AER Compact 60
dweezil
Posted 2008-10-23 2:55 PM (#15201)
Subject: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
Hi,

I'm looking for a good acoustic amp for practise and small gigs.

Was thinking of a AER Compact 60.

Any thoughts/suggestions?
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Weaser P
Posted 2008-10-23 3:00 PM (#15202 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Cicero, NY
The AER is supposed to be a good one but a couple of the guys here have mentioned the PJ aad cub 100 and, after looking that up, it seems to be getting great reviews. And it's half the price of the AER 60.
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-23 3:05 PM (#15203 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Ah! Cool, also was looking at the Roland AC90
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stephent28
Posted 2008-10-23 3:15 PM (#15204 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60



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Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066
AAD Cub....great sound from a small amp
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-23 3:24 PM (#15205 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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The AAD is certainly cheaper
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Damon67
Posted 2008-10-23 3:25 PM (#15206 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60



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Location: Jet City
I have an AC60 and it works great.
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-23 4:00 PM (#15207 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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You know what -- I think I'm being to give the Cub a try...
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BT717
Posted 2008-10-23 4:16 PM (#15208 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Vernon CT
Dweezil, I own a Fishman Loudbox 100 I know No one here say's much about them, BUT, I love Mine.
Compact, Under 25#s, 2 Channels with (1 XLR).Effects.Nice Acoustic Amp! Just one of many I'm sure will be suggested.
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-23 4:39 PM (#15209 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
Hmm...

Seems to be a toss up between a Roland AC60 and AAD Cub - both about £270
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an4340
Posted 2008-10-23 4:45 PM (#15210 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands
If i'm not mistaken, roland is a japanese company and AAD is from the UK. If there's a problem you'd at least you'd have a chance of speaking to mr. AAD.
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-23 4:59 PM (#15211 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
AAD is American.

Roland amp has 3 year warranty and Roland being a LARGE company with offices in the UK I would say if anything goes worng with it I'm more likely to get better servicing/support with Roland not AAD
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schroeder
Posted 2008-10-23 5:04 PM (#15212 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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I've heard the Roland plays better with coated strings.
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-23 5:06 PM (#15213 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
The advantage the Roland AC60 has is it has two channels so for my 1537 I can use a channel per output.

Plus it means I can have pickup going into one channel and mic the guitar into the other channel.

Cool. The Roland is winning.
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-23 5:06 PM (#15214 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Originally posted by schroeder:
I've heard the Roland plays better with coated strings.
Are you kidding?!?!?!?!?!

I'm a recent convert to Nanoweb Elixirs!
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schroeder
Posted 2008-10-23 5:11 PM (#15215 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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It's like shooting fish in a barrel................
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-23 5:14 PM (#15216 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
So have you tried one? I'm going have to take the 03C down town and check out one...
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-23 5:54 PM (#15217 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
Hmm but the AAD Cub seems to be highly regarded here trouble the only way to try one is to order one...
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ProfessorBB
Posted 2008-10-23 6:06 PM (#15218 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60



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Location: Colorado Rocky Mountains
Paul Templeman is a real believer of the AAD Cub and turned me onto them. For hauling gear to small venues, it simply can not be beat. It weighs 5.2 Kg/11.5 lbs, comes with its own padded carrying case, yet remains rated at 100 watts. It is built like a tank. I've added a tilt-back feature as well as a microphone stand receptacle to mine to enhance placement flexibility.
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Waskel
Posted 2008-10-23 6:44 PM (#15219 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60



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Location: closely held secret
I thought Paul was a member of the ADD club.
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Damon67
Posted 2008-10-23 7:10 PM (#15220 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60



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Location: Jet City
FWIW, the Roland comes in a padded case, has the tilt back feature built in and is light as well.

It has 2 channels you are correct.

It also is what I was singing through when I did the Ozzy vocals. I used it's built in echo and chorus to nail his voice.

Pretty versatile. Can't say it's better worse or the same as the Cub as I haven't used a Cub. I do know I use 2 channels quite often though.

I'm a big advocate of Roland and their products. I've always had good luck with them and with service if I needed it. Most all my electronic musical gadgets are Roland, Boss, or Edirol because of this.

Again, I don't know ADD as a company, but I've said in other forums that my favorite music brands to deal with are (in this order)

Ovation
Roland
Peavey

Never had a bad experience with any of them.

THis is all my opinion, which is worth considerably less than a share of WAMU stock.
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Weaser P
Posted 2008-10-23 7:42 PM (#15221 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Cicero, NY
And I just picked up a Genz Benz Shen Jr which is a great little amp too...
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Paul Templeman
Posted 2008-10-23 7:52 PM (#15222 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Scotland
Just over a year ago I was looking for an acoustic amp. My short list was the AER Compact 60 and the Roland AC90. I didn't even know the Acoustic Cub existed. Turns out a local store had all 3. I set all 3 with their masters up full, reverb and effects off (easy on the AAD, it as neither) and the EQ set flat. I Plugged in a Takamine off the store wall and used it's onboard EQ to get a sound. The AAD left the other 2 standing for sheer quality of sound, room coverage and headroom before distortion or feedback. It was also by far the lightest and least expensive of the 3

The AAD has no frills. No effects, reverb or feedback notches, just a gain control, 3 band EQ and a DI out. The input is switchable to ultra-high impedance so you can get a respectable sound from passive piezo pickups. The other trick up it's sleeve is the digital switching power supply. No bulky mains transformer, hence the light weight, and it'll work anywhere in the world, on any voltage, without the need for a voltage converter.

The other 2 are great amps, and if you need their extra features, then fine. I don't, I have plenty outboard gear. My ears told me that for my purposes this was the best of the 3, regardless of price.

And don't worry about it being a US product. The UK street price, for once, is about the same as the US dollar price, and they have UK distribution and warranty backup.

There's a reveiw of the AAD in this months Acoustic Guitar Magazine, here

AAD Cub reveiw
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moody, p.i.
Posted 2008-10-23 7:59 PM (#15223 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: SoCal
What's a "digital switching power supply"?
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Paul Templeman
Posted 2008-10-23 8:03 PM (#15224 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Scotland
It's an alternative to the huge coils of wire and stacks of metal that are the standard mains transformers found in instrument amplification, and apart from the speakers why they are so big and heavy. You know how you can use a laptop computer's mains adaptor anywhere in the world regardless of voltage? They've basically used the same technology.
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an4340
Posted 2008-10-23 10:42 PM (#15225 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands
I guess I am mistaken, AAD is American, but Phil Jones is English.
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an4340
Posted 2008-10-23 10:53 PM (#15226 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands
And I'm pretty it'd be hard to speak with Mr. Roland
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-24 3:49 AM (#15227 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
Thanks everyone. Very helpful. Its down to the AC60 and AAD Cub. That's a start but...

Hard to choose between the two. The AC60 has the effects plus the extra channel which is a major advantage but the cub is smaller, lighter and seems to have a better sound.

As I mainly want it for practise purposes the 2nd channel isn't sooooo important. But the effects is quite handy else I've have to get a small outboard effects unit (only want reverb, chorus, delay).

ARGH! Not an easy choice. Now there must be a ton of really small, decent effects units out there but thats a minefield in itself.

For those that own a cub: what's the bass handling like, it's got smaller speakers and a small cabinet, does it have a small sound?
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Paul Templeman
Posted 2008-10-24 4:14 AM (#15228 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Scotland
The trick is in the design. Phil Jones speciality is getting a huge sound from small speakers in compact enclosures. Hi bass gear is tiny too, and is renowned for it's sound.

Find a Boss AD5 and use that in front of the Cub.
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-24 4:49 AM (#15229 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
The CUB is designed for acoustic guitar no? Why do I need a Boss AD5 too just for the effects?
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Paul Templeman
Posted 2008-10-24 5:49 AM (#15230 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Scotland
The Cub has no effects whatsoever just 3 band EQ. The AD5 is an acoustic guitar processor that has piezo and mag inputs each with their own gain control, 4 band EQ, a feedback notch, microphone and body resonance modelling, digital reverb and digital chorus plus stereo balanced and unbalanced outputs. It's one of the best sounding acoustic processors/DI boxes on the market. It was discontinued some time ago, but they crop up occasionally on Ebay for not much money. I have one that I no longer use since I got the Bose T1 Effects Engine, but it's not going anywhere.
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-24 5:55 AM (#15231 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
still undecided!

i think the only thing to do is go down to GAK and try a Roland AC60 then order a CUB and see whats that like and sell on if i don't like.
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-24 10:35 AM (#15232 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
Cubs on it's way!

Will test drive a AC60 over the weekend.

The joy of distance buying is that I can send back within 7 days and get a full refund. Postage is going to be minimal as it's so light. Will report back.
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stephent28
Posted 2008-10-24 10:44 AM (#15233 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60



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Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066
Sound of the Cub is huge for it's size. Effects aside, I think the sound of the Cub is clearly superior to the AC60.

Glad your trying them both and it will be good to hear your review and which one you keep.
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-26 6:41 AM (#15234 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
Originally posted by Paul Templeman:
It was discontinued some time ago, but they crop up occasionally on Ebay for not much money.
What's a sensible amount to pay for one?

The thing is the Roland AC60 must have some sort of pre amp in build as it accepts a piezo pickup input. The AC60 and Cub are priced the same but if I have to add another £100 for the AD5 then it might sway my desicion. Are you suggesting the AD5 just for the effects and better EQ or for the plumped up sound it produces for Ovations?
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-26 7:01 AM (#15235 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
Also how do these compare to a GENZ BENZ SHENANDOAH
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Paul Templeman
Posted 2008-10-26 7:02 AM (#15236 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Scotland
All amps have preamps, the difference is that the Roland has reverb and chorus and a few other tricks while the Cub is basic, just 3-band EQ. The crucial aspect of any preamp designed for piezos is the input impedance, which needs to be ultra-high to work properly with passive pickups. But as all Ovations have an onboard preamp they'll produce a healthy signal into pretty much anything. The Cub has dual input impedance with a setting for active pickups, which can be switched to 4meg ohms for passive piezos.

I've seen AD5s go for as little as £40, but £80 is a reaonable price. They listed at around £240. The Cub will work fine by iteself, just depends if you must have reverb and chorus and the extra EQ
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-26 7:08 AM (#15237 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
Thank Paul,

so you're just suggesting the AD5 for the EQ and reverb/chorus? So any basic effects pedal will do then?

Reverb/chorus/delay is essential yes.
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Weaser P
Posted 2008-10-26 7:17 AM (#15238 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Posts: 5331

Location: Cicero, NY
Coincidentally, here\'s the recent Acoustic Guitar review of the Cub.
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-26 7:42 AM (#15239 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
Hmm,

now I'm thinking Zoom A2 --> Cub!

http://www.zoom.co.jp/english/products/a2/

Anyone tried one of these?
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FlySig
Posted 2008-10-26 10:30 AM (#15240 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60



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Location: Utah
Take a look at the Zoom A2.1U with the expression pedal. I've not tried one yet but it looks interesting and it gets rave reviews. It is on our short list for Xmas gifts this year.

FWIW, the Roland AC60 doesn't sound quite as natural as I would like. We auditioned a lot of different amps before buying a Crate 60w. It had the best most natural sound of all the ones we tried. (We didn't try a Genz Benz or CUB). Katie (the daughter's band partner) has the AC60 and we've been able to mess with it quite a bit. It is not nearly as loud as other amps of the same wattage, if that is important. She can play a restaurant at comfortable levels just fine. I don't think it would suffice for rocking the house Saturday night at the bar.

The sound is OK, just not as naturally acoustic as I would like. Maybe I need to fiddle with the eq more. It does have an input selector switch for piezo only guitars, so if you have something with no onboard preamp it is a good feature. There is a tilt-back stand built into the bottom, a nice feature. (the Crate 60w also has a tilt up feature). The size is perfect for us more seasoned folks, with a nice carry case. The DI out on the back is a handy feature, so you can use the amp as a personal monitor (and tilt it up), while still DIing into the house system. The amp has some nice features and effects. One channel has a dual XLR and 1/4" input with phantom power if you want it. The amp makes a super personal PA system with your guitar into one channel and your mic into the other.

The Crate 60W and the Roland AC60 are very comparable in all ways except for size and acoustic-ness. Of all the amps we tried, I would place these two at the top of the heap.
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ProfessorBB
Posted 2008-10-27 8:48 AM (#15241 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60



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Location: Colorado Rocky Mountains
Originally posted by dweezil:
Hmm, now I'm thinking Zoom A2 --> Cub!
Anyone tried one of these?
Yep. Been using this combo twice a week for the past year or thereabouts along with a few other pedals, but primarily the Zoom A2.1u.
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-27 10:49 AM (#15242 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
Yeah looking at the A2.1U it seems to do everything!

And can record direct to PC, now that is cool!

I really think this is the way to go. Sod the Roland and the AD5.
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ProfessorBB
Posted 2008-10-27 11:46 AM (#15243 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60



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Location: Colorado Rocky Mountains
Dweez, after playing with the A2 for a month or two, I spent one entire evening going through all the options and settings and created five presets in the A bank. Over the next six months, I added two more, and now use these seven presets 99% of the time along with the expression pedal to control volume. You'll probably find that this unit does way more than you'll need.
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-27 12:11 PM (#15244 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
Nice. Seems to be a better option than getting a AC60 and Boss AD5.

I like the option of emulating (though probably won't use that) just want the effects and option to record to PC. It's a cool unit and hoping to get one for half price 2nd hand on Ebay!
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Weaser P
Posted 2008-10-27 12:29 PM (#15245 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Cicero, NY
Dweez - lookee here
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-27 12:36 PM (#15246 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Indeed! Thanks...
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-30 7:35 AM (#15247 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
The Cub arrived today, not had a huge chance to play with it yet but briefly tried the Elite 5868 Walnut and 03 Collector and boy that thing does the business.

Great tone and plenty of power, amazing. The A2.1U is coming tomorrow then I'll have some real fun!
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Weaser P
Posted 2008-10-30 8:04 AM (#15248 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Cicero, NY
Very interested in the side by side analysis, dweezil - let us know what you think. And were you able to grab that pedal off the 'bay?
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ProfessorBB
Posted 2008-10-30 8:40 AM (#15249 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60



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Posts: 5881

Location: Colorado Rocky Mountains
Originally posted by dweezil:
Also how do these compare to a GENZ BENZ SHENANDOAH
Against the Shen Jr., darn well. The Jr. is a terrific amp for the money, with very nice effects for the acoustic player. It isn't quite as powerful as the Cub (although I don't need the power of either of them), weighs three times more than the Cub, and is bigger in every way. Over time, that weight and bulk will get to you. The Cub is more like a boutique amp that is built like a tank. I replaced the Jr. with the Cub as a powered monitor, but still use the Jr. at home.
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dweezil
Posted 2008-10-30 8:50 AM (#15250 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
probably won't be doing a A/B comparison with the Cub as I won't be trying the Roland.

The Roland is bigger and cannot have reverb and delay on at the same time!

Plus the A2.1U allows me to record direct to PC.

The CUB sound really terrific (despite the dry sound), so adding the effects from the A2.1U and I have a better combo than the AC60 and AD5.
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dweezil
Posted 2008-11-01 10:34 AM (#15251 - in reply to #15201)
Subject: Re: AER Compact 60


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Location: Brighty in Blighty
Damn that's a great combo.

Even SWMBO said it's sounds great (classically trained pianoist and celloist).

Will record a couple of new tunes tomorrow direct to disk.

Nice one people - thanks for your advice.
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