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Location: Atlanta, GA. | Recently saw an interview with someome (Mary Travers, Joan Baez ???) that said "Mr. Tamborine Man" was about a drug dealer, but couldn't come right out and say it.
As many times that I've listened to the song and read the lyrics, I have a hard time getting that from it. Actually the lyrics really never made much sense to me anyway!
"Puff, the Magic Dragon" is easier to read into.
Any opinions?
Other examples?
signed "Dense in Georgia" |
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Location: south east Michigan | I hate it when songs get spoiled like that.
Like "Along Comes Mary".
A co-worker was always singing "Ricky Don't Loose That Number" around the office until I went and ruined it for him.
Sorry.
I never was able to read anything more into "Puff" than just a song about growing up. I still don't see any alternate meaning. |
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Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | Originally posted by Slipkid:
I still don't see any alternate meaning. I guess Mary came along often and Ricky never lost your numbers.
Sometimes the cognizant reality takes years before the perceptual effects kick in. HUH! ;) |
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Location: closely held secret | "Don't Bogart That Joint". I'm sure it was packed with hidden meaning, I just couldn't figure out what it was. |
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Location: 6 String Ranch | that one lost me too. |
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Location: Munich, Germany | It's even more difficult when it's not your own language.
What did Dylan mean when he sang...
"The ants are my friends - they're blowin' in the wind..."?
And who ever took the load of Anny?
Kurt |
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Location: North Carolina | So what exactly WAS "Rikki Don't Lose That Number" about? |
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Location: Campbell River, British Columbia | Well, it's pretty much about a gay encounter between someone in, and someone out, of the closet.
They may have written a song together too.
I think. |
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Location: Berkeley, CA | And Hendrix "kissed this guy". They're all queer, I'm tellin' ya!
BTW:
this backs up what I heard Mary (I think it was) say "Puff" was about.
knuckles |
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Location: Scotland | Originally posted by fillhixx:
Well, it's pretty much about a gay encounter between someone in, and someone out, of the closet.
They may have written a song together too.
I think. While there maybe "uphill gardening" references in the song, there is a fairly well-documented story that "Rickie Don't lose That Number" was actually inspired by a meeting between Donald Fagen and Rick Derringer. Something like... Fagen wanted to use Derringer on a project, gave him a phone number, and said "Rick, don't lose that number" Could be Bullshit, but I seem to recall a Derringer interview in Guitar Player where he confirmed it. Or I may have imagined that whole thing in some homo-erotic fantasy. |
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Location: Berkeley, CA | For those who haven't seen this site , some of it is pretty funny.
knuckles |
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Location: Scotland | Yeah, it is pretty funny, but I thought this thread was about the use of metaphor in songwriting, rather than poor diction or impared hearing. |
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Location: Berkeley, CA | Or perceived metaphors, such as "The ants are my friends - they're blowin' in the wind" for example.
knuckles |
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Location: Scotland | Exactly. The basic concept of "Metaphor" versus "F**k-wit listeners" seems to be beyond your comprehension |
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Location: Berkeley, CA | Must be. I was sure I saw both in a couple of these replies. |
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Location: south east Michigan | "Rickie Don't lose That Number" was actually inspired by a meeting between Donald Fagen and Rick Derringer. Maybe the idea of the title came from that meeting. I've never heard that explanation before but then again I don't think many have. Yet I think the the song speaks for itself. |
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Location: Sunshine State, Australia | Ouch! |
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Location: Blue Ridge Mountains | Jimmy Buffett's "Why Don't We Get Drunk (and S****)"...now thats a song that has a lot of heavy hidden meaning and inuendo...lol |
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Location: Scotland | Inuendo? I thought Inuendo was an Italian enema |
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Location: Sunshine State, Australia | Originally posted by MusicMishka:
Jimmy Buffett's "Why Don't We Get Drunk (and S****)"...now thats a song that has a lot of heavy hidden meaning and inuendo...lol At least there's no innuendo in the title. He ain't talkin' about hand tools.
And along the same lines, I though innuendo was an Italian suppository .
And getting back to the original topic... (I know, sorry. :( ) the song 'Candy Man' was about drugs, wasn't it? |
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Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands | Wow, you guys have excellent gaydar. I thought it was song about a guy telling a girl, basically, call me if you want me. Homo-erotic? Damn I'm out of it.
And Puff ... could be a song for kids ... could be about drugs, depends on the listener. |
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Location: Blue Ridge Mountains | Paul, I think you are right about that...seems I remember something about that a while back...lol
and muzza, it was... |
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Location: Blue Ridge Mountains | From Wikipedia:
The lyrics for "Puff, the Magic Dragon" were based on a 1959 poem by Leonard Lipton, a nineteen-year-old Cornell student. Lipton was inspired by an Ogden Nash poem titled "Custard the Dragon," about a "Really-O, Truly-O, little pet dragon." Lipton passed his poem on to friend and fellow Cornell student Peter Yarrow, who created music and more lyrics to make the poem into the song. In 1961, Yarrow joined Paul Stookey and Mary Travers to form Peter, Paul and Mary. The group incorporated the song into their live performances before recording it in 1962.
The lyrics tell a story of the ageless dragon Puff and his playmate Jackie Paper, a little boy who grows up and loses interest in the imaginary adventures of childhood and leaves Puff alone and depressed. The story of the song takes place "by the sea" in the fantasy land of Honah Lee. |
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Location: Campbell River, British Columbia | SURE. That's what they say NOW..... :rolleyes:
and Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds is a picture Julian drew.....after John told him what LSD spelled. |
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Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | Originally posted by Paul Templeman:
Yeah, it is pretty funny, but I thought this thread was about the use of metaphor in songwriting, rather than poor diction or impared hearing. Originally posted by Paul Templeman:
Exactly. The basic concept of "Metaphor" versus "F**k-wit listeners" seems to be beyond your comprehension Originally posted by Paul Templeman:
Inuendo? I thought Inuendo was an Italian enema :D
I think Paul is warming up for his visit to the island in a few days! |
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Location: CA | You can make any song or story fit just about kind of double-entendre or innuendo you want. JRR Tolkien swore he wrote the Hobbit as a story for his kids, but there's been more dissection of the 'real meanings' of the Lord of the Rings series than any other published work except perhaps the bible. And since we're on the subject, look at all the hidden meanings people get out of THAT.
This aint rocket science. Enjoy the songs for what they are. Do I care if Tambourine Man is about drugs? No. Do I sing it using deep, suggestive stares, winks or nudges? No. I sing it because it's a pretty song about a guy with a tambourine and my kids like it. And Puff the Magic Dragon. I've played that song for my children and their friends 47,000,000 times (at least) and they loved it. To me, it never was and never will be about drugs. It's a lovely song about being young and dreaming and then growing up. |
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Location: south east Michigan | Well said Oddball... well said.
I'm a huge Tolkien buff and have read many books about the books. I have the unabridged audio book (55 hours long) that I listen to probably once a year. Up to now I have not read about any deep, dark, alternate meanings to the saga. In fact at this point I don't really care to know. And unless I'm horribly off base in the first place, I don't care to hear about crazy, "secret" meanings about the songs I like either. In fact there a number of songs that I have taken the time to learn to play although I don't have a clue as to the writers insprition or intended meaning.
BTW /FYI... Did you know that well into the process Frodo's name was instead, "Bingo"? And that Treebeard started out as a bad guy and the Strider character started out as a hobbit named "Trotter"? |
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Location: south east Michigan | Originally posted by muzza:
Ouch! Did I come off as short & bitchy? I didn't mean to.
Maybe I should have used one of these... ;) :p :D |
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Location: North Carolina | Originally posted by Paul Templeman:
Yeah, it is pretty funny, but I thought this thread was about the use of metaphor OK, so what exactly IS a meta for? |
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Location: Sunshine State, Australia | No, Brad,sorry.. 3 of us were typing at the same time. It was a response to Temp's post.
Should have used the quote button. I'm not used to posting when you lot are awake. |
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Location: Whitecourt, Ab | ZZ Top's "Pearl Necklace" always gives me a chuckle when I hear it. I remember back in the day, dancing to this song, and girls singing along with the band... |
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Location: Campbell River, British Columbia | Originally posted by Slipkid:
"secret" meanings about the songs 'A man's reach should exceed his grasp or what's a metaphor?
Metaphor, analogy, ironic observance and the like are all ways we can come to know the world and its ideas better. Unfortunately most of the world is metaphorically challenged at this point in our collective history. |
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Location: Berkeley, CA | Originally posted by fillhixx:
Originally posted by Slipkid:
"secret" meanings about the songs 'A man's reach should exceed his grasp or what's a metaphor?
(see "sour grapes")
knuckles |
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Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | It's all just MetaFornication, if ya ax me. |
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Location: Berkeley, CA | The "grapes", of the Aesop's tale The Fox and the Grapes, are a metaphor, right? :confused: For a goal not acheived???
My confidence is so shaken I can hardly think. :rolleyes:
knuckles |
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Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | Yes, "Sour Grapes" is a metaphor....
... and "shaken confidence" is actually a Dead Metaphor |
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Location: south east Michigan | A graspable metaphor is always welcome.
An un-graspable concoction of silly lyrics can be okay too, if the hook is good.
But nonsensicle, obtuse words that are intended to convey a story or some meaningful life lesson?
No thanks. |
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Location: Michigan | Read between the lines for gosh sakes
""THEY REALLY ATE TIMOTHY ""GWB |
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Location: Atlanta, GA. | That's what happens to guys that keep saying "BITE ME"!!! :eek: |
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Location: Berkeley, CA | This thread has gone to the dogs. We need to put it to bed.
We'll probably hear from on high before long. Anybody beg to differ?
I'll stop now,
knuckles |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | Originally posted by knuckles:
This thread has gone to the dogs. We need to put it to bed. NO WAY. Page 2. We're just getting warmed up. The best replies to this thread are at least another 3-4 pages in. Give it time.
Dave |
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Location: Berkeley, CA | Oh man! You put the axe to all my metaphors! |
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Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | Originally posted by Jeff W.:
It's all just MetaFornication, if ya ax me. It's why nobody ever ax you. |
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Location: Michigan | OUR BELLIES AS FULL AS THEY COULD BE AND NOBODY EVER GOT AROUND TO FINDING ........TIMOTHY.
Oh boy I agree with Dave this one is just getting started.GWB |
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Laying it "Between the lines"