xman, at least you play well with others. I bet anyone on this board, including me, would take that proto and cherish it, if it was tossed in our direction. Thanks for allowing us to participate in the pre-game activities. |
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Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota | amosmoses - 2015-08-24 5:59 PM
lol...xman, at least you play well with others. I bet anyone on this board, including me, would take that proto and cherish it, if it was tossed in our direction. Thanks for allowing us to participate in the pre-game activities.
+1 |
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Location: sitting at my computer | xraiderman - even if you tell me my children are ugly.. "...eye of beholder." As long as they can sing they'll make lots of friends! |
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Location: moline,illinois | xraiderman - 2015-08-24 3:10 PM
its a mid contour bowl and its just a prototype.
Is this a brand new bowl design?
The label says C2078 and i thought the 2 in the begining denoted a deep contour bowl.
Inquiring minds want to know 
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Location: SoCal | Very Nice Looking - Made in Korea huh? |
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Location: undisclosed | At the NW gathering I tried and liked contour bowls. I like the idea of a mid depth contour bowl, sort of like the Artist bowl in size. They work well at higher volumes and still have enough body to play acoustic. The proto isn't ugly by a long stretch, just curious if the go matches the show.
Edited by Cavalier 2015-08-24 11:02 PM
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Modern Saint - 2015-08-24 7:48 PM
Very Nice Looking - Made in Korea huh?
I want my Mercedes made in Germany.
I want my Rolls Royce made in England.
And I want my Ovation made in the USA.
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Location: Colorado | Thanks Bill....let Matt Smith Play it and we will see what she can do! |
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Location: undisclosed | I slept on this one and decided to offer my services if Matt is busy. Since I don't have a origin bias send all prototypes to me for objective evaluation. Return postage is not warratied but if I dont like how they sound I'll work on it until I do and post my findings. You can trust me to be unbiased, I drive old Volvos but once replaced the clutch on a 49 Chevy pickup. |
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| not a problem, just need the name as it appears on the card, expiration date 16 digit number and the three digit security number on the back of your card |
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Location: Texas | Yeah...go ahead and post that info...I want one also. |
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Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota | xraiderman - 2015-08-25 10:36 AM
not a problem, just need the name as it appears on the card, expiration date 16 digit number and the three digit security number on the back of your card
LMAO!!!!!!!! Good One X-Man!!!! |
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Location: undisclosed | xraiderman - 2015-08-25 8:36 AM
not a problem, just need the name as it appears on the card, expiration date 16 digit number and the three digit security number on the back of your card
Whoops, I can see it's time for the department of corrections here. First, there is a error above, the clutch went into a 48 Chevy pickup.
Second, I don't know how they do it but some of the Ovation USA fans have offered to supply your credit card info for any overseas guitar I review because they don't want me burdened with a guitar that might not have comparable value.
Feelings do run strong on this one...... in the interest of objectivity cash should probably stay off the table. |
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| I am a newbie when it comes to Ovation guitars but I have one of those "crap" guitars and I love it. Just because the guitar wasn't Made in America doesn't mean it is not a fine instrument. Life is too short to be hating on where guitars come from.....just my 2 cents. |
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Location: Bristol England | Craigb,
+1 |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Life is too short to be shipping American Jobs overseas for the profit of a minuscule number of rich pigs.
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Location: Hot Springs, S.D. | It was FENDER who shipped jobs overseas. DW is the one hiring back all of our New Hartford friends. If they make some of the guitars overseas that's fine with me because they are ALSO making guitars in the USA. So it'll be like it has been since the eighties when Charlie still owned the company. Guitars at all prices, from entry level to high end and everything in between. |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Craigb,
+2 |
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Location: undisclosed | CanterburyStrings - 2015-08-29 2:01 PM
It was FENDER who shipped jobs overseas. DW is the one hiring back all of our New Hartford friends. If they make some of the guitars overseas that's fine with me because they are ALSO making guitars in the USA. So it'll be like it has been since the eighties when Charlie still owned the company. Guitars at all prices, from entry level to high end and everything in between.
Well said.
I have a Japanese standard Strat ( not Squier) from when they made them in the 1980s, interestingly their value has increased as they were very well made. I also don't like strats enough to contemplate getting a US one...
It is a reprieve that DW is going into the guitar business. I hope the US factory does more than just make the customs as I tend to agree with Arthur's point that profits can be made if the bean counters don't get too greedy.
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | CanterburyStrings - 2015-08-29 2:01 PM
It was FENDER who shipped jobs overseas.
And Zenith. And Phillips. And RCA. And Roland.
And Levi's. And Wrangler (my Mom once made them). And GM. And Ford.
And Apple. And Hewlett Packard. And every other damn company.
The only people that are sending jobs to the USA are the Japanese.
I wasn't picking-on DW... They got what they bought (along with a bunch of percussion stuff).
I also ain't picking-on Asian-made guitars... I have a bunch.
But I have compared side-by-side a T vs. TX... And there are threads dedicated to that subject.
Korean AX Ovations are just re-branded Ultras without the New Hartford touch.
I was also in a GC Acoustic room were a used Celebrity sounded better than the Mexi-Martins.
I have a Chinese Morgan Monroe Blues 32, but the Indonesian-made Blues 32 is Better.
So contrary to what CraigB sez... it Does matter where a guitar is made.
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Location: undisclosed | I agree on Indonesia, I needed a bass for writing so picked up a Soundgear by Ibanez from a frustrated punk rocker who was quitting and was really surprised at the quality. |
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Location: Hot Springs, S.D. | MOST foreign factories will make whatever a company tells them to, at whatever level of quality they are told to make them. It is my hope that DW tells them to make guitars of higher quality than Fender did. We all know that Fender told them to just make them cheap and quality be damned.
I predict that under DW's ownership the AX and TX (if that's what they build and choose to call them) WILL compare with the good stuff made in the USA. And as I said before, the USA factory may be used to build Adamas and some new, never before seen models. They are innovative and they have the tooling and some of the former employees with experience. They may come up with something new that will blow all of our minds.
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| CanterburyStrings - 2015-08-29 5:21 PM
MOST foreign factories will make whatever a company tells them to, at whatever level of quality they are told to make them. It is my hope that DW tells them to make guitars of higher quality than Fender did. We all know that Fender told them to just make them cheap and quality be damned.
I predict that under DW's ownership the AX and TX (if that's what they build and choose to call them) WILL compare with the good stuff made in the USA. And as I said before, the USA factory may be used to build Adamas and some new, never before seen models. They are innovative and they have the tooling and some of the former employees with experience. They may come up with something new that will blow all of our minds.
+1 |
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January 2006
Posts: 1483
Location: Michigan | it is such a touchy subject about being built in america , but interesting enough is that i worked all of my life selling p.p.g. automotive finishes that are made in the u.s.a. and when all of the car bashing came about in the late seventies and the eighties buying a foreign car was a sin and we accepted lower quality higher priced made in the u.s.a. autos for many years stating that we want to keep the jobs here.
i am from detroit and when it comes to autos this state has a huge loyalty to buy american .
well in 2000 i bought my first new foreign car and in 2003 i bought my second one because i have been loyal to the manufacture since 1992. that company was general motors and the two vehicles that i bought were a
2000 chevy monte carlo ( made in canada ) and a
2003 chevy avalanche ( made in mexico ) , but when i told people that i had two foreign cars and told them what they were they said that is o.k. because the money comes back to the company that is based in the u.s.
i would always answer back but what about the parts that were not made here and the labor force that did not build it here or the taxes that we didn't collect from the laborers to go back into our economy.
it is a global economy now a days and thank goodness we still have a choice on where to buy any items that we please from whatever company we please so thank goodness d.w. is opening up here again.
i can buy my foreign o or i can buy my u.s.a. one , i like having choices.. GWB |
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Joined:
January 2015
Posts: 17
| I agree. The standard Elite that I have was not made in the USA, but it has scalloped bracing, solid Koa top, OP-Pro electronics and there isn't a defect in the manufacturing to be found anywhere on the guitar. It sounds great and the only difference I can tell from the USA version is the cost and the USA label.
One day I hope to own a USA made Ovation, but I am very proud of of my standard Elite and don't think there is a finer guitar available for under $400.
To each his own I guess..... |
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