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Location: Brighty in Blighty | Hi,
just thought I'd share this post from Adrian Legg from the Acoustic Magazine forum...
Long term, if you use it as a fundamental part of your technique, there is a strong possibility that it can cause a repetitive strain injury - which is why it's not acceptable these days in classical. It works a lot better -long term- if you can anchor from where your arm rests naturally on the guitar, just dropping your palm if you need damping. If you take a look at how much tension locating/resting with your pinky introduces to your right hand, the injury possibility becomes clearer. I've been lightly resting my pinky for years as it really helped with stability but having just read that (and freaked out about getting RSI) I've just tried NOT resting the pinky. Obviously my technique has improved since I started as it feels pretty good without resting it so I'll be unlearning this potentially damaging technique from now on! Also it frees up another finger - woo-hoo! |
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Location: South of most, North of few | I never could get the hang of resting the pinky on the top while fingerpicking. Of course, as I've stated many times before, I only dabble in this guitar thing. |
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Location: Vernon CT | I was told 4-5 years ago it wasn't good, so I have stopped doing it. |
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Location: Brighty in Blighty | I reckon it'll take a little while to fully adjust, but it'll be a worth while investment methimks |
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Location: Michigan | When I took lessons some 20+ years ago (man am I old) my instructor who was teaching me the travis picking method insisted that I NOT rest my pinky. Bad form he said. He did not mention injury but I think he did talk about proper classical technique. I alway notice a player resting his/her pinky. Just one of those things that stick in my mind. As Dweezil said it frees up not only your pinky but you whole hand if you want to improvise or change the rhythm, you can almost adapt a strumming motion while picking. I don't know if this is possible whilst achoring the pinky as I have never tried since then.
I just wish I could get used to using a pick. I need to learn some techinque there I suppose :) |
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Location: Yucaipa, California | ...nearly ALL of the better banjo players "plant" at least the "pinky" while playing (sometimes pinky/ring):
.....but, then again, they are banjo players. :rolleyes: |
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| I only started trying to play fingerstyle a couple years ago. It just didn't feel right to plant my pinkie. |
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Location: Florida Central Gulf Coast | Originally posted by twistedlim:
I just wish I could get used to using a pick. I quit trying until someone can give some hints my fingers can heed. |
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Location: GA USA | Iffy, get TRboy to show you his hybrid pick/fingerstyle technique.
I have only been attempting fingerstyle for a short while now. What technique I have I learned from workshoplive.com and none of their instructors ever mentioned planting the pinky. |
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Location: big island | my pinky has been a pick guard potato for years.
i usually only lift it when i am doing a percussive downstroke stroke in conjunction with my ring finger. |
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Location: Vernon CT | O.T. here.
Iffy, I just noticed your sig line. Thanks!! |
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Location: SoCal | Chet Atkins always rested his pinky on the top or p/g of his guitar unless he needed it to pluck a string. Didn't seem to hurt him...... |
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Location: Brighty in Blighty | He's dead now right? |
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Location: Boise, Idaho | If banjo players do it, it must be wrong. In one of the few lesson books I read, it said not to, so I haven't for 30 years or so. I also use all 5 fingers on a couple songs. Try some exercises where you hit the thumb, roll through 4 fingers and back a few times. Then do the thumb and pluck 4 at the same time then back to the thumb. Those will get you using your pinky for something other than a place holder. |
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Location: Florida Central Gulf Coast | Originally posted by dweezil:
He's dead now right? Yes and will remain so for the time being; but not due to his pinky... :rolleyes: |
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Location: Brighty in Blighty | Can you be sure? |
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Location: Upper Left USA | This newsfash is just in....
General Valicio Franko... is still dead.
Update at 11:00!
Doc Watson and I both plant the pinky. He's blind and I don't listen but like, whatever. |
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Location: Brighty in Blighty | :) |
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Location: SoCal | Originally posted by 2ifbyC:
Originally posted by dweezil:
He's dead now right? Yes and will remain so for the time being; but not due to his pinky... :rolleyes: |
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Location: Campbell River, British Columbia | Attention banjo players: five strings, five fingers.
Coincidence? I think not. |
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Location: Orlando, FL | Planting the pinkie is one of those "bad" habits I've had for decades. I've tried to unlearn it several times with no luck. I asked Matt Smith last year at Amelia if this was bad technique and he said not to worry about it. |
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Location: Chicago | I rely on the 'pinky anchor' while flatpicking, but I have learned to hybrid fingerstyle without resting (pick=thumb plus the other three). My only gripe is that the extra finger, in my case, generates some noise on the guitar top! Especially with an Adamas (I've installed a clear plastic pickguard to help). |
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Location: Brighty in Blighty | Although I won't/don't play enough for it to cause me a problem I do think that it might be better not to rest it. That's not to say it's bad or wrong, I just think FOR ME AT LEAST it is something worth tackling as it MAY help in the future. |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Originally posted by dobro:
My only gripe is that the extra finger, in my case, generates some noise on the guitar top! Especially with an Adamas (I've installed a clear plastic pickguard to help). It'll make noise on a textured T top also...
Generally I just lay my forearm on the body edge, and that is where my hand goes...
(Unfortunately that technique puts my hand around the 24th fret on a Viper, but I still do it.) |
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Location: Hot Springs, S.D. | On some songs I only use two fingers and the thumb. I usually rest my ring finger on those songs. On some songs I use three fingers and thumb. Sometimes I rest my pinkie, sometimes I don't. On some songs I use four fingers and the thumb. Nothing rests. I never use a pick, but when I play rythum guitar for the bluegrass stuff I play, both my ring finger and pinkie rest on the pickguard while my thumbnail does the work. But they are not so much planted there as lightly touching. |
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Location: Orlando, FL | All in all, I think it's "better form" to not anchor your pinkie. It also allows a better range of movement, and an extra finger! I have also wondered if it lessens the vibration of the top and has an effect on sound.
I think breaking bad playing habits is a good idea, but this is just one of those habits I haven't been able to break. Not enough patience probably! When Matt Smith said not to worry, I figured to hell with it, it's just the way I play.
If I played as much as Adrian Legg, I would be very concerned with the possibility of repetitive strain injuries! |
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| I've been resting my pinky on the top since 1963. I'm not about to change anything now. |
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Location: big island | most often, with my fingerstyle in slack key, i rest or plant both my ring and pinky digits. when i strum, my ring and pinky digits usually brush the pick guard. my pick guard scratches are primarily caused by my fingernails while strumming rather than from the pick.
this may be in poor form but it certainly allows for much less tension in the right hand. attempting to curl those fingers up has made me far too conscious of the effort and less fluid/relaxed when i play. when i am playing a jazz oriented fingerstyle, i will use the ring and pinky fingers for upstrokes on the treble strings. |
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Location: Steeler Nation, Hudson Valley Contingent | I got a statement from a choir member once when I was teaching a new piece that went roughly:
"Will you please make up your mind whether or not to plant your pinky!" (It was friendly ribbing, not a serious complaint.)
Whether I'm flat-picking or finger-picking, the pinky rests on the soundboard, but routinely jumps up and joins in if things get a little complicated. I had never really noticed until he said something to me about it.
Then I read that it was "improper technique" somewhere and became a little self-conscious about it until I matured enough to realize I had been playing fine for almost 20 years, so why sweat it. The final word for me came from a video of Tommy Emmanuel linked from this site.
In it, he was giving a workshop and specifically stated that he often let's his pinky rest if it feels right to him. If TE can do it, then so can I. If TE can play it, then...um...I plead the fifth. :rolleyes: |
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Location: CA | Always nice to continually improve whatever endeavors you enjoy. But this is one of those things that you can easily overthink. A quick survey over on Youtube revealed the following:
Guys who don't rest pinkies:
Jerry Reed
Leo Kottke
James Burton
Guys who DO rest pinkies besides Chet:
Gordon Lightfoot
Red Shea (Lightfoots lead guitarist)
John Fahey
John Prine
Roy Clark (on both banjo and guitar)
Lindsay Buckingham
Mark Knopfler (actually rests his third finger)
David Gilmour (he doesn't really finger pick, but rests his pinkie during some acoustic solos)
Paul Simon (playing an Ovation in this vid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUkL5YQJfEo)
Willie Nelson (he rests it right above the hole worn through his guitar top)
Last time I checked, all these guys were still alive except Jerry.
FWIW, Walter Cronkite still types using only his two index fingers. |
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Location: CA | Oops, sorry, Red Shea also passed away last year. |
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Location: Indiana | Originally posted by Oddball:
Willie Nelson (he rests it right above the hole worn through his guitar top)
Willie had to have surgery a couple of years back for carpal tunnel. Don't know if it was related though. |
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Location: Brighty in Blighty | I fully appreciate it's a personal preference and like most things there are some that do and some that don't. There is no right or wrong. I just found it very interesting that someone as knowledgeable and skilled as Adrian Legg actually said what he said, surely he must be speaking with some real experience.
The question is do I relearn my technique or continue in the knowledge that I might be in danger of developing RSI albeit unlikely. Even if there's 1% chance that's enough for me! |
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Location: Cork, Ireland | It's a bit like wrapping your thumb around the neck as discussed here.
http://www.ovationfanclub.com/cgi-bin/ubb/non-cgi/ultimatebb.php?ub...
It's 'bad technique' but many players do it. I bet Segovia doesn't though |
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Location: UK | I guess my pinky is just too short - If I rest my pinky I can just about pick with my knuckles |
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Location: Orlando, FL | Originally posted by dweezil:
The question is do I relearn my technique or continue in the knowledge that I might be in danger of developing RSI albeit unlikely. Even if there's 1% chance that's enough for me! I think improving technique and unlearning bad habits is always a good idea. If it reduces the possibility of injury, even better. Go for it!
I'm too lazy...
:D |
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Location: 6 String Ranch | they told me not to do it, so I do it. |
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Location: SoCal | Originally posted by Beal:
they told me not to do it, so I do it. Yeah, but you just like to f*#% w/ authority..... |
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Location: Tennessee | Originally posted by Jonmark Stone:
Willie had to have surgery a couple of years back for carpal tunnel. Don't know if it was related though. I believe his was diagnosed as a repetitive rolling injury.
This intrigued me so I checked on myself. Sometimes I do, mostly I don't. Never when I strum, always when I'm picking something tricky for me (but it's the side of my pinky, not the fingertip, and if I'm on the higher strings then I rest my ring finger on the pinky), and almost never when I fingerpick, but depending on where are what I'm playing, sometimes I do. So no matter where you stand, it seems I am breaking all the rules. Go figure. :cool: |
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Location: Campbell River, British Columbia | Carpal Tunnel syndrome requires a lot of repetitive motion to produce ill effect. If you're playing enough that where you place your pinky finger is causing you trouble, the rest of us are in awe! |
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Location: CA | +2 on what Old Man Arthur said — it is distinctly 'noisier' when you rest a pinkie on an Elite T 'nonskid' top. It's actually cause me to (however briefly) try to fingerpick without pinkie resting. Couldn't do it. Now I just keep the pinkie fingernail trimmed down. Still hear it though. Weird. I never 'heard' the pinkie on any gloss tops. |
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Location: Brighty in Blighty | Originally posted by fillhixx:
Carpal Tunnel syndrome requires a lot of repetitive motion to produce ill effect. I'm certain the Institute of Neurological Disorders would love to hear about your research and how you came to that conclusion.
What are the causes of carpal tunnel syndrome?
Carpal tunnel syndrome is often the result of a combination of factors that increase pressure on the median nerve and tendons in the carpal tunnel, rather than a problem with the nerve itself. Most likely the disorder is due to a congenital predisposition - the carpal tunnel is simply smaller in some people than in others. Other contributing factors include trauma or injury to the wrist that cause swelling, such as sprain or fracture; overactivity of the pituitary gland; hypothyroidism; rheumatoid arthritis; mechanical problems in the wrist joint; work stress; repeated use of vibrating hand tools; fluid retention during pregnancy or menopause; or the development of a cyst or tumor in the canal. In some cases no cause can be identified.
There is little clinical data to prove whether repetitive and forceful movements of the hand and wrist during work or leisure activities can cause carpal tunnel syndrome . Repeated motions performed in the course of normal work or other daily activities can result in repetitive motion disorders such as bursitis and tendonitis. Writer's cramp - a condition in which a lack of fine motor skill coordination and ache and pressure in the fingers, wrist, or forearm is brought on by repetitive activity - is not a symptom of carpal tunnel syndrome.
Get the facts here |
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Location: Sydney, Australia | Must be what you get used to. I find it difficult how you could use three fingers (& a thumb) to pick if the fourth is resting on the face. My classical guitar book warned that you need to keep all fingers relaxed. A sign of tension was this little finger rising up (further away from the face) when it is supposed to follow the finger next to it, just slightly curled under. I don't know what it does when I'm not looking, but if I watch my fingers I can see it tense.
When I'm using a pick trying to play leads, I often rest my little finger on the face then, or even hook it around the high E string if I'm not going to be playing that string. |
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Location: Fitzwilliam, New Hampshire | I'm joining in on this topic late but I've started finger picking late in life and its something I work at part time. As far as resting the pinky, it depends. I can see the value for freeing up all the digits for various pickin techniques. Since I switch between electric to acoustic guitars, I don't play one often enough to be totally tuned in to one arm position. I rest the pinky quite often. Hey, if Chet did it all these years, I don't think there is anything wrong with it. No different IMHO than using the thumb for grabbing the low E when trying to catch a bass note on the neck in a given chord situation. This is a great topic. I don't get on this forum too often but finger pickin is something I enjoy. :)
Gary
Ovations:
1986 Shallow bowl Collectors edition
1984 Classical - 1663/4 series Natural/stereo
others:
1952 Tele Re-issue
Homebuilt Custom Strat w/tele neck
Guild J30 Jumbo
Martin BacPacker |
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Posts: 4394
Location: East Tennessee | Originally posted by Tim Chapman:
...nearly ALL of the better banjo players "plant" at least the "pinky" while playing (sometimes pinky/ring):
.....but, then again, they are banjo players. :rolleyes:
For the record, I don't rest my pinky. |
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April 2008
Posts: 2336
Location: Brighty in Blighty | Well having tried without resting the pinkie this last week I can say this...
Was weird and uncomfortable at first and thought f*** this. But I persisted. Now when I rest the pinkie it feels VERY restrictive and uncomfortable. I have a much greater expressive range when not resting! So there you are. |
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Fingerstyle : Resting the pinky!