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Location: Chicago | We've all been there: A musician who claims to KNOW Ovations, the legacy, and "O" sound (maybe even owned or played one) and NOW is critical or rejected the whole notion.
We here sincerely love the sound and are baffled. We CHOOSE to play, gig and record with our Ovations and Adamases.....
So, what IS the problem? What are the specific accusations? You honor?
1) My local luthier just snarls about "plastic": does not want to be more specific.... |
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Posts: 3408
Location: GA USA | That is a very common mistake people make. By "that" I mean leaving the "r" off of the word "your".
The plastic thing too.
:) |
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Location: Brighty in Blighty | And let's not be confused with "you're" either, as in "you are".
Let the naysayers say nay. Get on with your (note spelling) life!
;) |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | And I say again...
There is just an indescribable satisfaction about owning a guitar that everybody Hates!  |
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Posts: 2120
Location: Chicago | Indeed. There's also "yore" as in "days of ..."
OK but WHY is this even possible in jest: "A guitar that everybody HATES" ??
I'm still waiting for the testimony YOUR Honor! |
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Posts: 10777
Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Cuz I just love the folks that say, "Why'd you buy that Plastic guitar?"
Then later say, "Y'know? You can leave that Ovation at my house for awhile..." |
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Posts: 2336
Location: Brighty in Blighty | Not everyone hates them. Not everyone likes Zappa. That I don't get. Some don't like vanilla ice cream, some do.
Let them have their opinion however misaligned it might be with you. The other option of course is invade! |
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Posts: 2711
Location: Vernon CT | Hey, the way I see it, let them hate!! It only means more great guitars out there for the ones who know better at rediculously low prices. And like OMA said, they ALWAYS comment on how great the sound when one of us play one!
There's a 1767 about 6 mile from where I live on C.L. I'm "working" on. Price is a bit high for todays economy ,but, I'm talking to her, waiting for info back and will probably stop over and check it out. |
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| Reminds me of a story...(anyone offended by mildly crude language please stop reading):
An Army Ranger, an Air Force Delta, a Navy SEAL, and a regular Marine were on a training mission. Sitting by the campfire at night the Ranger, Delta and SEAL each told a story in turn about their adventures, each one trying to one-up the previous story with outrageous accounts of their abilities. When it came time for the Marine he said nothing; he just smiled and kept stirring the coals with his, shall we say, "male member."
The moral: when you got IT, you don't have to brag. I thoroughly enjoy shutting up the nay-sayers and critics when they hear one of my "plastic" guitars. |
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Posts: 639
Location: NW of Philadelphia | Everyone is entitled to their opinions and they are allowed to be wrong too.
Opinions are like a-holes, everyone has one and some are bigger than others.
The question is: How big is yours? :D |
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Posts: 4996
Location: Phoenix AZ | I could give an aeronautical intercourse why someone might hate the guitar I play. In the world of personal opinions there is no logic and no right answer, just good fodder for internet chat forums. |
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Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | is that anything like an an airborne coitus? |
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Posts: 3408
Location: GA USA | Here's my situation at church: I rotate in the band with two college guys. One always plays a beautiful Les Paul, the other switches between his SG and an inexpensive Tak 12 string. Last Sunday was the "triumphal entry" for the 1868.
We also have two older guys that play guitars. One plays a Taylor "Johnny Cash" style and the other plays country type music on one of his very nice Martins.
After the service, the SG guy and the Taylor guy were all over me about how great the Elite sounded. My son, who has a Taylor, says it's his favorite I've had, and loves to play it.
The moral here is similar to Serge's. The quality of the sound that guitar puts out can't be ignored. I honestly can't wait until SSJ3 so you guys can see it. |
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Posts: 4996
Location: Phoenix AZ | I should also add that Ovation is an "easy target" for people to bash because it IS different. It's more difficult for, lets say a Taylor fan to bash a Martin. They have basically the same materials, same construction. But Ovation has a big "KICK ME" sign hanging on it because of the obvious physical differences. But in the end, like I said, who really cares. |
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Posts: 2120
Location: Chicago | I'm looking at it more "clinically":
No one buys and plays a brand to do someone a favor. So...
Rejection of Ovation must be have to do with one of these:
1) Looks
2) Sound
3) "Feel"
4) Trend
which seems to dominate? |
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March 2009
Posts: 715
| Dobro, I've been observing a post on "the other guitar forum" with regard to Ovation guitars. One poster even went so far as to call them "fake guitars", which must be news to Glen Campbell and Al DiMeola, etc.!
What I don't get is the adoration of Composite Acoustics and Rainsongs while bashing Ovations. I'm not saying that those are bad guitars, but maybe Ovations get bashed because they are part wood?
Anyway, sometimes I think that the "wood box" only people need to be taken out to the woodshed! Just kidding.
Michelle |
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Posts: 715
| Of course, there are also "wood boxers" that bash laminate guitars too, which is why I can empathize with Ovation owners having to defend their choice of guitar.
Michelle |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Rainsongs and CA are 'square-ish'...
So they have the same annoying corners as wood-boxes, so I guess they're still cool. |
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Posts: 972
Location: PDX | I'm with Dave -- who cares?
It's such a hashed and rehashed topic, it's just not worth the breath.
_____
gh1 |
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Posts: 1119
Location: Michigan | My bro in law stopped by the other night and was strumming around with my legend. He has a Yari. He was amazed at the tone and the bass, not to mention the action. I think most people who don't like them either have not played them or have picked up a used one in a store that has not had the strings replaced in 10 years. I am always amazed when I see a vintage O at a store with vintage strings on it. Frankly I don't know how they expect to sell a guitar with old strings on it, not to mention they always seem to be out of tune.
Oh, yea. As dave and gh said "who cares?" |
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Posts: 31
Location: alabama | I can say from personal experience that I was an O basher years ago...until I bought three. I now play my Elite while my Taylor sits in the case.
I think most people bash them for the same reason I did. First, ignorance - they know nothing about them; and second, most people don't get to play high end O's - which kinda leads to the ignorant assumption that O's are junk guitars. The chains are usually loaded with high end Taylor's and Martin's with only one or two very low end celebs on the wall.
Just my opinion of course... |
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Posts: 2791
Location: Atlanta, GA. | From "Desiderata"...
"Speak your truth quietly and clearly; and listen to others, even to the dull and the ignorant, they too have their story." |
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Posts: 4820
Location: Campbell River, British Columbia | It's hard to hate something you know.
So those who hate, don't know.
You just can't fight willful ignorance.
Actually, the only place I've heard about O slagging in years is....here! |
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December 2001
Posts: 7211
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | This has been discussed to death, but I'm not saying that as a bad thing, just an observation.
"So, what IS the problem? What are the specific accusations? "
It's MANY factors at the same time. If someone is initially turned off by the idea of "not wood" or the "idea" of a round back, they certainly aren't going to be turned on much when they hear one that's been either plugged in or recorded by someone that has no idea what they are doing. Top that with them likely not ever seeing a high-end Ovation, let alone play one.
Ok.. fine.. They heard, they saw, they played... but they've been hearing, seeing and playing "wood" guitars all their life. The "Ovation sound," sounds wrong to them. Good action to them means the strings and fretboard are in separate zip codes.
So once you get past all of the above, you get down to the few open-minded people that think quality sound means consistent tone up and down the fretboard and consistent volume up and down the fretboard. These few people want to hear the "notes" untainted by the sound of a wood box. These people like low action, big volume, and buying an instrument that while they will take care of, they don't have to baby it.
There are a lot of people that listen to old blues and earlier Jazz and Classical recordings of Acoustic guitar, and to them THAT is what a guitar is supposed to sound like.
Another way to look at it.. I think about guitar sound as either "Clean" or "Distorted". I don't think in "Acoustic" or "Electric" even though I have misused those terms and mislead people in what I was thinking.
A well setup electric through an amp, should sound much like an Adamas thats unplugged IMHO, NOT a wood box. |
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Location: SoCal | I try not to live my life by what others think.
Click..... |
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Posts: 13984
Location: Upper Left USA | "I try not to live my life by what others think."
Paul, you're wrong and you need to change!
:rolleyes: |
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May 2003
Posts: 4389
Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands | Ovation critics are ignorant. Last month I went to a jam filled with early music neanderthals. You know, the bearded back to the earthers granola crunchers, and when I pulled out my adamas they were aghast. F*ck 'em. I more than held my own. |
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Posts: 90
Location: los angeles | I've actually been following the Ovation thread on the "other" forum and have been participating to some degree (different user name there). What I have found is:
(1) some people like Ovations and keep them in their stable;
(2) some people could not get used to the round back;
(3) some people hate Ovations but cannot really articulate why other than "the sound" without reference to specific model or circumstances;
(4) some people do not like the "nut-width" choices in most models;
(5) some people do not like the sound although it appears that they were actually listening;
(6) some people are downright snarky and troll-like (just a few on that particular thread).
By the way, I joined this forum some time ago when I acquired a UKII. Since then, I have gotten totally immersed in acoustics. The non-Ovations that really got me going were (ahem!) a Taylor 614ce and a Gibson Jumbo. But the prices were prohibitive for me.
I played just about anything I could get my hands on over several months and for my money nothing could touch the unplugged tone of the Ovations I kept considering. The first Ovation I really, really liked, and had to have was a 1778LX (cherryburst) which I bought at GC for too good a deal to pass up. Then, when GAS attacked again, and I was again at a GC, I fell instantly in love with a GC178LX, and bought that one for an incredible price. All were on clearance. (If you read the "other forum" thread, you will be able to tell who I am by my speaking about those guitars :) .)
These 2 guitars sound so different from one another, and play differently too. I don't think I would want to give either of them up.
I learn a lot on this site and enjoy all of the fun that goes with it, and decided to come out of the "woodwork"(excuse the pun :D ).
Bob |
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Location: Melbourne Fl. | Where I live(Brevard Co. Florida),there is a great music scene,such variety.blues,jazz,alt,you name it.So.I was chatting with a local bluesman by the name of Steve Thorpe and the subject of Ovations came up(so figger).Anyway he tells me that our area musicians like to record with O's but very few gig them out. Again.........go figger. Al |
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Posts: 1553
Location: Indiana | My opinion only...
The "problem" is that for many, all Ovation's are imports.
Not dis'ing the nitch they fill.
But most players never get to taste the top shelf.
A little while back, my wife and I had 3 singer/songwriter friends over for dinner. All firmly "in the box" as far as their instrument taste's go. They've come to know and like my Viper from the live events we've played together, but they've never seen my stash.
After dinner, I brought out my Adamas, played one song and passed it on. I never got the guitar passed back to me for the rest of the night. Got stuck with a Guild in my lap.
Not that there's anything wrong with that. |
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Posts: 7211
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Originally posted by moody, p.i.:
I try not to live my life by what others think. I actually don't think many of us "care", but we're just curious why.
I have said it before.. when I was first introduced to Ovation in the 70's I thought then as I do now... there is to no reason to waste wood to make "square" backed guitars when they are supposed to be round.
I have not seen a valid reason for why guitars started having "square" shaped backs when they started out as round, other than mass production and materials that weren't available.
It seems like a lot of people "settle" for wood, square-backed guitars, and I don't know why. Stringed instruments are supposed to have round backs. It makes more sense, and it was how they were originally designed.
Maybe that's the next t-shirt.
"I'm a true guitar snob, my guitars have ROUND backs, not those new fandangled square things"
with a picture of an Adamas next to one of the first guitars, lutes, or tars. |
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| I'm tired of it all, Someone please just tell me what to think. |
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Location: Upper Left USA | "Semper Reflectus Parabolis" |
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Posts: 10777
Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | I wanted to post a link to a 'BC Rich Players Community' thread...
(but you need to be a member to read it. :mad: )
But the title of the thread is: "WHY DO MANY PEOPLE SAY BC RICH IS CRAP?"
So, the problem is not limited to Ovation. People can be Stuck-Up about other guitars too. :rolleyes: |
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Posts: 7211
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | As an avid BC Rich advocate.. while the reasons are different, the perception is the same.
Unless you are intimately familiar with the brand, knowing what's a cheap import, good import or a Made in USA custom shop model is not easy. Unlike Ovation, and without going into too much detail that frankly is just way to complicated, BC Rich no longer builds their alleged USA models in anything that remotely resembles the way they were built during the heyday that put them on the map. Add in that the market was flooded for several years with sub-standard built guitars under the BC Rich name.
As I said, it's a different story, but the result is the same. The people likely making the assumptions about the brand, chances are they have never actually played or even seen a real USA hand-made BC Rich. |
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October 2008
Posts: 489
| Originally posted by dobro:
1) My local luthier just snarls about "plastic": does not want to be more specific.... Then I will. He can't build you one and charge you five grand, so he doesn't like them. |
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Posts: 280
Location: Waterloo, IL | Have a good friend that played professionally for several years. He likes his Taks and other wood boxes. However, when ever he comes over to the house, he always enjoys playing my Legend, stating it really has "Great tone!" He may prefer wood boxes, but at least he is willing to admit my "O's" sound good! |
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Posts: 494
Location: Location Location Location | Sheep followed the celebrities to Ovation, and sheep followed the celebrities from Ovation. |
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Posts: 2985
Location: Sydney, Australia | Baaaaa! (Sheep type #1) |
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January 2006
Posts: 2120
Location: Chicago | Hey, here's a good angle. Since O's have vanished from the mainstream they are once again truly EXOTIC! I've been asked a few times "What kind of instrument is that you're playing?" The black Adamas 1581-5 is especially mystifying.
I tell them it's a "Carbonesque Hyperbolic Ishtafar String-oidolite" from Kazakhstan. "Wow! Really? Never heard of THAT!" |
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Posts: 3618
Location: GATLINBURG TENNESSEE :) | I believe what it ALL comes down to is jealousy ... close-minded-square-back traditionalists are just extremely frustrated about their instruments not being able to sound and play as good as an Ovation/Adamas, so they revert to bad-mouthing. You can observe a simular behavior in high school girls at the prom ... many of them spend most of their time bad-mouthing the girl who's getting all the attention in the room. I really like watching one of my fellow band members frantically trying to get his Taylor in tune, as I hold out my Adamas and ask ... "Would you like to borrow my tuner?" (: |
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Posts: 3736
Location: Sunshine State, Australia | Just came back from a jam session tonight. I took the 1768.
EVERYONE at the jam that DIDN'T know what an Ovation was was gobsmacked at how fantastic it sounded and how easy it was to play.
These people haven't been influenced by the negative hype and are now fans of Ovations. Next week they get introduced to the contour bowled '05ES.
Originally posted by Guitarzannie:
...which is why I can empathize with Ovation owners having to defend their choice of guitar. Luckily, I don't feel the need to 'defend' my choice, coz my choice usually 'eats' the other guitars at the jam.
I just sit there in my smug little bubble with a satisfied smile on my dial.
Screw the critics. |
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Posts: 639
Location: NW of Philadelphia | I just posted my 2 cents over there.
I agree, don't defend your Ovation, just hand it to them and watch it work its magic. |
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Posts: 3111
Location: Nashville TN. | Originally posted by Mr. Ovation:
As an avid BC Rich advocate.. while the reasons are different, the perception is the same.
Unless you are intimately familiar with the brand, knowing what's a cheap import, good import or a Made in USA custom shop model is not easy. Unlike Ovation, and without going into too much detail that frankly is just way to complicated, BC Rich no longer builds their alleged USA models in anything that remotely resembles the way they were built during the heyday that put them on the map. Add in that the market was flooded for several years with sub-standard built guitars under the BC Rich name.
As I said, it's a different story, but the result is the same. The people likely making the assumptions about the brand, chances are they have never actually played or even seen a real USA hand-made BC Rich. BC Rich made some amazing guitars before Bernie sold the company.
I have a an Early NJ neck thru-body Wave.
(1983)
Unfortunately, the truss rod is all the way out
and neck angles off.
Do you know anyone who works on these??? |
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July 2003
Posts: 3111
Location: Nashville TN. | I heard I hate Ovation's but that sounds great!
So many times...
you hand it the person and they start smilin.
If its like a bar room conversation
I'll play some classic songs on the internet Jukebox and after they agree that was a great sounding guitar, I them them its an Ovation.
I have two premium solid wood guitars.
I like them .....
I play USA Ovations a lot more.
If the powers that be are listening
Ad campain
Licence some classic recording with Ovations.
Give it some lead time print ads.
Then offer the CD free if you try a USA Ovation or Adamas Guitar.
Makes dealer want to stock USA Ovations
Gets people to play them.
likily will sell guitar as they sell
themself once they are in your hands.
Best part is you could could change the CD on a yearly basis so the promotion can go on indefinately. |
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The "Critics" say THIS about Ovation: