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Location: Utah | I used to work for IBM back in the 80's. I used to write assembly code for the 8088 and 80286 processors in our lab. As an employee we had access to secret hardware tricks to speed up or expand our computers. Yes, I've got a long history with and good understanding of the IBM PC. But MS piled the last straw on with SP3 this week, taking out the family desktop.
So, what won't an Apple desktop computer do? We run Quicken for our finances, plus use the web extensively for online financial stuff and fun websurfing. We use the computer for music syncing to Sprint MP3 capable cell phones, plus some iPods (and boy do I hate iTunes on the PC). We do some wordprocessing and spreadsheets. All normal stuff. Also I do some recording, though most is done on an old laptop these days.
The desktop family computer is the central point of our home network, with the dsl modem, printer, and wifi hub connected to it. This is the function that most concerns me with migrating to Apple. Will the Apple take on this role and be compatible with PCs on the network?
My employer's intranet is not Apple compatible. We do a buttload on the computer from home, such as computer based recurrent training, schedule bidding, schedule management, updating important info, downloading tax forms, etc. Is there a workaround to be able to emulate or use Internet Explorer? (the company site isn't even Firefox compatible!) Not being able to access work on the family computer is to me possibly a deal breaker. |
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Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands | I bet your employer's computer would let you use chrome. check out google's new browser. |
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Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | Internet Explore works on Mac. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | Great question. I went through this same transition about 6 weeks ago. Dumped a lifetime of PC experience and bought an iMac. The best freaking thing I ever did ...
Now, does Mac do everything better than a PC? NO. There is a reason they have 3% market share. But for me I looked at the main things I needed a home computer for: web design and websurfing, on-line banking, itunes, digital recording and editing, photo editing, word processing, spreadsheets, etc. and the Mac was a perfect solution. I would never go back.
Specifically your home network. Your results may very, but I had an existing home network of 3 PCs and a shared printer. I plugged in the Mac and it said "there's a network do you want to connect?" yes "there's a printer do you want to print?" yes. It was that simple.
I plugged in my digital camera - worked with no screwing around. I plugged in a USB midi interface - worked with no issues. I even took a standlone USB drive completely loaded with a backup from my old PC, I plugged it into the Mac and boom, everything was available with no dicking around what so ever. I loaded some new apps like Logic, Photoshop and Dreamweaver. It all worked really slick.
Now there were some small hurdles, but easily overcome - my old web designer FrontPage was not compatible, needed to get and learn Dreamweaver. It's a somewhat steep curve. Old Photoshop was not compatible (hacked version), so I needed Photoshop CS for Mac. No problem. I needed a new FTP program - I got Transmit, VERY nice. And a few other small apps that could be used directly from their previous PC versions. I also bought Logic Express 8, which is a very DAW program.
Things are different, no arguement here. You need to learn different shortcut keys, etc. I still confuse Ctrl and Option, but it's gettiung easier. The Mighty Mouse is also very easy to get used to. But the whole environment is somewhat different and you need to have an open mind. Not better, not worse, just different.
The Safari browzer is very nice. I never think twice about it, it just works. There's other browzers as well. Hell you could run bootcamp and run Windows if you wanted to! I do all my online banking from the Mac with no issues. I don't know about Quicken and all that stuff. The biggest compatibility issue I ran into was my DAW (switched form Sonar to Logic), Photoshop (switched form PS7 to PSCS), and Web Design (switched form FrontPage to Dreamweaver). I still need to replace my database (Access) and will probably go with Filemaker.
The only thing to beware of, depending on your level of use and expectation, is that all the "Goodies" that they advertise you get free like iWorks, iPhoto, iWeb, Garageband etc. are somewhat limited. For example GB can't trigger external midi. i-Web can't build tables. The iWorks programs are actually OK, they do a nice job of reading in all Office files. But they do not output in a format that you can take back INTO Office on a PC. Or at least I have not figgered it out yet.
An unexpected bonus is the community of Mac users. I can not tell you how many people have gone out of their way to help me and the various online support forums are great. It's sort of the "Ovation" underdog attitude. I've posted here before that Ovation is sort of like the Mac of the guitar world. Different but in a lot of ways that are important to the average user, BETTER.
I'm not bashing PC's and don't believe for a moment that Mac is the solution to everything. But for ME, it's perfect. I'd be surprised if you didn't experience similar results.
Good luck, Dave |
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Location: NJ | y'don't do anything in AutCAD, do ya'?? . . . |
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Location: Central Massachusetts | These days, you can do pretty much anything on a Mac that you can do on a PC. Some things are easier. Maybe a few things harder. A Mac should be fully compatible with any network and printer resources you have. They can participate in Windows file sharing, etc.
Like Jeff said, there is a native Internet Explorer for the Mac, if you must.
If you absolutely must run something that is Windows-only, you can run something like VMware Fusion and install Windows into a virtual machine. Sounds complicated but it's really not, and you can do pretty much anything in a virtual machine that you could on a stand-alone Windows box. The only caveat is, make sure to put lots of memory into your Mac if you plan on going that route. And don't buy the memory from Apple (too $$$$)! |
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Location: Las Vegas, NV | Or play games on the PC? |
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Location: closely held secret | Originally posted by dvd:
If you absolutely must run something that is Windows-only, you can run something like VMware Fusion and install Windows into a virtual machine. Sounds complicated but it's really not, and you can do pretty much anything in a virtual machine that you could on a stand-alone Windows box. Unless, that is, it involves something pretty much Windows specific, like .net. Then YMMV. |
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Location: Rego Park, NY, | I'm on the verge of getting an apple also. Our main laptop computer at home is having an annually recurring problem. it thinks that if it is on that all I want to see is a blank screen. The online computer techs can see my screen but I can't. It's a problem with the video card and the driver. I have had the video card replaced 3 times in the last 3 years. I also sent the computer to their repair DEPOT 3 times and they told me that everything is fine.
The video card was replaced right after receiving the computer back from their DEPOT. During the last 3 years I was told by the company tech's that I had to reformat my hard drive twice only to find out that my hard drive was not the problem. I even told the techs this time that I know exactly what the problem is. Their solution was to send me a new blank hard drive.
Okay so I downloaded windows, series of chipsets. Download the video driver on their new drive and guess what Blank screen!!. I can only use my computer while running the windows video driver and the picture is wavy. I got so pissed at them last night I told them that the S in the model number stands for Sh@T. Am I being good in not mentioning the computer company's name? I don't want to be responsible for shutting down this thread.
All I really need the computer for besides this forum is for e-mails, surfing, photos(DUH)and video editing. |
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Location: Central Massachusetts | And running a Mac is the best way to draw Waskel into a conversation, so beware! :)
Waskel, Windows bits are Windows bits. They work the same in VMware Fusion as they do standalone. I think the 3D graphics drivers are about the only area where VMware comes up a bit short.
But you're right about the YMMV. I've had a Windows virtual machine on my Mac for a while now. The only time I use it is to boot every month or two and catch up on the updates. Not sure why I bother anymore, as I've had zero need for it. ;) |
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Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | Ah... Yeah! But can you get an Apple new-in-box with 200GB HD and a digital monitor for $302? :D |
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Location: Central Massachusetts | nope. unless you count the iPhone! ;) |
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Location: Boise, Idaho | FlySig, don't you have a teenage kid? Why are you asking the Old Farts Club? Your kid will know all the answers. Both my kids went with Macs, although we still have PCs at home. |
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Location: Utah | Mark, my eldest tells me that many/most of her college friends have traded in their laptops for iBooks or whatever the Apple laptop is called. Microsoft Vista has been a big disaster and driven away tons of customers from the PC world. I see many high-schoolers with Apple laptops these days, too. |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | If you are doing email, internet, some word processing etc... basic stuff like 90% of the world does.. MAC vs Windows vs Linux... who cares.. they all do it well with each having a strong point or two.
It's only when you get into high-end graphics, audio, CAD etc.. that there is a difference that can actually be measured, and that has more to do with supporting hardware and software than the computer itself.
MAC is getting better at playing with others. I take issue with "My employer's intranet is not Apple compatible"... the reality is the "Apple" part that's not compatible, but that's a different story. As I said, they are getting better, much better.
There are some minor quirks with such has how email and email attachments and graphics within emails are handled. Once you figure out what to do so everyone can read your emails, it ceases to be an issue.
So bottom line... get what you can afford that does what you need and don't pay so much attention to what logo is on the box. |
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Location: Las Vegas, NV | I think you see many college and high school kids with Apples, as this is a residual from the big push Apple was making in the education circles (and maybe they still are). Nothing against Apples (I owned an Apple II+, back in the day), but most kids are in shock when they get out into the 'real' world (getting a job), and almost everyone is still using PCs. For better or worse, that's how it is. |
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Location: Glendale, AZ | In place of Photoshop, you might try GIMP. It is UNIX based and free. It will most things Photoshop will.
You should not have any network issues with the Mac. Its just a matter of finding the controls you need to do things.
Games are the big issue. I play a lot of on line games, like City of Heroes and World of Warcraft. Those would be hard to give up. However, it is possible to run Windows on the Mac for those times when you absolutly need to. I have thought of getting a Mac many times. So far, it has just been the cost that has kept me away. I can build a PC from parts, but a Mac, you have to buy from Apple.
Devin |
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Location: Utah | This has been my wallpaper for a few weeks. Perhaps MS sent a killer update as retribution!
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Location: Phoenix AZ | Mac vs. PC is no different than Ovation vs. Martin or Taylor vs. Collings or whatever. There's different choices just buy the one that's best for your needs. Dave |
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Location: SoCal | What won't an Apple do? It won't sit on my desk.... |
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Location: NJ | It would if y'moved all of that Glen Campbell paraphernalia (and the StarTrek crap) . . . |
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Location: Vermont USA | Easy on the Star Trek stuff Paul might vaporize you with his phaser. |
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Location: SoCal | Scotty, aim phasers at New Jersey and fire!
Scotty???
I've tried to like Apple computers. I even got one for my wife for Xmas and she loves it. But every time I've sat down and played with it, it just drives me nuts. I guess it's just not that important to me to learn a new system when the old one works fairly well (with the exception of recording, and I think I've got an answer to that)... |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | Originally posted by moody, p.i.:
it's just not that important to me to learn a new system when the old one works fairly well (with the exception of recording, and I think I've got an answer to that)... ... he's gonna lip-synch. |
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Location: Wichita, KS | Phil Wong wrote:
All I really need the computer for besides this forum is for e-mails, surfing, photos(DUH)and video editing.
Phil, a Mac will do all you need. You can use iPhoto to organize your photos. iMovie and iDVD will give you the video tools you need and they come bundled with the system. And the best part about Macs is that they just work. No applications just shutting down because they encounter "an unexpected problem". No worries about spyware, adware, and viruses.
I do the same stuff you do. In addition, I use Peak for audio editing, Photoshop for image manipulation, and Toast for burning CDs. I paid a premium for Microsoft Office, but last year dumped it and bought a family license for iWorks.
All of my family are Mac users. My daughter is a 6th grade teacher. She used a Windows laptop through college. As soon as she graduated, she replaced it with a Mac and has never looked back.
I use a PC at work because I have to (I write software for a living). I use a Mac at home because it works the way computers should work. |
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Location: Sydney, Australia | I've used Macs exclusively at home for about 18 years. During that time, every workplace I've worked in had PCs, so I'm familiar with them. Knowing both systems, it just seems easier and simpler to get things done on a Mac. The biggest problems I have on my Mac usually relate to a badly written piece of software by some company. The things that work best (generally) are those where Apple writes the software and designs the hardware. |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | I've used PC's exclusively at home for about 18+ years. During that time, every workplace I've worked in had PCs, so I'm familiar with them. Knowing both systems, it just seems easier and simpler to get things done on a PC. The biggest problems I have on my PC usually relate to a badly written piece of software by some company. The things that work best (generally) are those where Microsoft Certified companies write the software and design the hardware. |
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Location: Sydney, Australia | You havin' a lend o' me? |
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Location: Jet City | I'll just stay out of this one.
We should add Mac vs PC to the list of unmentionables here.
No:
Politics
Religion
Mac vs PC debates |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | I would add boxers vs. briefs to that list ... |
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Location: Cicero, NY | So commando is acceptable?
I love this place. |
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Location: Campbell River, British Columbia | Gonch is for pussys!  |
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Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | Weazy....too much info. |
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Location: Cicero, NY | ...sorry... :rolleyes: |
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Location: Sunshine State, Australia | Macs are easier to navigate. That's just my opinion.
Most things you do on a PC you can do on a Mac. That's just my opinion.
If you have a PC specific program, you can still use a Mac. Apple has software that enables you to install and run Windoze natively. In other words, your mac boots up and runs Windoze pretty much like a PC. My expertise, if you can call it that, runs out at the PCI hardware stuff. Desktop Macs have PCI slots, but you're talking serious money now.
The ONLY program that I need windoze for is AutoCad. For EVERYTHING else, I use OSX.
Like Dave sez, not better, but different. (For me personally, Macs are MUCH better. Rememembering that opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.) That's just my opinion.
In a nutshell, Macs can run Windoze, Linux AND OSX. A PC can run Windoze and Linux. That's not my opinion, that one's a fact.
Some folks are diehard PC users, some folks are diehard Ovation players.
I play Ovations and use Macs. Kind of goes hand-in-hand.
Richard, he's not having a shot at you, he's just replaced all your instances of "Mac" with "PC" and on the whole, he's right (Except for the bit about stuff written by Micro$oft being reliable. |
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Location: closely held secret | So, apparently someone felt there was windows software worth the trouble to make a Mac capable of running it, but no one seems to care whether Mac software runs on anything else. |
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Location: Sunshine State, Australia | Yup!
So?
(See FlySig? Diehards! :rolleyes: )
BTW, one weak point that I'd like to point out to you about a Mac is the Safari browser. If I have any complaints about Mac, it's easily overcome by installing FireFox. But that's just my opinion. |
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Location: Central Massachusetts | Originally posted by The Wabbit Formerly Known As Waskel:
So, apparently someone felt there was windows software worth the trouble to make a Mac capable of running it, but no one seems to care whether Mac software runs on anything else. I suspect the OSx86 project folks would disagree with you there, John. And the Psystar folks. All of the commercial players are respecting Apple's "only on Apple hardware" license restrictions. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | It's a pointless discussion. Some people like Macs and some like PCs and that's just fine. For every arguement you can find a counter arguement. I know what I like and that's all that matters to me. We all have different needs and different levels of tolerance and expectation. Pick what works best for you. I'm glad I did.
Dave |
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Location: Central Massachusetts | Dave, yours should be the final word on the subject. You're right. Except you left out Linux. :D Just kidding! |
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Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | I'm running on an Atari ST. |
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| I love my MacBook.
I love my utes.
They all remind me of each other. |
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Location: closely held secret | Truth be told, (and I have pointed this out before, Muzz) I'm not a diehard windows fan. I've used windows because of the huge software base out there (much of it free), and the fact that when I need a new machine I can build one that's more than adequate for my needs for not so much $$.
Mac Pro, iMac, MacBook, whatever... they're expensive. And sorry... they break, too. And they need to be upgraded/replaced as well, just like PC's. It's the nature of the beast.
Micro$oft's days are numbered. Vista is an unspoken disaster. The many flavors of linux, with very windows/mac-like desktops are proliferating. Open-source software is becoming more dependable and abundant.
All my reasons for using windows are slowly disappearing. And that's just fine with me. Maybe I'll switch to Ubuntu and run Virtual Box (also free!).
I have nothing against Macs. In fact, watching discussions about them is kind of fun, in that it brings out the same passionate hostility that a good Taylor thread can stir up. |
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Location: Vermont USA | I like Red Delicious better than Macs but if all they have at the store are macs then they will do just fine.
Pauly
I was just feeling left out :( |
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Location: Rego Park, NY, | Group hug for Paulcc1 !! |
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Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands | I agree on the Vista front, I'll just plod along with windows xp, but eventually I'll need a new 'puter, and if vista isn't cleaned up by then I'll be in Mac Land. For now, XP's working fine for me. As is chrome. three days now! |
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Location: NJ | I was happy with NT. |
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Location: NW Washington State | Macs vs. Windows is a pointless argument. Windows (even Vista) isn't that bad and Macs aren't all that great. If you're a typical home user, buy whatever you like.
"Not being able to access work on the family computer is to me possibly a deal breaker." It's possible that the business system depends on some Windows/PC software or hardware that won't run on a Mac and can't be emulated. Having the right network protocols and browser might not be enough. Make sure someone else has a Mac running on the system before you buy. Or make sure there's a good return policy.
A Mac set up to dual-boot with XP might be a workaround.
Another option is to buy a Mac for general home use and an inexpensive Windows notebook for your work. Best Buy had a Compaq with 2GB memory for $379 in last Sunday's ad.
-Steve W. |
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Location: Phoenix AZ | Originally posted by numbfingers:
"Not being able to access work on the family computer is to me possibly a deal breaker." You guys got your priorities all wrong. Not being able to access work from your home computer is EXACTLY what you want. Those bastards own you from 9-5, but they don't own your soul. "Hey Dave, can you polish up this presentation tonight and rerun last quarters numbers for me." Ooops, sorry boss no-can-do. I use a MAC !!!
Actually Office runs slicker than a greased dildo through a cheerleading camp, cuz Mac is the platform it was originally designed for. The only issue I have is that I can't access SAP from home. But you know what? I'LL GET TO IT IN THE MORNING !!!
Having a Mac for all your music, photo, video, internet, and general home computing and have a cheap PC for work isn't a bad idea. |
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Location: Utah | I was happy with DOS! In fact, I did a lot of programming on DOS before windows even existed, and when windows first came out it was only good as a way to bring a computer to it's knees. Even Win3.1 was simply a DOS application that used up resources, but computers were gaining enough power to mostly get by.
When my wife was in grad school I did some programming on an AppleII and even sold some of it to researchers. I still preferred DOS, though.
My only gripe with Apple recently has been my brother in law, who is a general snob about everything, and who is a big snob about Apple.
But now windows SP3 has hobbled my wife's work computer (she was travelling and didn't talk to me before she clicked on intsall). Vista runs at a snail's pace on the daughter's laptop she needs for college.
We have come full circle to where Microsoft Windows is only good for bringing a computer to it's knees. They really screwed the pooch with Vista, and now with XP SP3. Three of the family's computers are no longer able to meet our needs. I don't care who's name is on the label, it just isn't acceptable. So the competition will get our business. |
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Location: NJ | My older brother Dave used to design integrated-circuits for the avionics division of Singer-Kearfott.
When AppleII's first came out, his office bought one for research purposes.
First thing he did was bring it home, rip it apart, and throw the mother-board onto a Xerox machine. From the xerox, he re-created the artwork for the pc-board and farmed-out the production for a bunch of them. He then procured all of the components and built/sold his own pirated "clones". Hardest part was getting the ROM chips from Apple. Somehow, he "got around" that, I don't remember how.
Called 'em "Worms" (Apple . . worm . . get it??). Somewhere in one of my old portfolios is the original acetate of the logo I designed for him (a worm wearing a pair of "studious"-looking eyeglasses) - logo was even screen-printed onto the pc-board.
Everything was assembled into a home-made wooden "cabinet" with a smoked plexi top (so you could see the "works" inside.
They were pretty cool.
Sold quite a few of 'em, as I recall . . . |
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Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | Cool story Cliff.
If you come across it, I would love to see the logo you designed. |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | We are definitely on the bleeding edge of change in the computer world. "Appliances" are becoming more and more relevant.
Not sure how many have seen RedFly but for 99% of what I do, my smartphone works just fine. I read and manage the forums I need to, do email, appointments, etc. The only reason I brought a laptop on my last trip was to act as a bigger keyboard and monitor in the hotel room where is sat the whole week. If I had a RedFly I would not have even brought it.
Although this thread is somewhat not about guitars, and everyone is behaving, I think it's one of the few PC vs MAC vs Linux etc.. conversations thats a good read. People just expressing what they prefer, what works for them.
When it comes to recording, the vote is still out.
While many still "think" MAC rules the studio, if you attend the NAMM convention, visit the software building, you can see it's NOT that black'n white.
I was also surprised that many in the Movie industry feel their hands are somewhat tied to MAC, but Linux is making HUGE in-roads do to overall cost, performance and reliability. |
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Location: Jet City | It's not so much the platform for the movie folks but the software.
All non-linear video editing software sucks to a point, but Final Cut sucks the least. If it were made for a PC, they'd just buy the software and put int on PCs I'm sure.
Damon (Former Apple Pro Video VAR) |
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Location: closely held secret | Originally posted by Damon67:
All non-linear video editing software sucks to a point, but Final Cut sucks the least. Don't you mean, "All non-linear video editing software written for Macs sucks to a point, but Final Cut sucks the least."?
Originally posted by Damon67:
If it were made for a PC, they'd just buy the software and put it on PCs I'm sure. No, because they would already be using Vegas. Which doesn't suck. |
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Location: big island | john,
your pm mailbox is full.
which version of vegas are you using? i've not used vegas before but am considering 8.0 pro. |
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Location: closely held secret | I'll have to clean out my mailbox.
I'm on 7 Pro, but looking seriously at upgrading to 8.
Besides the video side, which is excellent and intuitive, the audio side has served me well for mixing and mastering. |
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Location: big island | thanks, john. |
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August 2008
Posts: 12
Location: Greencastle, IN | I've been using Macs for 30+ years. I have never had a virus. I have NEVER had any hardware failure on a Mac. They are bullet proof. That's why they cost so much. The fact is they are built better. I have had my 17' Mac Book Pro for 2 years now and love it. You can load Windows on the Mac and it will run any PC software you want to run. It has an Intel dual processor. There is no need to choose between OSX or Windows because The Mac will run both. I have Windows XP on my Mac in case. I don't use it but it is there. Did I mention that MACS just don't get viruses. And what do PC users mean "My PC locked up". I don't know what that means. I has never happened. It is easy to upgrade hardware and software. Connecting bluetooth devices is a breeze. Macs are expensive but like a Lexus....worth it! No problems..no way. The PC operating system is getting more user friendly each year so it won't be long there won't be much difference. If a PC works for you use it and enjoy it. Give me my computer, a guitar or 2, my motorcycle, and a Hobie Cat and I can have a lot of fun for a long time. Enjoy life! |
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Joined:
November 2003
Posts: 11039
Location: Earth·SolarSystem·LocalInterstellarCloud·Local Bub | And that should be the end of this discussion...
Close thread. |
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Joined:
April 2004
Posts: 13303
Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | YAWN......... |
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Joined:
October 2005
Posts: 4061
Location: Utah | Originally posted by Hobie Dave:
Give me my computer, a guitar or 2, my motorcycle, and a Hobie Cat and I can have a lot of fun for a long time. Enjoy life! My list for enjoyment is guitars, guns, and girls. Dogs, beer and bbq rank up there, too. Computers are more of a necessary evil to me. 'Cept for the OFC of course! |
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Joined:
March 2007
Posts: 698
Location: Cork, Ireland | A Mac is the Ovation of computers.
-Big in the 80's (around here anyway)
-Looks different
-Costs more
-Rare on this side of the Atlantic
-Treated with suspicion by the un-initiated
-Has devotees who'd never touch anything else
I grew up on Macs but haven't used one in years |
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Joined:
July 2005
Posts: 3410
Location: GA USA | Plus, I've owned a couple that had round backs. |
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Joined:
May 2008
Posts: 4996
Location: Phoenix AZ | Originally posted by sycamore:
A Mac is the Ovation of computers.
Excellent observation |
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Joined:
March 2008
Posts: 119
Location: everywhere | except 99% of the worldd uses pc's because macs suck. ipod is ok but grow up hippies. |
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Joined:
December 2003
Posts: 1889
Location: Central Massachusetts | your data is stale. more like 92%. ;) |
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OT - What won't an Apple computer do?