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Joined:
June 2007
Posts: 100
Location: Delaware | Thought I'd make a new post with this. Recently bought a vintage Applause. Listing said both case and guitar were in "very good condition" and lots of photos showed everthing except areas of severe damage. Paid $200 including shipping. Here is link to video I put in youtube so that my luthier hobbyist tennis buddy friend can see it and offer his take on the guitar. I'll post the link here for all of you to see and ask the same questions - can it be restored or is a fat lady singing the blues over it? All damage shown was already present when seller listed the guitar - could not have happened during shipping because the guitar was well protected inside the case. The case is easy enough to repair I think with some careful work and contact cement. The guitar... I don't know. Your thoughts?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dw8yUNhhm00
I've bought plenty of gits on the bay over the past 10 yrs and this is my first misrepresentation and burn. |
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Joined:
November 2006
Posts: 3969
| That sucks. If the seller won't work with you, file a complaint with eBay, especially if you paid with PayPal.
I got burned once on a misrepresented guitar (a 1619). I documented all correspondence I had with the seller, the ad description, etc. and filed the complaint. Stick to facts, no personal attacks or histrionics. It took a bit, but eBay found in my favor and forced the seller to refund my purchase.
Good luck. |
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Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10777
Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Just file an item Significantly Not As Described claim... Do it Now.
File through eBay, even if the seller says he does not accept returns... Yeah, he will.
If you paid with PayPal you have 45 days, but do it now. |
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Joined:
September 2003
Posts: 9301
Location: south east Michigan | ouch... I think your best bet will be through PayPal intervention.
Good luck.
Looks like the guitar is toast compared to the cost it would take to make it right.
If it was a better model it might be worth the effort and money to fix but..... |
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Joined:
April 2003
Posts: 608
Location: Caribou, ME | What a mess.
Well, for what it's worth, if you prevail and get your money back and still want an AA-31 you will likely find one for a lot less money.
Glass half full, blessing in disguise, call it what you like.... |
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Joined:
May 2006
Posts: 4238
Location: Steeler Nation, Hudson Valley Contingent | Good luck Skip. Keep us posted. |
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Joined:
November 2002
Posts: 3665
Location: Pacific Northwest Inland Empire | As I observed elsewhere.......no prisoners. If the seller wants to salvage his reputation, for continued FleaBay commerce, he will have to make-it-right for you. That damage was certainly not (intentionally?!) depicted in the original auction photos. |
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Joined:
June 2007
Posts: 100
Location: Delaware | I replied to all this sympathy once but for some reason it never appeared. Good thing I wasn't looking for sympathy :) I was hoping you guys could suggest methods to repair this broken guitar - if there are any?
I could remove the top since its already got a good start. That would allow access inside the bowl to apply several coats of epoxy resin to the damaged area. After the resin cures I would wipe it with alcohol to remove the air inhibited layer (sticky residue) At that point the bowl should be pretty much as strong as original. Then I can clean the top edge and soundboard and reunite them. Can anyone suggest the type of glue or should I use more epoxy resin to bond the top to bowl back?
Ebay seller made a full refund and when I advised that they would have to cover the cost to return ship and that the guitar isn't worth even that cost - they told me to keep it so I would like to see if it can be repaired. If I get it back up and running I will refund some of the purchase price back to the seller by way of fair play but until I am certain the guitar is salvaged, I will hold my money.
Anyone agree or disagree with my plan of action on salvaging the guitar? The fretboard is still 100% bound to the top so I might try to repair the back without removing the top. To do that I would apply coats of epoxy resin with a brush to the damaged area and then try to reglue the bond where it is separated between top and back. |
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Joined:
November 2002
Posts: 3665
Location: Pacific Northwest Inland Empire | Yeah, Skip- I looked at the video. Chances are you can just reglue the top back onto the bowl. I can't tell how badly the bowl is fractured, but once you reglue the top, it will probably be fairly stable. Since nobody is likely to see it (cat's outta-the-bag now), you could apply a small patch of some fibrous material, on the inside of the bowl, to back up the crack. I patched a hole in the C2C4 bowl with some thermoplastic stuff that's used for making theatrical masks & artificial body moldings. A little contact cement, backfill with some 2-part epoxy, sand it out, shoot the area with some flat, black enamel (from about 3 feet away, so it "pebbles" a bit), then shoot a closer coat to kind of "seal" the texture coat.
So, the repair is definitely doable. I wouldn't attempt to remove the top- not worth the effort, and messes with the geometry of the instrument. Hopefully, the playing action is good, to begin with.
If you want opinions, this is probably the best place. |
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Joined:
November 2002
Posts: 3665
Location: Pacific Northwest Inland Empire | BTW, your response, "I replied to all this sympathy once but for some reason it never appeared" got stuck in this thread "Nylon string on the 'bay" |
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Joined:
October 2005
Posts: 4081
Location: Utah | IANAL (I Am Not A Luthier), but I do mess with my guitars in the basement...
I agree with seesquare about not removing the top.
To repair the bowl, if possible, I would put down a thin layer of epoxy resin, then a thin sheet of fiberglass pressed into the resin. Then when that dries apply another thin layer of resin. Too much mass may muffle the tone, but I don't think that this kind of patch would be a problem.
To reattach the top to the bowl, I would use some slow curing epoxy, like 15 minute not 3 minute epoxy.
Did the seller express remorse or was he irritated at getting caught? |
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Joined:
June 2007
Posts: 100
Location: Delaware | The seller did indeed express remorse and apologized many times. Seller refunded full purchase price including shipping and told me to keep the guitar because they did not want to spend more money to have it shipped back when it was worthless.
I made my crude repairs before finding these great responses and interesting I did pretty much what was suggested except I did not include the fiberglass patch - excellent idea! I will get some more 2 part epoxy and a piece of fiberglass patch and add that to the cracked area of the bowl - thanks very much. The cracked area is worse than it shows in the videos but I have it stabilized for the moment. The repair has held 3 days so far.
For now I have posted a 6 part video series in youtube showing the work so far. For convenience I put them into a single custom player which you can find at bottom right on the following page:
www.mytowntennis.com/guitar.htm |
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Ovation sting on the bay