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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | My trusty old XP computer just locked-up and Died. I may get it fixed, but I needed a computer NOW! So I went shopping down at Office Despot and everything has Vista! :eek:
So now I have Vista. :mad:
Real purdy grafix... But I think that it is using alot of RAM to run that purdy stuff.
But I am just an old fart who thinks everything worked just fine in 1975, and they shouldn't have changed it.
Any pointers, tricks, warnings, or any of that stuff y'all might wanna share?
[Besides telling me that I shoulda got a MAC]
Yeah, this ain't about guitars... But the OFC is a computer website. :p |
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Location: Brighty in Blighty | Yeah, get Windows 7 when it's out! |
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Location: Warren,Pa. | Sell it and get a Mac. |
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Location: North Oregon Coast | Quick, take it back and find a new computer with XP on it!
Vista really sucks and if you have the kind of issues with it that I did, it's gonna take awhile to fine tune it to your liking.
The first thing you probably noticed is that you can't do a damned thing without some nagging Windows pop-up giving you some kind of security warning. I finally disabled all this stuff so that I can actually do something.
The next thing is the applications and hardware support, be prepared to look for all the latest Vista-compliant drivers and updates, you're gonna need them, and fact of the matter is, some of your favorite applications simply aren't going to work.
Despite the Vista bling, I was much happier with XP and I still think about maybe going back to it.
A final note: head over to the Vista Forum and register yourself, I've received a lot of help there. http://thevistaforums.com/index.php?
Good Luck! |
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Location: Vernon CT | I have it to OMA. Have had it for about 1 yr and 8 month. When I first got it, I had a ton of problems with it shutting down, freezing up and so on. With Automatic updates that were sent to fix these problems, it's gotten much better. Other then the graphics it's not much different then what you had in my opinion. |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Yeah, and the Hearts and Solitaire games Look real purdy and run real slowly...
If I wanted to take that much time, I'd use a real deck of cards.
Every time a window opens, it does it real slowly and gracefully.
Like I said... Very pretty. Some artsy-techsky folks thought that up.
I don't get too many pop-up warnings from Windows cuz I run Firefox...
But this thing does ask you Twice before it lets you do anything.
I have had it less than 12 hours and I promptly went and disabled or removed a bunch of gizmos that I will never use. (Quicken and Office trial crap, some other dumb kid chat room crap)
They have a PLAN... They are gonna pretend that Windows never happened.
That is why I bought my other computer, cuz everything had Vista on it back then... But there were still a few stray XP units running around.
This does not want to recognize the install disc for my web cam.
I ain't sniveling too much, yet... But my little piece of crap computer ran just fine!
It got mad and would hold-it's-breath every other week...
But it worked good, until it just stopped working. |
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Location: closely held secret | Sorry to hear that, OMA. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | Get Windoze 7. If what I read and hear is true, it will lessen your regret that you didn't buy a Mac.
I've never used Vista so I can't help you directly. I know you can still buy XP, so I wonder if it's possible to just dump the Vista and reload good old XP? |
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Location: Sydney, Australia | Technically it should be possible to boot from an XP install disk, erase the hard drive and install XP. I'd be surprised if they haven't tweaked the firmware to prevent you installing XP. "We will make you use Vista".
You'll always regret not buying a Mac, just try to live with the pain.
Uh, OMA, what was the computer you were using in 1975? Did you have access to a mainframe somewhere, running Fortran? |
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Location: south east Michigan | I've been places like Best Buy where EVERYTHING is Vista. You can't even buy a computer with the old XP. |
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| Vista SP1 (and now SP2) corrected a lot of the horrendous incompatibility issues it had on first release, but it's still a resource hog and that User Account Control BS is more trouble than it's worth (turn it off if you keep Vista installed). Unless you can find drivers for your web cam direct from the manufacturer written for Vista then you're SOL.
My laptop has a quad core CPU and 4 GB of RAM running Vista 64-bit and it runs fine. When I got a rootkit on my work computer that I couldn't get rid of I wiped the HDD and installed Vista - big mistake on a duo core with 2 GB, it ran like a 3-legged tortoise with Parkinson's, so I quickly wiped it again and installed XP Pro SP3. That's probably the most stable OS Microsoft has issued and you can still buy it online in many places. |
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Location: Blue Ridge Mountains | Get Windoze 7. If what I read and hear is true, it will lessen your regret that you didn't buy a Mac.
Of course its not out yet...
I had a horror story w/Vista...I would never use it again...lately however even my XP running machines have begun to slow and act weird. I will be using W7 as soon as I can....I did buy an iMac24 that I use for the Logic Studio 8 DAW...I use the PC for the ofice and work...but I would never use Vista again even if it were the only choice... |
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Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands | Dump vista.
Install your old xp
Wait for W7 (and then give that a year to get out the bugs)
Buy a mac
I feel your pain. |
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Location: closely held secret | Vista is the new Millenium. M$ was so excited about it they were already working on 7 when they released it. They should have called it "Windows for users who can't be trusted to wipe themselves without being asked 3 times if they're sure they want to".
Interesting how you can still get an "XP downgrade option from places like Dell - they charge you $100 for it. That alone speaks volumes about the level of confidence they have in the desirability of Vista.
You can still get OEM XP-SP3 for between $99 and $140.
The trick with installing XP on Vista-ready machines is to find the XP drivers for them. The other day I replaced the hard drive in my daughters 'Vista ready' HP notebook. After a year of Vista, she wanted XP on it. Luckily, I found a post where a guy had located all the necessary XP drivers and utilities for that exact machine, because HP had removed all the XP drivers from their site.
If you have hardware for which XP drivers have never been developed, you're SOL. |
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| Windows 7 RC1 is out and available for free download, and it's good for a year of evaluation..
you can get 32bit or 64bit editions, and it runs a hell of a lot better than Vista did out of the box.
I'm a beta tester for MS and several of the other OS manufacturers...
if anyone wants to give W7 a try, here is the link:
Windows 7 RC1
you may have to register with MS to get it, but maybe an open link by now..
I've even gotten it to run on a 700mhz machine with only 256mb of ram, I'm using it on some of the machines I'm building and giving away to our freecycle members.
definitely speedier and more resource conservative than Longhorn.
Glenn |
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| just make sure you run the compatibility and update utility and get all necessary new drivers onto a cd or dvd before you load the OS, some NICs and wireless cards have hard to find drivers...
CA is also giving away a 6 month virus scanner eval to go along with it.
Glenn |
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Location: Michigan | Agreed with Ray, run...don't walk back to the store and order one with XP. |
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| The new machines are hardware and firmware locked/proprietary for Vista or W-7 in most cases, and you cannot even install XP Pro or home edition on the new mobos.
Glenn |
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Location: On the Coast - Halfway between SF & OR | Everyone knows the problems with Vista and the lack of customer service from Microsoft - why do people keep buying these machines?
I don't understand.
Anyone with the good sense to step out of the mainstream and own Ovations should not be taken in by the herd mentality that they must have "Windows.'
Take it back, buy a Mac and enjoy. |
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Location: Michigan | Originally posted by Palm Bay Glenn:
The new machines are hardware and firmware locked/proprietary for Vista or W-7 in most cases, and you cannot even install XP Pro or home edition on the new mobos.
Glenn You can still get dell laptops with XP if you go tot the small business section. Latitudes are probably the cheapest bang for you buck there. |
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Location: SoCal | I bought a new PC a couple of months ago. It came loaded with XP and I've got a Vista disc I've never installed.
As to Mac's, by daughter wants a laptop for college next year. I don't know. For half the money you can get a laptop pc with a bigger screen, more features, etc. Why spend $2k when you can get more for $900? |
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Location: closely held secret | Originally posted by fletcher:
Everyone knows the problems with Vista and the lack of customer service from Microsoft - why do people keep buying these machines?
I don't understand. The cheapest Mac (w/monitor) is more than twice the cost of a PC.
Not saying they're not worth it, but not everyone has room in their budget for one.
Originally posted by fletcher:
Anyone with the good sense to step out of the mainstream and own Ovations should not be taken in by the herd mentality that they must have "Windows.' Apples and oranges, and just a bit snotty.
One of the things I love about Ovations is the quality I can get for less money.
There are many who use windows because it fits their needs best.
I like Macs, but I still enjoy the flexibility of building my own systems for reasonable prices and finding great free software available. |
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Location: Blue Ridge Mountains | I still use my PC's even though I bought a like new iMac24 for $1400 on eBay earlier this year...I bought it strictly to use for my studio: my DAW is Logic Studio 8...although in a pinch I can use it for other stuff as well: it has MS Office for Mac as well as the Adobe suite so the possibilities are limitless...but I have a lot tied up in my Dell XPS 600...which I use for internet and office work...I have a Dell Inspiron Laptop which I used in Seminary and now use as part of my network here at the house and when I'm away...Being versitile is great and I did not spend any more than I would have for a comparable PC replacement...except I don't want to replace my PC...just get it running smoothly and as fast as it should with it's 4Gigs memory/3.6 Gig Dual Processor/350 and 80 gig Raptor hard drives...this thing can and will fly again... |
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Location: Upper Left USA | My home PC is running Vista and I purposely don't add any Programs besides Turbo Tax, iTunes and the One Care support stuff.
My next one will be a Mac. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | I don't know why the PC-Mac discussion gets so heated. Different tools for people with different perspectives on how to get things done.
No different than a guitar discussion. There is certainly an economic factor. Not everyone can pony up for a Mac, and not everyone can pony up for a Taylor. Nor should they. Value is often portrayed as the holy grail of consumerdom, but it's also just another word for "compromise".
You look at the job that needs to be done, you look in your wallet, and you make the best compromise you can. Maybe it's a $500. e-machine. Maybe it's a $3500. iMac.
Unfortunately none of this banter helps OMA with his Vista issues. Sorry I can't help you. |
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Location: closely held secret | Originally posted by Gallerinski:
I don't know why the PC-Mac discussion gets so heated. Different tools for people with different perspectives on how to get things done. I totally agree on that, Dave. I will probably move to a Mac (or Linux) when M$ hits the tipping point for me on value over usability. In the meantime my needs are met.
Originally posted by Gallerinski:
Value is often portrayed as the holy grail of consumerdom, but it's also just another word for "compromise". Not always. If it fills all your needs without extras you're never going to use, then it's value. If it only fulfills some of your needs at a lower price then it's a compromise.
Originally posted by Gallerinski:
Maybe it's a $500. e-machine. Never! Worst piece of crap on the market. |
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Location: closely held secret | OMA - what exactly did you buy? (brand, model#) |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Didn't see earlier.. as others have said...
Just pick up an XP Pro CD, install, do the updates... done.. Vista is not ready for prime time and will never be. Windows 7 will be the way to go by all accounts..
For the MAC folks... if it works for you.. fine.. it doesn't work for everyone.. get over yourselves... sorry.. but comparing a MAC and a PC is like comparing Beer and Vodka. One is not better than the other. If want to make a Bloody Mary... all the beer on the planet ain't gonna help ya. If you want beer batter onion rings, all the Vodka in the world ain't gonna help ya. |
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Location: San Bernardino, California | If you're stuck with Vista, buy this book.
Vista Inside Out |
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Location: closely held secret | On the positive side... your reset button will be all shiny and bright! |
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Location: CA | Mac. Too much 'baggage' with PCs anymore. And am I really reading that some folks with rooms full of Adami (you know who you are) are actually quibbling about paying more for something that's better in almost every way?
Isn't this the very thing we rail against here? The argument that Celebrities are cheaper and 'good enough' — so why spend big bucks on a US made O or Adamas? |
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Location: Florida Central Gulf Coast | Originally posted by Oddball:
Isn't this the very thing we rail against here? Not replacing my PC, which suits my needs, with a MAC has allowed me to purchase a few more 'O's & 'A'!  |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Originally posted by The Wabbit Formerly Known As Waskel:
OMA - what exactly did you buy? (brand, model#) It is an "HP Pavilion S3700F Slimline Desktop" Like This...
3GB memory & 320GB HD (of which 70GB is full of Vista stuff) They say...
"Get full desktop PC functionality in one-third the size with our Slimline s3700f PC, which looks perfect on a kitchen counter or in your family room. This powerful, space-efficient computer is ready to upgrade the quality of your digital life.
Full functionality in one-third the size
* Experience genuine Windows Vista Home Premium†† 32-bit edition with Service Pack 1
* Get reliable performance from the 2.6GHz AMD Athlon X2 5000 Dual-Core Processor
* Multitask with the 3GB PC2-6400 DDR2 SDRAM
* Enhance multimedia with the Nvidia GeForce 6150 SE graphics (128MB dedicated)
* Store data on the high-capacity 320GB, 7200 rpm SATA hard drive; add more storage via the integrated HP Pocket Media Drive bay1
* Label discs with silkscreen-quality text, photos, and designs using HP's cool LightScribe feature
* Save space with this compact design"
$429 without a monitor, just the brain-box and keyboard/mouse, but they say that they will give me $100 back.
[Oh, because of the size there are no expansion slots for other disc drives. And there might not be extra slots inside to increase memory... But I ain't a geek, so I know nuthin!]
It was the cheapest thing that they had with a card reader, for my evilBay listings. As to the webcam... I got it for $10 or so on sale. If I cannot find a driver that wants to work I can go buy another one that works for Vista, for $29 or less. This computer did recognize my Canon printer all by itself.
It is just a matter of getting used to it. Like I said, it has Really Purdy grafix. But I think it would run much better without then. 3GB memory and my XP woulda been just zooming along.
But this do have the "WOW" factor. That is what the ad execs wanted for the Mojave experiment.
So I just gotta get used to it. I didn't like the XP at first cuz I was used to using Windows98.
BTW-- anybody know what an "integrated HP Pocket Media Drive bay" is? It is a slot that looks like you put an iPod into... I'm confused :confused: |
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Location: Ohio | I just purchased a Dell laptop and made sure that XP was available. My part time thing is wedding photography, and I hav all the software I need for xp. No upgrades for vista, so I'd have to shell out BIG $$$$ for the new versions. The main one I use is avera grand for VISTA. I'm gonna baby this one for a LONG time!!!!
Steve |
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Location: closely held secret | Originally posted by Oddball:
Mac. Too much 'baggage' with PCs anymore. And am I really reading that some folks with rooms full of Adami (you know who you are) are actually quibbling about paying more for something that's better in almost every way?
Isn't this the very thing we rail against here? The argument that Celebrities are cheaper and 'good enough' — so why spend big bucks on a US made O or Adamas? Again, apples and guavas. The flaw in your argument is that a Mac is "better". This is not always true, it depends on your needs.
OMA, here is a page which will give you the XP drivers for the chipset, graphics and audio for your machine. |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Wabbit... PM with stupid questions sent! |
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Location: On the Coast - Halfway between SF & OR | Originally posted by The Wabbit Formerly Known As Waskel:
Again, apples and guavas. The flaw in your argument is that a Mac is "better". This is not always true, it depends on your needs. Stick to apples and apples, compare the operating systems and tell me what "need" Vista fills better than Macintosh OS.
Sorry, I can't see ANY NEED that makes Vista "better" for anyone than Mac OS. |
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Location: Florida Central Gulf Coast | fletcher,
I've yet to see anyone flaunt Vista. Now back to the real world...
Geeeze, let's talk wood boxes... :rolleyes: |
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Location: Blue Ridge Mountains | Don't ya just love it when the family gets together for some small talk....lol
Here is a shudder for ya: I started out on a cheapo word processor w/ an on board daisy wheel printer and no internet connection...because it wasn't invented yet...lol, I'm so Old! :eek: :eek: ;) |
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Location: San Bernardino, California | Pocket Media Drive |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Originally posted by MusicMishka:
Here is a shudder for ya: I started out on a cheapo word processor w/ an on board daisy wheel printer and no internet connection...because it wasn't invented yet...lol, I'm so Old! :eek: :eek: ;) Mine was an "Adam" from Sears! (not quite up to a Commodore 64)
Dot Matrix printer and you had cassette tapes with the programs on them.
I later played with a computer that would actually speak words that you typed into it.
Back then the computer that the kid had in "War Games" (1983) was top-of-the line. |
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Location: Florida Central Gulf Coast | OK, let's talk about da good ol' Sinclair, or the CIE kit! Didn't ya love the DIP switches?
I was fortunate enough to be an ECM (Electronic Countermeasures) evaluator of the HP9598, 7 1/2" disc drive, 128K 'puter for the USAF. Shiite hot at the time.
During my years as an instructor, my students would gripe bout the 'speed' of the HP. I'd have them hit the 'step' button and manually step through the program lines. Talk about an immediate appreciation of micro-processors...
Once the 'puters went from DOS to Windows, my 'puter days were limited. Please give me back the ol' DOS control... 
Day-um, I'm ancient!  |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Thank You Wabbit!
BTW - Your Mailbox is FULL! |
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Location: closely held secret | Originally posted by fletcher:
Stick to apples and apples, compare the operating systems and tell me what "need" Vista fills better than Macintosh OS.
Sorry, I can't see ANY NEED that makes Vista "better" for anyone than Mac OS. Try to pay attention.
1) I wasn't talking about Vista.
2) I didn't say Vista was "better".
3) Believe it or not, there are some things that are better/easier done in a Windows environment than OSX.
4) Macs are 2-3 times more expensive than a comparable PC. So is the software. While this may not matter to some, it does to others.
5) Mac users are becoming as insufferable as Taylor owners and ex-smokers.
6) Click. |
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Location: closely held secret | Glad to help, OMA. I cleaned out some.
Iffy, I remember the Timex Sinclair! Did some time share on the Portland State computer in high school (72). VIC20, C64/128, Atari, DOS... Been a long strange trip. |
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Location: Boise, Idaho | You were still in high school in 72? Punk kid. My younger brother had the VIC20 and C64. I got a 128 when they were old, about 1978. A friend got the Atari, saying it was the wave of the future. |
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Location: closely held secret | You must be old, your brain is going. The Commodore PET was introduced in '77, the VIC20 in '80, C64 in '82 and the c128 in '85. |
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Location: Florida Central Gulf Coast | Originally posted by The Wabbit Formerly Known As Waskel:
Iffy, I remember the Timex Sinclair! Did some time share on the Portland State computer in high school (72). VIC20, C64/128, Atari, DOS... Been a long strange trip. John,
'Our'/my first wish was the multi-tasking capability and then the graphic user interface. But MS gave us the GUI and then the tasking. From that point, I, as a serious user, could no longer control my processor. Gawd, prior to that, I was considered a genius in manipulating the 256/526 RAM memory via autoexec.bat and config.sys.
I guess my point is that the PC vs. MAC argument is in the eye$ of the beholder. Power to the pupil$!
Thanx for the flashback! 
BTW, I think I have a VIC buried somewhere 'round here...
ETA, my C64 and dual drive C128 are all gone! I'll never forget learning the C128 boot thing! :eek: |
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Location: NW Washington State | I still have my Atari 800 from my first job in the computer biz. Since it incorporated state-of-the art sound and graphics, it was much better for creative people than that crappy Apple II. :)
These days it seems like computers really aren't improving much. We're still using the mouse/window/icon system that's been around for decades. Both Windows and the vaunted Mac are pieces of crap as consumer products- bloated, arcane, hard to use. It's like choosing between the firing squad and the gas chamber.
For what it's worth, rumor has it that vouchers for a free Windows 7 upgrade will be offered along with Vista PCs starting in the next week or two.
-Steve W. |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | For about $1400 they had a Touch Screen PC at OD...
I played with it for a few minutes and saw a coupla downsides to that one:
First, like the old Macs the screen and the brains were all in on neat little container...
So if something breaks, you gotta send everything in to the shop.
Second, I'm guessing that the Touch Screen ain't gonna be cheap to fix or replace.
Third, I guess you will be either washing the screen or your hands more often than usual.
Fourth, you would have to be close enough to the screen to touch it with your finger!
(Why would I wanna be that close to a big screen? And if I wanted a little screen I'd get a laptop!)
Just thinking out loud while I am awake this early/late in the morning.
[I'm still downloading more crap that they didn't think to add when they added all that crap I didn't want!] |
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Location: Wichita, KS | Originally posted by The Wabbit Formerly Known As Waskel:
Iffy, I remember the Timex Sinclair! Did some time share on the Portland State computer in high school (72). VIC20, C64/128, Atari, DOS... Been a long strange trip. I just got my Commodore 128 back from son #1 and set it up in my office. Needs a little work, but I still love that thing. Back in the day, I did a lot of word processing, published a monthly newsletter, and wrote some software. The GEOS operating system made a great machine out of an already good one. Looking back, I'm amazed at what it could do with the technology available at the time. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | Dumb question: You can do bootcamp and run Windows on a Mac. Can you do the opposite and run MacOS on a PC? |
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Location: closely held secret | No. But then again, why would you want or need to? What can I do on a Mac that I can't do on a PC?
Seems to me that bootcamp is a tool for Mac users to be able to emulate windows.
Bootcamp, powerpc chipset, OSX... these are all attempts to carve off a bigger percentage of the windows market... and I applaud Apple for it.
They just aren't 'great' enough for me to justify spending 3X+ more money on. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | Originally posted by The Wabbit Formerly Known As Waskel:
No. But then again, why would you want or need to? What can I do on a Mac that I can't do on a PC? I was just curious. Maybe people have personal preferences for certain apps. Like folks use different web browzers. Even programs that have Mac and Win versions (Office or Photoshop for example) people might have a preference for the layout or feel of one vs. the other. You know, do you prefer "Alt-F-S" or "Cmd-S" to save your file ... |
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Location: Boise, Idaho | You're right Wabbit. Senility has arrived when I can't even get the right decade. I didn't own a TV until 1985 and then we only got one because they were cheaper than computer monitors. Hooked up the 128 to the little 12 inch color TV.
And Dale, I also thought the GEOS software (Berkeley Software??) was great. It did a lot with very little, unlike the bloated stuff of today. |
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Location: closely held secret | Originally posted by Gallerinski:
I was just curious. Maybe people have personal preferences for certain apps. Like folks use different web browzers. Even programs that have Mac and Win versions (Office or Photoshop for example) people might have a preference for the layout or feel of one vs. the other. You know, do you prefer "Alt-F-S" or "Cmd-S" to save your file ... That could be it, Dave, I don't know. I just use what gets the job done for me.
I prefer "Ctrl-s". |
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December 2001
Posts: 7247
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Say what you will about the Commodore 64, but it was a lean mean comput'n machine. I've used them to control quarter-million dollar measurement systems... perform complicated data analysis, and that was in the late 80's... written music, midi, inventory systems...
I just downloaded the Pocket PC C-64 Emulator for my phone... If they built computers today with the same paradigm of lean'n mean that they did for the C-64, we'd be light-years ahead of where we are today.
By the way, for you studio guys... if you want the old-school analog synth sounds, just get a C-64 setup (get a couple, their cheap) and all the Rio Kawasaki software. Just amazing. |
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March 2009
Posts: 416
Location: On the Coast - Halfway between SF & OR | Originally posted by Gallerinski:
Dumb question: You can do bootcamp and run Windows on a Mac. Can you do the opposite and run MacOS on a PC?
It's not a dumb question at all; many people have wondered that and many have tried.
There aren't many differences between the actual COMPUTERS, they use similar RAM chips for memory, similar hard drives for storage, and similar processors. Macs are more expensive simply because of numbers. Since Mac stopped licensing their OS to other manufactures, you now must pay a premium (buy one of THEIR computers) to get it. If Mac had allowed PowerComputing and others to continue use of the Mac OS, the prices would probably be similar today.
As I attempted to point out earlier, the discussion here is not between Mac and PC, but between Mac OS and Windows Vista OS; which one is more stable, which is easier for a novice to use out of the box. If I could load Mac OS in a cheaper box, I would - but I can't.
So I'm willing to pay $599 for a Mac Mini instead of $435 for an HP.
I pay no premium for the other software I use (contrary to what has been said in earlier postings), MS Office cost exactly the same for Mac as it does for Windows, Adobe Creative Suite costs exactly the same, etc. USB keyboards, mice, web cams, card readers, and monitors don't care what they are plugged into so long as you have the appropriate OS compatible driver.
Macs are not a speciality device as some tout them to be, they are not good only for specific needs, they are simply a line of computers same as Dell or HP.
In my eyes, a computer's operating system is like any other tool, you can pay less initially and spend time and money and frustration later keeping it functional, or you can pay more on the outset and get on with your life.
To me, the choice is easy. I will recommend Mac OS over Vista every time. |
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April 2004
Posts: 13303
Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | I don't understand all this talk about frustration. My PC has run flawlessly for years without any life threatening crashes or viruses.....and I am a power user who takes chances all the time.
My studio DAW never has a problem, low latency and ample software add ons.
I don't do stupid things....like visit unknown sites, open emails that are in my spam/jumk folders and I back up regularly.
If I had the above mentioned problems, then I might consider a MAC to see if it was a better way to work but since the majority of problems with both systems is primarily user error, I don't really see the point of the ongoing discussion.
Now.....I am going to go play a Taylor. |
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October 2007
Posts: 2711
Location: Vernon CT | Originally posted by 2ifbyC:
fletcher,
I've yet to see anyone flaunt Vista. Now back to the real world...
Geeeze, let's talk wood boxes... :rolleyes: Hey, Anyone want to trade for a Taylor......... ;) |
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March 2007
Posts: 843
Location: CA | Amen, Fletcher. No comparison. The savings in 'spyware' and 'virusware' — in terms of $$, time, and RAM — that you don't have to invest for Macs is worth the price of admission alone. |
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August 2006
Posts: 3145
Location: Marlton, NJ | Originally posted by stephent28:
I don't understand all this talk about frustration. My PC has run flawlessly for years without any life threatening crashes or viruses.....and I am a power user who takes chances all the time.
My studio DAW never has a problem, low latency and ample software add ons.
I don't do stupid things....like visit unknown sites, open emails that are in my spam/jumk folders and I back up regularly.
If I had the above mentioned problems, then I might consider a MAC to see if it was a better way to work but since the majority of problems with both systems is primarily user error, I don't really see the point of the ongoing discussion.
Now.....I am going to go play a Taylor. Amen! (except for the Taylor part).
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December 2001
Posts: 7247
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Originally posted by stephent28:
I don't understand all this talk about frustration. My PC has run flawlessly for years without any life threatening crashes or viruses.....and I am a power user who takes chances all the time.
My studio DAW never has a problem, low latency and ample software add ons.
I don't do stupid things....like visit unknown sites, open emails that are in my spam/jumk folders and I back up regularly.
If I had the above mentioned problems, then I might consider a MAC to see if it was a better way to work but since the majority of problems with both systems is primarily user error, I don't really see the point of the ongoing discussion.
Now.....I am going to go play a Taylor. That's it in a nutchell (cept for the Taylor bit).
Also Fletch.. I don't think ANYONE, including Microsoft at this point will say that Vista is better than anything... period.. so I don't know why your hung up on that particular Windows entry... A freaking slide rule is better than Vista, so are you saying MAC is only as good as a slide rule?
Bottom line as others have said.. Something is only "better" if it does what you need it do.. if it doesn't, it doesn't. The MAC OS is great for what it does, and Windows is great for what it does. That's all that matters. |
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May 2008
Posts: 4996
Location: Phoenix AZ | Does anyone really CARE what kind of computer or OS somebody else uses? Or hell what kind of GUITAR for that matter? Coffee? Boxers or briefs?
We all make our choices and have our opinions. I'm more than happy to tell you my preferences on all kinds of stuff. But don't misinterpret that as preaching what YOU should do/use/buy. As they say "Frankly Mildred I don't give a ..."
NOW HOW CAN WE HELP A BROTHER IN NEED ??? OMA bought a new computer. Telling him what YOU would have bought doesn't help, and to me the whole Mac-PC debate sounds like penis envy. I'm no computer geek but it sounds to me like the two credible recommendations are the following:
1. Make sure you have the latest Vista updates, learn to live with it, upgrade to Win7 as soon as available.
2. Downgrade to WinXP, might require some new drivers etc. but it's certainly possible.
Any other suggestions ???
PS - Mac, Takamine, Dunkin Donuts, Briefs |
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December 2001
Posts: 7247
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Originally posted by Gallerinski:
D
1. Make sure you have the latest Vista updates, learn to live with it, upgrade to Win7 as soon as available.
2. Downgrade to WinXP, might require some new drivers etc. but it's certainly possible.
Any other suggestions ???
Frankly 1. should NOT be an option.
Any machine designed to run Vista, should do fine with Windows XP Pro without the need of "finding" drivers. We (where I work) and several other large organizations have been buying "Vista" machines since they came out, but we immediately wipe the drives and install Windows XP Pro. The upgrade from Win XP Pro to Windows 7 is MUCH cleaner than from Vista to Windows 7 also.
Also FWIW, I have been using/testing Open Office for a awhile now and have not found anything it will not do. It reads MS Office files just fine and actually has a lot of features that make it much better than MS Office. |
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February 2005
Posts: 11840
Location: closely held secret | I agree with Miles, except for the drivers issue. There are XP drivers for most all the new hardware, but they are not necessarily on XP/SP3. M$ is not including them because they want you to buy Vista. The vendors do not include them because M$ tells them not to. But they can be found.
As I said somewhere, I spent hours tracking down XP drivers for my daughters "Vista Ready" HP notebook. HP wasn't offering them. They were out there, but I had to hunt for them.
This is more often the case with notebook hardware, as it's generally more proprietary, and I'm not saying it's the case with OMA's machine but at least we know they're out there if he needed them.
Btw, I've taked with OMA and he doesn't seem to be comfortable with reinstalling the OS.
"The upgrade from Win XP Pro to Windows 7 is MUCH cleaner than from Vista to Windows 7 also."
LOL, Miles... nothing reminded me of the disaster that was M.E. like that statement!!! |
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February 2005
Posts: 11840
Location: closely held secret | Originally posted by fletcher:
To me, the choice is easy. I will recommend Mac OS over Vista every time. Fletcher, I don't know who you think you're arguing with. As Dave said, comparing OSX to Vista isn't very flattering to OSX.
I'd recommend just about anything over Vista. |
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May 2008
Posts: 4996
Location: Phoenix AZ | Just dawns on me, I've never actually USED Vista. Oh well. |
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February 2005
Posts: 11840
Location: closely held secret | Lucky man. |
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April 2004
Posts: 13303
Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | Gee, if you can't have a little fun with Taylor in the great PC/MAC debate, where can you?....and just for the record, I finally sold my Taylor DDSM.
PS - PC, Lowden, Seattle's Best, Boxer Briefs |
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March 2009
Posts: 416
Location: On the Coast - Halfway between SF & OR | Originally posted by Mr. Ovation:
Also Fletch.. I don't think ANYONE, including Microsoft at this point will say that Vista is better than anything... period.. so I don't know why your hung up on that particular Windows entry...
Sorry to everyone if I misunderstood the thread. I thought the question was how to live with Vista!
Some posters stated to return the Vista machine and get one that uses an older version of Windows instead.
I posted that I felt returning the Vista machine and getting a Mac was a better idea and that I didn't understand why people were still following the crowd and sticking with Windows when everyone knows their current operating system isn't good.
The 2 additional posts I made were simply trying to return the discussion to OPERATING SYSTEMS (apples to apples) which I though was the point of the thread.
I don't believe I was flaunting anything or acting superior by stating my belief that the current Mac OS offering is superior to the current Windows OS offering. You, Mr. Ovation, seem to state that most everyone feels the same way. |
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May 2008
Posts: 194
Location: Las Vegas, NV | When I consider current Windows OS offerings, I really don't even consider Vista. In my mind, MS stopped at XP. Vista was such a disaster, I don't know why it would even be considered in a comparison, as that would not even be fair...
As far as Mr. O, I believe one of his last posts stated:"Bottom line as others have said.. Something is only "better" if it does what you need it do.. if it doesn't, it doesn't. The MAC OS is great for what it does, and Windows is great for what it does. That's all that matters."
So, there you go. It depends on what you want to do. |
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March 2005
Posts: 12761
Location: Boise, Idaho | Originally posted by stephent28:
Boxer Briefs TMI |
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December 2001
Posts: 7247
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | Originally posted by fletcher:
my belief that the current Mac OS offering is superior to the current Windows OS offering. I guess I misunderstood as well. I do this for a living... and have been involved in computer technology professionally since the late 70's. I don't consider Vista the "current Windows OS offering" as such... frankly it's not even on my radar. If I buy a machine, I buy a WinXP Pro disk with it and will continue to do so until WIndows7 is in full production and patched.
As far as "bring back and buy a MAC".. I'm assuming if someone wanted a MAC, they would have bought it in the first place, and just thought that was a bit rude to even suggest, but that's me.
You are correct though... most people completely miss the mark that it's OS vs OS, and in that battle... true stability and bang for buck.. they BOTH fall WAY short. Linux outperforms anything Microsoft or Apple could hope for on most any level.... but again... it depends on what you want to do..
If you have specific applications that run on a specific OS... it doesn't really matter what you prefer... you get what works.
So in that... I think we agree... I just hope OMA got something out of all this :( |
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September 2006
Posts: 10777
Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Gee... I just Love causing family spats. 
But Thank Y'all for the helpful pointers.
Like I said, when I first got XP, I wanted my Windows 98 back.
[Now I want my MTV like it used to be... All music, No commercials!]
I still will have trouble getting drivers for my old crap, but my printer works and that's what counts.
I went to the Vista Forum.... Unlike the Ovation Fan Club, most of it's members dislike Vista!
But I am getting better at this once I turned a bunch of stuff OFF.
But both of my XP computers, XP Home and XP Media Center, came with a bunch of AOL crap on them.
This did not have AOL, just Microsoft crap and Net Zero.
Like someone said, since the MAC OS only goes into Apple products they don't need to use their OS as a marketing gimmick for other crap.
(Kinda like unrelated flyers stuffed in your bank statement or cable bill)
Unfortunately, when they come-out with the next Windows...
Vista is liable to become a dinosaur just like Windows 2000. (Who got that one?)
I think that they invented Vista as pablum for the senior citizen crowd.
Y'know, people my age who cannot program their own VCR and don't own BlueRay.
(Their kids and grandkids Build gaming machines in their free time! :p )
Thanx All! :cool:
But don't let me stop your fun! And Miles has a point for the computer literate.
Get with the Program! All y'all are corporate clones, Linux is the way to Go! :eek: |
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March 2009
Posts: 416
Location: On the Coast - Halfway between SF & OR | Originally posted by Mr. Ovation:
most people completely miss the mark that it's OS vs OS, and in that battle... true stability and bang for buck.. they BOTH fall WAY short. Linux outperforms anything Microsoft or Apple could hope for on most any level....
I agree with that completely - I've never understood the whole Mac computer vs. PC computer thing; as I said earlier, if I could load Mac OS into a cheaper box I would be just as happy. If I knew enough about computers to use Linux, I would probably be even happier.
As for my suggestion for OMA to return the new computer and get a Mac, I understand that statement could be seen as rude as could all the postings prior to mine that suggested he take it back and get another computer with a different version of Windows. I couldn't understand the stick with Windows no matter what hoops you need to jump through feeling I was getting from the posts and was reacting to that.
OMA, I too hope you somehow got the info you desired out of all this and apologize for the rudeness my initial posting. |
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Totally OT - Vista? Just got it. Any advice for the Old Guy?