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February 2002
Posts: 1817
Location: Minden, Nebraska | Having just read a thread concerning an old Ovation aluminum neck developing a bow, I am reminded of my experience not too long ago with a RainSong WS1000. I found it for what I considered a price affordable for an experiment.
First, these are very pretty (imho) and nice sounding guitars with decent, but not special, electronics.
But the guitar arrived with a serious bow in the neck. That isn't supposed to be able to happen with these guitars (all composite materials). The seller swore he knew nothing about it. The factory said there shouldn't be a problem...
After several conversations with the factory service rep, two things were established: a) the guitar DID have a problem and I knew what I was talking about, and b) these necks are prone to these problems.
The factory rep told me that the guitar must have been exposed to heat, as that is what will cause one of their necks to bow. It wasn't specified how much heat, but the fact that nothing was melted on the guitar kinda tipped me off that it doesn't require open flame.... or anything very close in temperature.
The kicker came when I asked about shipping it back to the factory for repair. I was told that they would replace the guitar if I was the original owner, but that if I bought it used I was stuck BECAUSE they can't repair these necks and there is no truss rod.
I settled for having my tech do a selective fret dressing to compensate, and then I adjusted the bridge so that it would play as well as possible without strings choking up the neck. The guitar sold on eBay for much, much less than I paid for it. It was quite playable in the open position, but not suitable for my style.
My RainSong was bad music, leaving me singing the praises of these odd roundbacked guitars that are much better for the money and much more easily worked on. AND Ovation has a much more encouraging Customer Service rep. :) |
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December 2003
Posts: 13997
Location: Upper Left USA | Not everything "new" is an improvement. I am trying to hold off a current bout of G-A-S and wait until the combination of ANS necks, light bowl sizes and electronics are in place (holding out on the deep bowl as the last to come).
The product will be a wonderful and extremely servicable instrument. Tried and true engineering and Customer Support! |
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Joined:
March 2002
Posts: 1380
Location: Central Oregon | Composite material can definitely be bent with heat.
I think I've mentioned before that I fly control line stunt model airplanes competitively. The latest "thing" in stunt props are carbon fiber composite. The top dogs use these props in competition. Very thin, very light & very stiff. A small change in the pitch of a prop can make a *major* difference in how competitive stunter fly's, especially in the wind. Most of the guys using them repitch them using heat. Some dunk them in boiling water one blade at a time & repitch them one or two stations at a time, others use a heat gun. (There are gauges for measuring prop pitch from the hub to the tip.) Either way works. They will remain at the new pitch-unless they're re-heated. If they're put back in boiling water or heated with a heat gun & allowed to cool naturally they will return to their original pitch or at least very close to it. Maybe the same thing would happen to a composite neck if it was heated with a heat gun with the strings off & allowed to cool naturally, or, if that didn't work, it may be possible to heat & bow it back the other way & hold it until it cools. Just a thought.....
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Joined:
December 2003
Posts: 13997
Location: Upper Left USA | Hockey Sticks, Nils!
Made you look!
Hockey sticks and BMX Bike Wheels. The plastic street hockey blades could be custom arched in hot water or with dry hot air. The cure for a bent BMX wheel was put it in the oven at 150f and it would regain it's memory.
The question is how similar is the Painsong material. Where's a Paul when you need them? |
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January 2003
Posts: 1498
Location: San Bernardino, California | BTW the trunk of a black car can reach a tempature of 190 degrees. |
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April 2003
Posts: 2503
Location: Fayetteville, NC | I wondered why I kept Sweating so much during my last Trip! I guess that'll teach me not to ride in the trunk again! But I did Sweat off 20 Pounds! :D :D :D |
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November 2002
Posts: 3666
Location: Pacific Northwest Inland Empire | Logically, it should be a reversible process. I concur with Nils; I think the slow heat gun method would work. That way you aren't heating up the body, also. However, if the critical neck-set angle is awry; you have no choice. If this is too esoteric, take it to a good tech, or learn slide. Shipping to New Hartford might be a good investment. Or Ebay......& re-investment. |
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Joined:
December 2003
Posts: 13997
Location: Upper Left USA | In darker, less enlightened times they would put diamonds (adamai) to the flame as a test of trueness.
Caution: Beyond this point there be dragons! |
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Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 1817
Location: Minden, Nebraska | You guys scare me sometimes.... :eek: |
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Joined:
April 2003
Posts: 2503
Location: Fayetteville, NC | You aint seen nothin' yet! :D :D
Then again...maybe you have and that's what scares you! :eek: |
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Joined:
December 2003
Posts: 13997
Location: Upper Left USA | Isn't there a luthiery technique of bracing/blocking and steaming a detached neck to remove a warp? Thought I had seen it once. Heat in the right place was the key.
Again if Painsong said it couldn't be fixed it must be so. You can always make a lap steel guitar out of it. |
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Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 1817
Location: Minden, Nebraska | It wasn't bad enough to turn into a slide guitar. It just took a Stevie Ray Vaughn grip to play it up the neck. The string height specs were noticeably above factory spec, and the bow caused notes bent on the high strings around the 14th and 15th frets to choke. As I said, I had my tech shave those frets a bit to compensate and I lowered the saddle height to where it was modestly playable. It was fine on everything in the open position, but just got progressively worse up the neck. I sold it to a guy who only plays 'cowboy chords'.
Why are they called that, anyway? I was in a Western band a few years ago and we played some Gene Autrey and Sons of the Pioneers kind of stuff. Some of those songs used a lot of flatted diminished as well as augmented chords. It was hard work to play them clean and stay on key vocally. Especially in boots and a big hat. My pearly white '86 Collectors' made it easier (the consummate western guitar for those who don't want to lay down the cash for a big body Gibson). It matched my hat and my smile perfectly. |
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Joined:
March 2002
Posts: 1380
Location: Central Oregon | 'Cowboy Chords' & 'Cheater Bars' were meant for each other!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
(I already ducked under the desk Paul, I suggest you do the same!)
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Joined:
May 2004
Posts: 295
Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada | My experience with synthetics involved a fiberglass pool cue which, in theory, was not supposed to be prone to warping. It warped. I now use a Predator with a good old wood shaft. Sometimes traditional ways are better. |
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Joined:
August 2003
Posts: 2246
Location: Yucaipa, California | My pearly white '86 Collectors' made it easier (the consummate western guitar for those who don't want to lay down the cash for a big body Gibson). It matched my hat and my smile perfectly.
...white guitar, white hat AND white teeth! ... sigh... probably still has all his hair too! ...sigh... |
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Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 1817
Location: Minden, Nebraska | "...white guitar, white hat AND white teeth! ... sigh... probably still has all his hair too! ...sigh..."
Uh.... no. Thus the added value of the hat, which also served to protect bandmates and others from the blinding reflection of the stage lighting off of my bald spot. (The latter serves as my built in Yarmulke.) |
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My RainSong adventure