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Location: Ottawa, Canada | I've been looking at one of the original 1537's. While digging for info I came across this Ovation internal memo. Clearly there were no corners cut on these guitars! I love finding stuff like this!
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Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | Great guitars and selling for a bargain in the $800 range when you can find one. |
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Location: Colorado Rocky Mountains | O.k., let's have it. How do you find this stuff? Where are you digging? What's your connection? |
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| TJ Rickard (son of the J Rickard in the memo above) posted many of these historical internal memos on his OFC Ning page . There's some fascinating reading in there.
$800 is about right, given the depressed prices of all guitars these days. I paid a little more than that for mine 3 years ago. Probably wouldn't pay much more than that now, even for a dead mint one. |
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Location: NJ | unfortunately there are some good deals out there. |
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| I was browsing thru TJR's amazing trove of historical documents and came across this:
Has anyone ever seen a 1337 (acoustic only 1537)? I bet that would be an absolute killer guitar without the electronics' typical muffling of acoustic tone and volume. Now that would be something I'd consider paying some serious cash for... |
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Location: SoCal | Didn't Fred have one? |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | Originally posted by alpep:
unfortunately there are some good deals out there. Yeah you're not kidding. In the under $1000. market the 1537 is one of the better deals. |
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Location: Orange County, California | Bruce has it (AFAIK). It is a "Martin Killer", and unusual to boot. The deal went bad and I kept my Koa (the very pretty one), but that 1337 (labeled 1537) would have been the first one I kept.
;{ |
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Location: SoCal | I've said it before, but my 1537 is the one guitar I own that consistantly gets compliments on the looks and sound, and yeah, I'll play it next to almost any Martin..... |
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Location: Tennessee | So, that list in G8r's post is for the Moosup plant?
"Quality is of the utmost importance when grading and sanding the tops". Well, that certainly is the case with the one I got. For what it's worth, mine is not for sale but if it was, I'd expect $1200 for it, not $800. |
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| Don't get me wrong, Bobbo. I wouldn't part with mine for $800 either. It'll be in my estate. It's just that with this buyer's market we're in I wouldn't pay too much more than that for one now ;) |
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Location: Orlando, FL | Originally posted by G8r:
It's just that with this buyer's market we're in I wouldn't pay too much more than that for one now ;) Unfortunately, or fortunately, depending if you're buying or selling, if you can find one you don't have to.
I paid $900 or $950 for mine about 4 years ago, it's worth at least twice that much to me.
I've said it many times - you will never regret buying a 1537. |
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Location: GATLINBURG TENNESSEE :) | They are DEFINTELY worth a lot more than they sell for... but I think a lot of those "deals" come along with other minor issues that are unacceptable to people who are unaware of the quality of this model. I believe most informed members here would snatch a good condition 1537 up in a heartbeat for that $800 price tag. They don't stay for sale for very long. Then there are just those incredible deals that come up on occasion. (Like beal's 1547) |
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Location: Blue Ridge Mountains | List price in 1982-84 dollars was $1195 - $1295
Given that this is arguably one of the best Ovation guitars ever made, in today's dollars this would be very expensive...
A 1537 in mint condition is a bargain no matter the price...and worth every penny/pfennig/dollar/euro/ruble... |
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Location: Bluffton, SC | "in today's dollars this would be very expensive..."
SHOULD be very expensive. And I agree. However reality seems to have a difference with that. |
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| Supply and demand. Too often we forget the demand part. Is a pre-war D18 worth the mid-to-high 5 figures? Not to me, but certainly to others, and obviously to enough to justify (and get) that asking price.
"in today's dollars this would be very expensive..." Among the cognoscenti (most of whom are here) that's absolutely correct. Unfortunately for O'cultists (I coined that term about 4 years ago, BTW) the demand outside of a select group just isn't there. Anybody lucky enough to snag one under $1500 is getting a bargain. Those of us who paid less than that got absolute steals, given the amount of mojo and tone these all have. But outside of this group, there just isn't the demand, much less respect, for these guitars to command what they're "worth."
Those of us who've been here awhile often advise the newbies who ask what a particular Ovation is worth to look at the historical price list in the reference section. A pristine Ovation of any model typically commands the exact same numerical dollar figure today as what it sold for new, and 30 years of inflation be damned. Sure, there are exceptions (original slotheads, e.g.) but they're just that - exceptions.
Cold hard reality can be a bitch. |
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Location: Blue Ridge Mountains | Yes, unfortunately Ovation seems to bring up the rear in vintage guitar pricing...shame but true...but to the ones who really cherish their particular models, they are still a bargain...
If the factory was building 1537's today, they would undoubtedly be more than their cost 30 years ago, etc.
...ergo, the bargain...
Wow, g8r, impressive verbiage
Since it's considered obsolete Latin I had to look it up: here's the Webster's take...
co·gno·scen·te
noun
\ˌkän-yə-ˈshen-tē, ˌkäg-nə-, -ˈsen-plural co·gno·scen·ti\-tēDefinition of COGNOSCENTE
: a person who has expert knowledge in a subject : connoisseur
Examples of COGNOSCENTE
1.
2.
Origin of COGNOSCENTE
obsolete Italian (now conoscente), from cognoscente, adjective, wise, from Latin cognoscent-, cognoscens, present participle of cognoscere
First Known Use: 1776
Related to COGNOSCENTE
Synonyms: connoisseur, dilettante
Antonyms: amateur, inexpert, nonexpert
impressive none the less
NICE! |
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| Blame it on the nuns and then the Jesuits. Sometimes there are advantages to a Classical (and extremely rigorous) education. |
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Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | all this back and forth is fun reading but the bottom line is this:
In today's economy, a 1537 in excellent/mint condition is worth around $800.
Regardless of whether or not you wouldn't sell yours for less than $1500, try selling it and see if you get 1/2 that much.
Great guitar...one of the best woodtops but the inflated worth is in our minds only.
buyers market dictates $800 range. |
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Location: Tennessee | And there's too many of them around to command high prices. There is almost always one available in the usual markets, so that supply and demand thing plays a huge role. As Moody found out when he did his p.i. thing, there were a whole lot more of them made than anyone thought or guessed. Over a thousand.
No doubt the 1537 is a real nice guitar. I like mine a lot. But it's not priceless and could easily be replaced for about a grand. It's not like it's a 1955 D-28 or a wideneck Bone or even an early Adamas or a slothead. And while it sounds fine, to the rest of the world it's just another Ovation. Only the cognoscenti appreciate the upgrade wood binding and walnut fretboard. And that's about all there is to it from anything else in the line. Yup, reality bites. |
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Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | yup,
Bobbo as usual, you nailed it.
The Adamas line typically commands a $500-1000 premium over the woodtop Ovations.
The Adamas line as a whole is a rarer bird and has a distinctive sound that no woodtop can emulate.
A perfect example of reality and current Ovation worth.
The recently closed thread where somebody was asking to trade a Cole Clark guitar for an Adamas.
Not sure what happened (if he found his trade or just decided to keep the CC) but that would have been a really nice equitable trade.....assuming the CC was worth about $1500-2000 the Adamas would fall into that same range.
I am not sure that any Ovation model would be equitable except possible one of the "Book" models or a Mandocello or something along those lines.
just my 2 cents....and I think I am done. Nothing more to say.
Carry on.....I am enjoying the read! |
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| Originally posted by MusicMishka:
[QB] Yes, unfortunately Ovation seems to bring up the rear in vintage guitar pricing...shame but true...but to the ones who really cherish their particular models, they are still a bargain...
If the factory was building 1537's today, they would undoubtedly be more than their cost 30 years ago, etc.
...ergo, the bargain...
That's true of every O or A (barring the slotheads) made 30 years ago so what you say really has no meaning.
If a 1537 is worth $800-$900 then to get one for $500 is a bargain and to get one for $1500 isn't.
Simple fact. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | I've lost what the heck this thread is about.
Are we trying to speculate on the value of an older 1537? Not well respected outside the Ovation community, but among us definately one of the better guitars in the under a thousand range. What would it cost if they made it new today? No idea. But I bet they would sell about 10 of them. |
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Location: SoCal | This thread has convinced me to sell all my Ovations and Adamii and buy a Taylor. Crappy as it is, it will hold it's value.
Or maybe I should continue playing the guitars I like and not worry about monetary value...... |
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| Originally posted by Gallerinski:
I've lost what the heck this thread is about. Re-live the excitement of creating a masterpiece from an insider\'s perspective .
Then go call Al and buy one of the many Adamas he has in stock. After all, the numerical price of a new Adamas in 2010 dollars is only slightly more than the numerical price of a 1537 in 1983 dollars. And if you ask me, a new Adamas is a heckuva lot more guitar. You'll be supporting a co-founder of this forum, and you'll be supporting the fine craftspeople who are still in Connecticut making these great instruments. |
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Location: Tennessee | Originally posted by Gallerinski:
What would it cost if they made it new today? No idea. But I bet they would sell about 10 of them. I think that's the 2010 Collectors (or Limited or whatever they call it). Brand new street price is under two grand. They made 50. Nice guitar. |
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Location: Boise, Idaho | Part of the charm of the 1537 may be historical. I like to talk about mine by explaining the attempt at making a wood topped Adamas, the soundholes in the shoulders and the decision to call it the Elite line of Ovations, rather than a wood topped Adamas. If anyone is still awake, I like to show the wood binding and care that went into this guitar.
I've never had anyone stay awake long enough to get to Bobbo's point and compare it to the 2010 Collector hanging next to it. Huge similarities, but modern lightweight neck, contour back, inlaid epaulets (try that pre-computer) Adirondack spruce and multipiece binding. Last I knew, Al still had a couple at a very good price. In 30 years, maybe we'll be talking about the 2010 like we do the 1537, but only 50 of us will have them, rather than the thousands that have the 1537s. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | WOW. Good points about the 2010. Now I think about it, that almost IS the modern day 1537 and a stunningly good guitar it is !!!
G8R's comment about the Adamas is also spot on, but you're talking about a far different price point. Adamas is easily double the price/value of any 1537. Both nice guitars but certainly not in the same league. Just my opinion. |
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Location: Ballston Lake, N.Y. | Here\'s one. |
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Location: Bluffton, SC | That looks like a beauty but I haven't seen one go for that much in a while. Like G8r said though, for that you could get into a nice Adamas and, although I love my 1537, it's not an Adamas.
Hope he gets it though. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | That does look nice. But I would say the same, for that money I'd go for an adamas. |
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Location: SoCal | Originally posted by Weaser P:
although I love my 1537, it's not an Adamas.
Some would say that's not a bad thing. Sometimes my Adamas sounds good to me and sometimes I just wanna hear wood.... |
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| Originally posted by moody, p.i.:
Sometimes my Adamas sounds good to me and sometimes I just wanna hear wood.... Exactly. And that's why I have a few flavors of each. |
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Location: Bluffton, SC | Originally posted by moody, p.i.:
Originally posted by Weaser P:
although I love my 1537, it's not an Adamas.
Some would say that's not a bad thing. Sometimes my Adamas sounds good to me and sometimes I just wanna hear wood.... |
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1537 Interesting Ovation Document