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Posts: 4535
Location: Flahdaw | I have a serious question for all you semi-pro players out there who have playing partners....
For over a year (probably 2 years) i have been posting on Craigslist seeking a duo or trio partnership with like minded (mature) acoustic musicians. I have had just about zero luck, many times NO responses at all. The very occasional responses I do get are not suitable.
I'm not fantastic, but I'm a decent player and singer. My ads post links to some of my videos which I believe showcase my style, and I know they are being clicked on (maybe they don't like my style). I ask for those responding to likewise post links to some of THEIR stuff. Most times I get responses saying they don't have any links or recordings. To me, in this day and age, that seems a little ridiculous. Many of the few who have responded just want to get together and "jam" to see how it goes. Been there, done that. That often is very awkward....different styles or playing ability.
Anyone out there have any better ideas on what I can do, or what I'm doing wrong. How did you guys find YOUR partners? |
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March 2005
Posts: 12755
Location: Boise, Idaho | I've been watching a much smaller Craigslist community for playing partners and have only found a couple. One seemed perfect, but found someone else before I responded and suggested I post a similar request because he got about 8 responses. I have no videos to post and I'm not serious enough to face the hassle of screening responses I might get. Another person and I tried to get together several times last summer, but always had conflicts and eventually gave up.
I found a surprising number of friends who play guitar and enjoy similar music, but we keep saying we'll get together and it never happens. Most are just starting to learn guitar and I'm a little beyond that. Others are very good, so I'd be the one trying to keep up, and they don't really want to make the effort to get together on a regular basis. I haven't found a good match, either. |
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Posts: 2120
Location: Chicago | I heartily sympathise, Mark. I looked for the better part of 2005 on CL, music store bulletins etc. Same result as you. I began to suspect it was my "style" or attitude. I ended up "auditioning" four guys or so. No one really fit. I got very lucky by discovering the OFC in 2006. My first post was aimed at finding a playing partner. I got great responses... from the the UK and Australia (pretty far from Chicago). To my surprise Jeff Burns got back to me. He lives less than 10 miles away and we hit it off famously. It had a lot to do with the Ovation "culture": we both bonded with artists that were strongly committed to Ovation/Adamas at one time or another (McLaughlin, DiMeola, Coryell). We loved the "O" sound and the type of music that had been made on those guitars. That's my story. Part luck, part destiny! I am bummed that there is no OFC player near enough for you to make it work! |
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Posts: 9301
Location: south east Michigan | Brian & I hooked up on the OFC. The first get together was at a music store. Neutral ground. I didn't want to show him my house and vice-a-versa. That was almost 10 years ago now. . I'm extremely lucky to have found someone else with complimentary talents along with the same taste in music and the same goal. I think it's almost lottery type lucky. . And like I told you before Bobby G ... you're a tad modest on you singin' and playin' abilities. Take all the guys that call themselves "players"... let's say 5% play out & get paid. In My Humble Opinion, you out gun about 93% of the total "players". That leaves 2%. From those you have to find some with the same objectives and taste in music willing to put in the time an effort to make something happen. And from that small pool you need weed out the criminals, sci-fi fans and coconut bra fanciers. Like I said... we're talking lottery type luck here. |
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Posts: 4535
Location: Flahdaw | Thanks Brad. I do agree that the pool of people that can play is considerably smaller than the pool of people who THINK they can play, but it is still a good enough size. Part of the issue is that a lot of decent players just want to play solo...they may have done the "partnership route in the past and didn't like it. I'm also looking for a player who can SING, which limits it even further. Still it can't be THAT difficult.
But I have even answered other posts of people looking for partners and haven't received a response. (I may be instantly unlikable on line....kinda like on here!) An OFCer suggested that I not use my "darkbar" email addy 'cos it looked sorta creepy. Good advice, so I stopped that. In any event, it's hard to figure... |
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Posts: 15664
Location: SoCal | DB, you have no idea how much I want to rip your playing ability and give you a bad time. Can't. You're a decent player. Finding people to play with is often just a luck of the draw. I've got two buddies that I play guitar with. One of them is an outstanding guitar/mando/bass player -- beyond most of us. Yet we play together because we are good friends and the tunes are good. I'm not in his league but I'm a fair rhythm player. It works.
But mostly its the dynamic of the personalities, not the guitar abilities (altho' that's a part of it)...... |
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Posts: 12755
Location: Boise, Idaho | I don't know about your Craigslist "Musicians" sites, but ours averages maybe 10 posts a day, with many being ads for musicians that are playing and many with supposed musicians complaining about the lack of a music scene in Boise. The vast majority of ads for people looking for other musicians are kids (under 30) looking to start a death metal band. Usually its the drummer looking for a lead guitar player. I've learned from those ads that there are all kinds of "music" I wasn't familiar with and that advertising for a vocalist doesn't mean they are looking for someone who can sing. People actually post videos of screaming or growling, who want to join other "musicians" to perform that stuff. I don't know if that's popular elsewhere or that's just the sort of people who hang out on the Boise Craigslist. We only have about 300,000 people in this area, so the odds of finding someone who likes to play and sing songs from the 60s and 70s might be a bit low. I've also run into several reasonably successful performers of music that I like, but they also prefer to go solo. It's easier for them because that's what they are used to doing.
The one person I can think of that had the same musical tastes as me was Karl. 4 hours of nonstop playing and singing songs that I knew. But Germany is a long ways. |
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Posts: 6994
Location: Jet City | Both bands I play in I met while doing solo open mic performances. Some of you that have been to my place at the last gathering may have remembered J who plays with me in the cover band, but we also do duet performances. He was playing with another group, doing the same sorts of songs I like, and I was doing stuff he liked. We got together an "jammed" a few times, worked out some guitar parts, he taught me some songs he did, and I taught him some.
Just kinda worked out from there.
CL has been a bust for me in the past. Open mics have gotten me my second guitarist, bass player, drummer, and also introduced me to Chasen Chantz with whom I play 'lead' and 'texture' on his original tunes |
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Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | sent you an email bob |
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Posts: 5881
Location: Colorado Rocky Mountains | Some players can be quite good as soloists, but don't do well in ensembles, and visa-versa. I have worked with players who were very entertaining in a solo audition, displaying what appeared to be rather impressive technique, only to find out later that they could not read music or even charts, had very little knowledge of music and chord theory, and really had a difficult time playing with others. It applies to other instruments as well, including keyboardists. I like to jam as much as the next guy, but there is a big difference between jamming and building a tight performing band ensemble. Every band member has to understand that it is a collaborative effort, and that individual technique cannot be out of synch or inconsistent with the rest of the band. I have my occasional moments in the band where I am asked to take the lead in which event I can ad lib a little and use more personal expression, but for the most part, I am just part of the rhythm section and I have to stick squarely with the ensemble music. Soloists, on the other hand, are generally much more free to do their own thing. |
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Posts: 15664
Location: SoCal | At church I hold down the rhythm spot, playing either 6 or 12 string. We had a guy who played guitar as well but he never found "his spot" in the band. He was good by himself, but couldn't keep time with a group and never quite knew what to contribute.
If I do my job well, most people don't even think about me unless they are focusing on me. I hold things together and the only time I stand out is when I screw up (for which I have a real gift at times). I don't need to be a front guy. I've got my part and enjoy doing it.... |
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Posts: 9301
Location: south east Michigan | Open mics has to be a good way to meet like minded folk.
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I can't see how someone likes playing solo rather than in a pair.
Two guitars to fill things out, vocal harmonies and all.
Playing solo now feels real thin.
Edited by Slipkid 2012-07-30 3:03 PM
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Posts: 13303
Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | vocal harmonies are what gets my gears to turning.
always prefer to hear a pair of singers knocking it out of the park over a solo. |
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Posts: 4535
Location: Flahdaw | Ideally I'd be looking for an acoustic bass and a cajon player, all of whom can sing. My guitar style is a little hard to duo with another guitarist, I suppose. Pickers are harder to deal with than strummers.
But the point is, no one is even RESPONDING! Anyone find that odd? |
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Posts: 12755
Location: Boise, Idaho | Brad Durasa - 2012-07-30 2:01 PM
Playing solo now feels real thin.
Sometimes, Brad, you just leave yourself wide open.
I think it takes real talent to play backup the way a Maury Muliesson played for Jim Croce. There are many other examples of "backup" players that really weren't just strummers or rhythm players. Same with vocals. Many times the easiest part is the melody, when the harmony is what really fills in the song. It just takes a lot of work to make it mesh.
I have no desire to flatter you, Bob, but it might be that people see your videos and think that you won't want them because you're very good by yourself. Maybe you need to do the open mic route. Then the musicians can bash you for taking away their livelihoods, like they do on the Boise Craigslist. |
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Posts: 13987
Location: Upper Left USA | What worked for me after the hiatus that happens between the years that your first kid shows up and the last one leaves... I got involved with the Worship/Band/Church music scenario.
This might not be what everyone was looking for but this last Sunday i got to play two sets with a couple of guys that have some sweet skills and a lot of experience. Two of them are older than me, all three have toured at least locally and our Lead has recording/writing experience in Nashville.
Most of time, and I get to play on average two times a month, I am in a mix of inspiring youngsters (19-30) and a lot of "second-effort" Musicians. Always amazed to see where it goes next. |
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Posts: 13987
Location: Upper Left USA | And yes, playing alone and playing with others is very challenging.
You have to give up some of those "opportunities" and let them fill it in for you. |
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Posts: 8307
Location: Tennessee | You gotta go out and get into the scene. Start playing with other people, even on a pickup or jamming basis. Most of the people of CraigsList are wankers who have zero experience playing anywhere but their bedroom or with their music teacher. Real players are out and about at open mikes or jams ... they don't have time or the inclination to dream about it on some internet forum. Anyone who posts on CraigsList to find someone to play with probably isn't up to the standard of actually being able to play out. At least that's been my experience. |
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Posts: 6994
Location: Jet City | darkbarguitar - 2012-07-30 2:34 PM Ideally I'd be looking for an acoustic bass and a cajon player, all of whom can sing. I still have yet to find a good cajon player. |
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Posts: 8307
Location: Tennessee | I have had the good fortune to sit in with a really great cajon player. It is amazing what a talented person can do with one of them. He used to hang out here around 15K posts ago. |
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Posts: 4535
Location: Flahdaw | stonebobbo - 2012-07-30 6:31 PM
Anyone who posts on CraigsList to find someone to play with probably isn't up to the standard of actually being able to play out. At least that's been my experience.
Damn...that was harsh
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August 2002
Posts: 8307
Location: Tennessee | Didn't mean you. I meant the people that are looking at your ads. That's why you're not getting any response. Either that, or you need to post in an area where the median age isn't 75. 
On the other hand, if the shoe fits ...
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January 2009
Posts: 4535
Location: Flahdaw | Here's a pretty typical CL ad...
http://sarasota.craigslist.org/muc/3172531944.html |
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Posts: 15664
Location: SoCal |
But the point is, no one is even RESPONDING! Anyone find that odd?
Not if they know you.... |
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December 2004
Posts: 2150
Location: Orlando, FL |
Well Bob, maybe you shouldn't ask for photos in your ad... |
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October 2005
Posts: 4044
Location: Utah | Around here the vast majority of musicians are interested in a very different genre than I am. Lots of heavy metal, death metal, and tribute 90's hair bands. Some country. So the available pool is pretty small to begin with. Toss in an age of somewhere over 30 and the pool shrinks even more. Most people seem to be looking for a very serious second income, too. If you're like me and want to play regularly but not make it a job every weekend, the prospects get yet slimmer.
Have you tried other online venues? Bandmix.com is free. |
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March 2005
Posts: 12755
Location: Boise, Idaho | That's worse than most I've seen here. I thought we had all the losers. He must be under 75, because he types on his phone in all caps and can't spell. |
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Looking for playing partners