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Location: Tennessee | I looked through the archive because I thought this had been discussed before, but I can't find the thread. Anyway, in playing my OFC slothead reissue, I'm pretty sure they laid the fiber so that it runs longitudinally up the top, which was proven on the early Adamas to give better response and more full sound than the later guitars when they laid the fiber latitudinally. I'm curious to hear from those with Adamas guitars to know if you can really tell the difference between the two. And if anyone knows that when they did the reissues if they went to that level of detail to get the tops correct. |
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Location: Cicero, NY | Do Dave or Jerome have any records as to which models were laid out either way? I just took the back off my Ute and I believe they were made longitudinally but it would be interesting to know which were made in each vein so that a true side by side could be done. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | It has nothing to do with how they are laid. All the unidirectional tops are laid the same direction (longitudinally). What differs is the orientation of the weave "bumps", for lack of a better word. Hard to describe but imagine the adamas top is a ham sandwich (I'm serious). The wood ply in the middle is the ham and it's laid at a 30 degree angle on all models. But the carbon fiber faces (two of them, one outside and one inside) are like the pieces of bread. Now imagine that the only bread you had was the two end pieces, so each has an "inner" and and "outer" side. ie, the Outer side is the crust are you with me. Either the outer or inner side of the CF sheets is more bumpy than the other. Really doesn't matter which is which. Except when assembling the sandwich the two pieces of bread each have the likihood of being crust "in" or crust "out". One orientation on each side is bumpier than the other. So this leads to FOUR different combinations of "bumpiness", so to speak, sandwiched (excuse the pun) around the wood core. Their does not seem to be any systematic trend by model, but most tops I have seen tend to be bumpyOUT and smoothIN. But not all. Maybe 60%. There are SOME that are bumpy on both sides and these are the ones that REALLY SING. I can't explain why but I have owned THREE like this (2-1687's and a 1587). Oh and guess what - THE SLOTHEADS ARE ALSO LIKE THIS. There are others out there that I have heard people alk about. I think Moody's 12-string is bumpy in and out as well. Anyway, itcertainyl seems to have an effect on the sound and I think if you search on "bump" or "weave" you will find more info. Also go inspect your guitars, it would be interesting to know what people really have. |
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Posts: 5563
Location: Blue Ridge Mountains | Bobbo, I think this is the thread:
Adamas tops: original vs the re issues
Beal explains the process: I had wondered where the ridges on the tops of my two '78's came from and now I know...very cool! |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | There you go. They are all laid the same direction. |
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Location: Indiana | Excellent post by Beal there.
I've had my 1681 for 26 years and never knew what caused those lines in lower bout's.
Thanks for digging that up Mike. |
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June 2005
Posts: 489
Location: California | Dave- I Ment to asked the bumps on the top on my recent email and I was wondering about the bumps on the 1587 that I own now. This guitar really sings.
thanks for the explanation
Hector |
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Location: closely held secret | Certainly explains the superior sound of the textured tops over the 1597's. |
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Posts: 8307
Location: Tennessee | OK. Great information Thanks. BUT ... so where and how do the cross-weave (CVT) and new woven tops (NWT) come into play? Are they the same as always and just marketing hype or are they different? |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | They are different than the unidirectional. I think the NWT tops like the 2080 are made by a company in Springfield |
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Location: Sydney, Australia | Wow, learning all the time. So Ovation never actually made their own carbon fibre? How did they make the Q then? |
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May 2008
Posts: 4996
Location: Phoenix AZ | The Adamas tops were never competely made within the Ovation factory in New Hartford. They had to use some processing equipment at the Kopter factory (who probably know a thing or two about CF). Then later they farmed it all out to an OEM. I don't know exactly the history but at some point they switched again and in the early 2000's I was shown a sample top from the "new adamas top supplier" who if I recall correctly is in Springfield. All the pieces of the Q were farmed out, maybe to the same new shop. But with the growth and popularity of CF there are numerous manufacurers who will build any size, shape, design you can imagine. |
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Location: Sydney, Australia | Thanks. That explains why the Q was so freakishly expensive compared to the Rainsong and CA guitars. |
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November 2004
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| My ute has, uniquely, a smooth top and bumpy interior. Is it possible that being non-cutaway that occasionally the braces get glued on the wrong side and then the guitar is assembled "inside out"? With the inspection hatch off mine sounds better through there than through the epis. |
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Posts: 381
Location: Miami | The bumps make all the difference. There is a distinct what I call "tubular" effect that happens when you have the smooth side out, or for that matter, have a glossy top O or A. It is a markedly different sound than the textured tops. Which one is better is obviously a matter of personal opinion (mine being textured all the way). |
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Posts: 4996
Location: Phoenix AZ | Originally posted by schroeder:
My ute has, uniquely, a smooth top and bumpy interior. Is it possible that being non-cutaway that occasionally the braces get glued on the wrong side and then the guitar is assembled "inside out"? With the inspection hatch off mine sounds better through there than through the epis. Schroeder, that's very possible. I know somebody was inquiring about a custom build and wanted it "inside out" because he wanted acoutic only and was going to install one of those little condensor mics (Fishman Eclipse Blend) inside the guitar. She he wanted the "good" side inwards. |
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March 2005
Posts: 5563
Location: Blue Ridge Mountains | I don't know if its the NWT top on my OFC II - 2080 BB, but along with the HL Fiber Bowl and the scalloped bracing it produces the most incredible, smooth, balanced, and sustaining sound I have heard out of an Adamas...My early '78's (particularly #119) have these same qualities but in different ways with a different result. Whatever it is, it's all very good! |
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Adamas Tops