|
|
Joined:
May 2004
Posts: 2850
Location: Midland, MI | I've read/heard lots of complaints from guitar players who seem to hate playing the 'normal' F chord (barre E moved up one fret). Sometimes, though, depending on what I'm doing, I prefer to play F this way:
xx
______
||||oo
|||o||
||o|||
||||||
Now, I know it sounds slightly different than the 'standard' fingering (fewer strings, no barre, etc.) but it works for me. While I don't have any problem sounding the F chord (barre style) I find that this fingering is slightly easier (and if I'm moving around in C, playing mostly open/first position chords and melodies it's way easier than screwing with the finger-flop a barre seems to require). Interestingly enough, my teacher never showed me this fingering, I sort of found it on my own.
I'm wondering if instructors push students through the normal F chord for any particular reason? Do you play a variation of the F chord that you find easier than the normal fingering? Am I going to go blind if I keep playing F chords this way? :p |
|
| |
|
Joined:
May 2004
Posts: 76
Location: Kent, England | You can also place your thumb over the bass E string at the first fret and with the open A sounds OK, especially for quick changes.
Cheers
Terry |
|
| |
|
Joined:
January 2004
Posts: 648
Location: Florida | What ever floats yer boat. I was taught that fingering first, way before learning any barr'd chords
Going blind: Just do it till you need glasses. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
January 2002
Posts: 14127
Location: 6 String Ranch | Yes it's hard to do the F but once you get it everything else is easier. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
May 2002
Posts: 1445
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada | "You can also place your thumb over the bass E string at the first fret and with the open A sounds OK, especially for quick changes."
With a little pratice, you can extend the thumb to include the "A" string as well...which gives you a full barred "F" chord. I do this all the way up the neck for major chord positions and hardly ever use the bar position.
Wayne |
|
| |
|
Joined:
May 2004
Posts: 2850
Location: Midland, MI | Originally posted by Terr0r:
You can also place your thumb over the bass E string at the first fret and with the open A sounds OK, especially for quick changes.
Cheers
Terry
ACK! No!!! I know I can do the thumb thang, in fact that was one of my 'bad' habits. Not that it's really a bad habit...it's all a trade off, right? But, I've retrained myself to play with my thumb more towards the center of the neck (Oddly enough, I'm starting to think I'd like a slightly wider neck than what's on my O) and if I go back to the 'old' way, I'm going to fall back into some other bad habits. :)
I guess when I'm playing around in C, I find it easier to throw in the F with my alternate fingering, considering the fingering for Em, Am, Dm. The change from G or C to F demands I pay attention no matter which way I play it, though. I haven't found any good way to get to Bdim, though, from the other chords in C.
Which leads me into another train of thought...there is considerable overlap in the chords between the keys of C and G:
C: C Dm Em F G Am Bdim
G: G Am Bm C D Em F#dim
The G, C, D, Em and Am are duplicated...so, if I'm playing a line over chord changes including those five chords only, I suppose I can use the notes out of either scale, but then how do I know which key the song is in (for certain values of 'song', and I use the term loosely)? Or maybe I'm just being to analytical about the theoretical stuff and should just play notes and not worry about it...hey, that's it, I'll just play random notes and call it jazz!!! :D |
|
| |
|
Joined:
May 2004
Posts: 2850
Location: Midland, MI | Originally posted by CharlieB:
What ever floats yer boat. I was taught that fingering first, way before learning any barr'd chords
Going blind: Just do it till you need glasses.
You were taught that way first? Interesting. Sometimes I get frustrated because my instructor will be working on some song or another with me and start calling out chord changes...and I have no idea what the chord is! (well, how to play it) Then we have to stop while I finger it out. I guess I'm just supposed to learn all of the possible chord fingerings/positions on my own. :)
Going blind...uh, I already wear glasses/contacts. Have for the last 20 years or so. Guess I should stop doing it now. ;) |
|
| |
|
Joined:
August 2003
Posts: 2246
Location: Yucaipa, California | Cruster,
I also learned that chord formation, ...from the Big Mel Bay Chord Book.... but, because I normally 3-finger pick, I often use the Fmaj7 fingering as an easy F without the barre and just don't play the open high E string thus:
------
||||o|
|||o||
||o|||
||||||
I also do the same for Bm (without the barre):
------
||||||
||||||
||||o|
||oo||
This also is effective with other chord forms and can give very rich/interesting voicings.... try sliding the basic C fingering up two frets.... way cool D :cool: :cool: |
|
| |
|
Joined:
July 2004
Posts: 1
Location: Germany | @cruster
Hi,
I was tought to do the full barré but I played the "light" version. Even Bb was just xx0331 for some time.
The need for a better sound made me go for the barré chords.
Allthough: in some pickings I still play the small barré oder sth. like 50356x for F.
Greetings from Germany,
Jens |
|
| |
|
Joined:
December 2001
Posts: 10583
Location: NJ | it all depends on what sound you are looking for. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
November 2002
Posts: 1300
Location: Madison, Wisconsin | .... try sliding the basic C fingering up two frets....
Willin'/Lowell George |
|
| |
|
Joined:
March 2002
Posts: 15684
Location: SoCal | It's good to learn how to do it right first. Gives you more tools in your arsenal
Chet Atkins used to do an F chord both ways depending upon his need at the time.
Believe me, with practice, it all gets easier. Or at least that's what I'm told. I can change between my 3 chords now in under 5 seconds. I'm hoping to get faster and maybe add a 4th. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
May 2004
Posts: 2850
Location: Midland, MI | Originally posted by moody, p.i.:
It's good to learn how to do it right first. Gives you more tools in your arsenal
Chet Atkins used to do an F chord both ways depending upon his need at the time.
Believe me, with practice, it all gets easier. Or at least that's what I'm told. I can change between my 3 chords now in under 5 seconds. I'm hoping to get faster and maybe add a 4th.
I suppose 'right' would require a definition. :)
Actually, I have no problem playing the normal, barre F version, but I find the 'light' version (I like that nom de chord..hehe) is just easier to flip into other chords. Practice, practice, practice.
On adding chords, you know the old saying:
Whenever you hear Moody playing four chords, you're sure to find a fifth.
Errr...ummm... :eek:
|
|
| |
|
Joined:
March 2002
Posts: 15684
Location: SoCal | Badda Boom.
Old Espiscapalian joke about drinking. Anytime you find 4 Espiscapalians together you'll always find a fifth.
I bounce back and forth on how I do any barr chord on any part of the neck, depending on what my need is, where I'm going from there, and the sound I'm looking for. And sometimes, even when I'm "grabbing" the chord, with my thumb catching the bass strings, I'll leave strings open for the sound. A good example is the Righteous Bros, You've Lost That Lovin' Feeling. I play it in A and thru the openning section, I'll play up on the neck with the A and E strings open, but I'm playing the Em7 and A chords at the 7th and 5th fret. The open bass strings make the chords ring. Then it's on to a full barr for the Bm and C#m chords at the 7th and 9th frets and from there most of the rest of the song is played with barr chords for a procussive feel.
There's a place for everything, so learn as much as you can in as many different ways that you can.
By the way, all of the above is what I WOULD DO if I knew more than 3 chords. Which I don't. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
December 2003
Posts: 13997
Location: Upper Left USA | Yes to more practice, exposure and application. I the Rigging Trade there are several right ways to do something until you do it WRONG!
Learned to do an "A" as
||||||
|||321|
in lieu of the "Mel Bay"
||||||
|||123|
It worked for me as I was playing mostly Am, C and F and the chord change was smoover.
Do what needs to be done. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
June 2002
Posts: 1614
Location: Converse, Texas | WHat is the tab for Bdim and F#dim? |
|
| |
|
Joined:
August 2003
Posts: 2246
Location: Yucaipa, California | Hizzzzz,
Check this out:
Chord Creator |
|
| |
|
Joined:
September 2003
Posts: 9301
Location: south east Michigan | Chord Creator....
Neat site...I've added it to my list of favorites.
Thanks Tim.
Brad |
|
| |
|
Joined:
July 2003
Posts: 1922
Location: Canton (Detroit), MI | Another quick form of F I use sometimes is:
------ NUT
||||||
------ 1
||||||
------ 2
||||||
------ 3
||||||
------ 4
|||x|x
------ 5
||||x|
------ 6
Open "D" shape played at the 5th and 6th frets. Seems to work for me on some songs. Barre chords???? Not in this lifetime, with the fingers I messed up playing basketball in high school...
Roger |
|
| |
|
Joined:
August 2003
Posts: 2246
Location: Yucaipa, California | Brad, You're welcome...
Roger, Try the same thing with the D7 Shape as well as the Am and Dm Shapes.... |
|
| |
|
Joined:
April 2003
Posts: 2503
Location: Fayetteville, NC | Tim Great Site!! Thanks For Sharing. Guitar.com use to have one to. But I like This one better. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
July 2003
Posts: 1922
Location: Canton (Detroit), MI | Tim, I have already, thank you. I move chord shapes all over the fretboard and see what "works" and what doesn't. Sometimes they're a winner, sometimes not......
Roger |
|
| |
|
Joined:
March 2002
Posts: 1380
Location: Central Oregon | Originally posted by Tim Chapman:
Hizzzzz,
Check this out:
Chord Creator
Great site Tim, thanks!
/\/\/ |
|
| |
|
Joined:
June 2004
Posts: 365
Location: NC | Interesting enough..........my guitar teacher showed me the way you found, as the way to play the F-chord. Only way I know...... |
|
| |
|
Joined:
August 2002
Posts: 8307
Location: Tennessee | F chord ... put the capo on the third fret and play a D. :D
When I play the F like Cruster opened the thread with, I sometimes also finger the third fret of the 5th string to add a bass C. Rounds out the sound a bit. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
May 2004
Posts: 76
Location: Kent, England | ...then of course you could get really lazy and play the A chord with just the first finger barred across the three notes not playing the high E string (00111x).
It all depends on just how quickly you need to either get to or hold that chord for. Also it depends on whether you're playing accoustic or electric...or even power chords?
Terry |
|
| |
|
Joined:
May 2002
Posts: 3005
Location: Las Cruces, NM | A lot of bluegrass songs jump from G to F (mixolodian) so to play rythym and lead the F almost has to be played as cruster has shown as you play the G two frets up and jump from there without changing your hand position. If a lead is involved the thumb on the low E and the 4th finger on the D completes the fake bar (3d finger on the A)
Another country bluegrass trick is the G F D chord progression that Merle Haggard used a few times and always sounds good if done right.
For example i "Fireball Mail"
She's G gone F gone D gone, G the fireball Mail.
Bailey |
|
| |
|
Joined:
April 2004
Posts: 265
Location: Warrenton, Virginia | Tim
Thanks. Great chord site! |
|
| |
|
Joined:
September 2003
Posts: 782
Location: Waurika OK | I also do the "thumb thang" and make no apologies for so doing. Unless I missed someones notation, I do one thing different.
0|||00 thumb on E, index finger on B E
|||0|| middle finger
|00||| third finger on A, little finger on D
This gives the full, correct notes of a barre chord at any fret and it is easy to make the minor of any chord also.
0||000
||||||
|00|||
Woody, thought I was the only one that made A chord as you do! And for the same reason.
Also I play D:
xx|231
rather than:
xx|132
and for the same reason, chord changes seemed easier.
While I am throwing out trashy chords, might as well do this one.
B minor
xx|||0 index finger
______ second fret
xx||0| middle finger
______ third fret
xx00|| third finger on D little finger on G
______ fourth fret
move up one fret and you have Cminor and so on up the neck.
I know the real guitar players are gagging and throwing up by now so I will quit
noel
ps After I posterd this I discoveerd I had missed page two, so a lot of what I said had already been covered, sorry. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
April 2003
Posts: 2503
Location: Fayetteville, NC | That's a great lesson! The best part is it didn't cost a Red Cent!! The link to the website is still a great tool as well. |
|
| |
That F-ing chord thing